Published: April 2nd, 2012 at 12:37 pm ET
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Title: In light of further nuclear risks, economic growth should not be priority
Source: Mainichi
Author: By Takao Yamada, Expert Senior Writer
Date: April 2, 2012
Emphasis Added
[...] One of the biggest issues that we face is the possibility that the spent nuclear fuel pool of the No. 4 reactor at the stricken Fukushima No. 1 Nuclear Power Plant will collapse. This is something that experts from both within and outside Japan have pointed out since the massive quake struck. [...] not only independent experts, but also sources within the government say that it’s a grave concern.
The storage pool in the No. 4 reactor building has a total of 1,535 fuel rods, or 460 tons of nuclear fuel, in it. The 7-story building itself has suffered great damage, with the storage pool barely intact on the building’s third and fourth floors. The roof has been blown away. If the storage pool breaks and runs dry, the nuclear fuel inside will overheat and explode, causing a massive amount of radioactive substances to spread over a wide area. Both the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) and French nuclear energy company Areva have warned about this risk.
A report released in February by the Independent Investigation Commission on the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Accident stated that the storage pool of the plant’s No. 4 reactor has clearly been shown to be “the weakest link” in the parallel, chain-reaction crises of the nuclear disaster. The worse-case scenario drawn up by the government includes not only the collapse of the No. 4 reactor pool, but the disintegration of spent fuel rods from all the plant’s other reactors. If this were to happen, residents in the Tokyo metropolitan area would be forced to evacuate.
Former Minister of Land, Infrastructure, Transport and Tourism Sumio Mabuchi, who was appointed to the post of then Prime Minister Naoto Kan’s advisor on the nuclear disaster immediately after its outbreak, proposed the injection of concrete from below the No. 4 reactor to the bottom of the storage pool, Chernobyl-style. [...]
“Because sea water was being pumped into the reactor, the soundness of the structure (concrete corrosion and deterioration) was questionable. There also were doubts about the calculations made on earthquake resistance as well,” said one government source familiar with what took place at the time. “[...] fuel rod removal will take three years. Will the structure remain standing for that long? Burying the reactor in a concrete grave is like building a dam, and therefore expensive. I think that it was because TEPCO’s general shareholders’ meeting was coming up (in June 2011) that the company tried to keep expenses low.” [...]
Earthquakes in the neighborhood of level-5 on the seismic intensity scale continue to occur even now in the Tohoku and Kanto regions. We cannot accept the absurd condescension of those who fear the worse-case scenario, labeling them as “overreacting.” We have no time to humor the senseless thinking that instead, those who downplay the risks for the sake of economic growth are “realistic.”
Read the report here
Published: April 2nd, 2012 at 12:37 pm ET
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sending...
I'm speechless. Absolutely speechless.
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ON DECEMBER 31 2012 SPENT POOL # 4 COLLAPSES.
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"Absolutely Speechless" also applies to the corporatized, corrupt, MSM.
I'm always interested in the perception of the fatal fuku disaster by preppers, stackers and outsiders, such as this:
http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/the-radiation-warnings-you-wont-get-from-the-mainstream-propaganda-machine_04022012
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Speechless indeed!! Japan builds 100s of dams every single day all over Japan.. concreting every scare foot of rivers and beach that still remain… And they are saying they can't make a humongous concrete structure? They sure can, but only if the leaders of this country take seriously the threat to Japan and humanity as a whole.
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"They LIED to us." FUKUSHIMA STILL A TICKING TIME BOMB.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rrxmy6R3m90&feature=player_detailpage
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Shepard Tells there is no water in FP, http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gHel9qvxVpU
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It could get much, much worse…
Super Solar Storm To Hit Earth In 2013 'Carrington Effect'; Year Long Power Outage? via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/super-solar-storm-predicted-to-hit-2013.html
Fukushima Reactor 4; Life Extinction Event If It Collapses; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/fukushima-reactor-4-life-extinction.html
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WILL BE SOON
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No country, no military, no scientists, or industry can find a way to stabilize the fuel pool. Which means . . .
the Nuke industry needs to end. Now.
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Those with skills to resolve the issue are not even being asked. If there were resources allocated, people would step up. Those will skilled are being barred from participating.
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Yes! I think TEPCO has kept on those nuclear engineers who agree with their perspective, fired those who don't, and refuse to accept information from the outside. his is also the probelm with corporations. No one person is ever accountable. The harder decisions get passed along. The quick and dirty choices get grabbed up by everyone with smiles and pats on the back.
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All the Kings horse's and all the Kings men, couldn't put Fuku together again to save the world !
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This is just the beginning of the woes my friends. Read up on what is straight ahead of us all…Prophecies Org
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They better get ready all the way around the world, all 400 plus reactors…
Super Solar Storm To Hit Earth In 2013 'Carrington Effect'; Year Long Power Outage? http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/super-solar-storm-predicted-to-hit-2013.html
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How many experts will it take for serious remediation efforts? Too many and too long. The powers to be are obviously willing to let this epic disaster occur.
Where can you possibly go on the planet to avoid the fallout from this? Stock up now on your radiation mitigation needs.
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ruth,
They should have started building a large walled pool around the whole building and filled it with water the week after the disaster ! 30 feet Higher then the pools are now !
Would have kept the rods cool and if it fell they would still be under water !
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The whole of the Truth.
Finally.
In preparation for the inevitable.
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Agreed, Anthony. I don't think we've heard something this direct and realistic from the Japanese media before. The seriousness of the situation is finally sinking in. And what can we do? Nothing but trying to avoid the next one…
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Agreed. I am very concerned about the SFP 4 most of all. Its felt like dodging a bullet everyday but there seems to be a running out of the hourglass happening now.
I cant fathom what the physical ramifications are. And that really gets to me.
I'm glad they are publishing this even now. We`ve been talking about it for over a year now.
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Same here. We may be calling it MFP 4 (Melted Fuel Pool 4)
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Excellent insights all! Love the MFP4. A little levity in this tragedy helps. Thx.
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I keep wondering why they haven't put a concrete and steel liner in the foundation of the building to catch the falling fuel rods. At least they won't be scattered and can be covered with something, a boron air drop, concrete, water, something to slow the release and try and stop rampant recriticalities in the parking lot. The building has been approachable for an entire year. Films of people walking all over the darn thing. Building scaffolding, peeking into the pool, etc. We all have to remember that while TEPCO may be filled with greedy corporatists, they aren't necessarily smart ones. Maybe even quite a bit less than smart. Stupid and moronic comes to mind.
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something I found at the shtf.com site which is some wise words to think on….
****Gods Creation says:
April 3, 2012 at 1:12 pm
So True…
You should not prepare for a collapse so much as preparing to sustain and improve your standard of living. If you are fully prepared, the collapse will be something you read about in an old paper.
Live life today. If it is not what you want to preserve, then ditch it now and work to build something worth preserving. Prepare for life, not a collapse.****
Thought it might be helpful.
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Now if only it is that simple. I still feel concerned despite the good words.
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We are called upon to form a new paradigm, a new way of thinking, which is neither surrender to the situation or fighting it. It is cooperation with it. Learn to discern the messsages of events at Fukushima and around the world. Teach the messages. That will develop the new paradigm and the new consciousness.
Everything is percisely as it needs to be. The universe is teaching us something. The sooner we learn the lesson, the sooner the crisis will end.
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The forecast is for 40-60 mph winds to hit Daiichi tomorrow. The #4 pool is sitting in the open air now.
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Good point. Typhoon season – remember the worries last year and how Tepco was desperately rushing to cover the sad remains of unit 1?
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Bobby1 – Any idea about the direction of those 40-60 MPH winds forecast for tomorrow. Wouldn't it be "convenient" for the cooling to be lost during the windstorm, the SFP rods to overheat and explode, and the gusting winds to push the contamination out to sea, and beyond. Just a thought.
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- – ding – -
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"A report released in February by the Independent Investigation Commission on the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Accident stated that the storage pool of the plant’s No. 4 reactor has clearly been shown to be “the weakest link” in the parallel, chain-reaction crises of the nuclear disaster.
The WORSE-CASE SCENARIO DRAWN UP BY THE GOVERNMENT INCLUDES NOT ONLY THE COLLAPSE OF THE NO. 4 REACTOR POOL, BUT THE DISINTEGRAION OF SPENT FUEL RODS FROM ALL THE PLANT'S OTHER REACTORS. If this were to happen, residents in the Tokyo metropolitan area would be forced to evacuate."
SHIVER ME TIMBERS!
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This is chilling. The worst-case scenario we've all been aware could happen finally being openly discussed. The plant would have to be abandoned, and IMHO all Hell would break loose.
I wonder if anyone has any idea of how much radiation would come out of the plant if this were to occur. I think it's far worse than we can imagine. Possible ELE? Maybe. It might not kill everyone in the Northern Hemisphere right away, but one wonders if anything could survive after that.
We're already seeing diminished bird populations in California. Things have been growing poorly here for the past year. I'm an avid organic gardener and former UC Master Gardener. I've noticed a distinct failure to thrive. Many of my fruit trees and veggies are barely making it. Some of the trees here have die off on their branches, midway along the branch. Entire portions of trees have been killed. The grass doesn't grow properly, and until we had lots of rain, the tips on the grass in many places looked brown and burned. The dandelions and weeds are reddish or purplish in color, in some places. It's like all sorts of plants now have chimera shoots and growth. The plants show lots of mutations. My spring flowers barely bloomed, and the daffodil flowers were tiny. Lots of things look stunted and unhealthy compared to pre- 3/11.
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The point being, if we in California are far away from Japan and we're already seeing lots of mutations from radiation, what will become of Japan, Asia, and all the Pacific Rim countries? The contamination clearly will spread globally on air currents, and via the "great conveyor" belt of oceanic currents.
It would be a man-made global catastrophe of unprecedented proportions.
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I read somewhere the Gulf Stream has stopped. When will the current resume? After Fukushima comes online?
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Sorry its a video of last April:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1L-cqtpRbk
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Here is a look at the Gulf Loop Current
http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/ofs/viewer.shtml?-gulfmex-cur-0-large-rundate=latest
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Heart of the Rose,
It appears to be flowing again to a large degree compared to it stopping in 2010, even an eddy is there !
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One weak eddy..I think there are three this time of yesr…not sure… no time for comaparisons for a few days..
http://socioecohistory.wordpress.com/2010/07/21/dr-gianluigi-zangari-bp-gulf-oil-disaster-gulf-stream-loop-current-breaking-down-effects-on-global-climate-19-july-2010/
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I was driving on Rt 101 from Crescent City, CA just south of the Oregon border down to Eureka, CA. Much of Rt. 101 here is right on the edge of the Pacific ocean. The trees bordering 101 near the ocean are are all dead or dying and many are covered with some kind of white cake stuff.
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Hi Ruth, we moved from there about 16 months ago. I had wondered what happened there, since there is so much rainfall. How sad.
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Ruth, is there any possibility you might go near that area again soon, and could take some photos to document it? James Tekton had a great idea awhile back, and got a PhotoBucket account (free) to post some of the pictures. I've posted a link to pics from here at Forum area. Next: pictures of discolored plants, deformed weeds and dandelions, and my neighbor's beautiful Asian grapefruit tree, which is covered in yellow leaves this year. Last year it had beautiful, shiny, brilliant green leaves of a medium-dark green color.
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Ruth, I live here and spend a great deal of time visiting the ocean where your reporting from…pictures would be great to allow the users here to determine for themselves what is going on. The trees are not dying or dead as your reporting. "The trees bordering 101 near the ocean are are all dead or dying and many are covered with some kind of white cake stuff." We have seen some of our beautiful redwood trees turn brown from the top down caused by polution from who knows what, but this has been ongoing now for over 20 years. What trees are you seeing there that are dead, what types of trees. I'll be there tomorrow and will take pictures if necessary. This kind of stuff needs more documentation. Besides Ruth, we kinda doged a bullet here up north in Cali, Central and Southern Cal got hammered.
Please, let us continue to be kind, one to another, for we are each of us together in our pain!
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Sounds very much like bark beetles. Pollution is weakening the trees which allows bark beetles to take entire swaths of forest. They eat the thin membrane that brings water up the tree. Trees die at the top first, brown, then they die off branch by branch down the trunk. Takes one to two years. The tree puts out massive amounts of sap along the bark, usually whitish, trying to protect itself. This has been happening all up and down the West Coast, the Cascade Range, and many parts of Canada.
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I would add acid rain, caused by increasing carbon dioxide levels in the air, plus acid pollutants getting into the soil.
The soil gets more acid and toxic, which weakens the plant.
Insects are programmed to 'take out' weak plants. This is all in the natural order of things.
Diseases take out weak human beings, and we are getting weaker and weaker with each generation, constitutionally speaking.
Here are a few reasons why we are getting weaker;
93 Long life Radiation Contaminants
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/93-long-lived-nuclear-elements.html
30 ways the nuclear industry deceives everyone;
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/primer-in-art-of-deception-cult-of.html
Uranium Mining Legacy; Toxic Waste For 1,000,000 Years http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/uranium-mining-legacy-toxic-waste-for.html
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Bark beetles is likely the better explanation for these trees than radiation effects. I had forgotten about the bark beetle infestation. I will still try to get some pictures and I can also check the local university to see what their explanation is for these trees.
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I did not blame radiation all by itself, although at Chernobyl it was documented that radiation can kill a whole forest (which they bulldozed down).
What I said was that the combination of ALL things we are doing globally is weakening the life force of trees generally and globally.
Combine:
Acid rain from carbon fuel burning.
Acid gases increasing, such as CO2.
Climate changes from all that we do, weakens trees due to stresses such as droughts, etc.
Soils are increasingly acid, which weakens trees.
Radiation levels increasing, plus exposure to hot particles just like us.
As a result of the above; trees get sick and weak. This changes their energy signature. Insects are attracted to this energy vibration.. (Insect antenna)
Insects and diseases then attack weak plants to 'take them out'. This is their natural function, not something strange. Insects and diseases are there in part to keep the genetic stock pure and healthy, while getting rid of 'defective' and 'weak' specimens.
But what happens when all trees, all humans and all plants become 'weak' and 'defective' due to the accumulation of chemicals, radiation, pollution, devitalized foods, polluted water, polluted air, dead ground, sick plants, sick animals, etc?
If humanity does not change back to sustainable ways of living, we will be 'taken out' by Natural Laws.
Guaranteed.
It is happening now, and accelerating.
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American Indian Prophecy, Living As Soul on Earth; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/american-indian-prophecies-and-way-of.html
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I can get some pictures to share. The worst trees were near Crescent City going south where Rt. 101 runs right along the ocean. I have seen the white cake covering these trees before Fukushima but they are worse now, more prevalent. Spring is blooming here so the dead trees are very apparent.
I agree that Northern Cal appears to not have been hit as hard as Southern Cal with Fuku radiation and I think Humboldt Bay may be protecting inland from some of the radiation.
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Birds of a feather , I was just going to ask Ruth a similar question, I have not observed that either and Im, also in this region .My curiosity is peaked. I was wondering if the white stuff is on all the species along the road or a few select?
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HoTaters,
Latest deaths,, "Mass Animal Death" category
http://members.beforeitsnews.com/stories/in/0000000000000169
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"residents in the Tokyo metropolitan area would be forced to evacuate"
sometimes it seems that this doesnt get as much attention as it needs.
imagine the logistics of evacuating 38,000,000 people. where are they going to go? Saskatchewan? Mongolia? send groups of 10,000 people to 3,800 cities world-wide? (assuming that there are even 3800 cities world-wide with vacancy for 10,000).
Frankly evacuating the TMA borders on the impossible.
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Prophet Linda Newkirk has been shown by our Saviour that they are going mass murder the citizenry.
You need to read her prophetic warnings about the great tribulation that is now upon us. Prophecies Org
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This is not Christian teaching:
“…Newkirk teaches and believes in REINCARNATION AND KARMA…”
http://americanholocaustcoming.blogspot.com/2010/05/disturbing-new-information-about-linda.html
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The world didn’t end in 2008 as she earlier predicted:
“2008?: Linda Newkirk reported that she received a revelation from Yahweh on 2007-NOV-17. She writes that a comet, 17/P Holmes, "… is a sign of the [second] coming of the Son of Man" — Yeshua of Nazareth or Jesus Christ. The comet was discovered by Edwin Homes in 1892 and follows an inclined elliptical orbit between the planets Mars and Jupiter. It experienced a massive increase in brightness during the night of 2007-OCT-23-24 when it went from about a magnitude 17 to about 2.8 in just 42 hours. Linda's prophecy appears to have been another false alarm, because the comet has since faded from sight with no appearance of Yeshua. The comet is expected to return in 2014. 11,12”
http://www.religioustolerance.org/endwrl14.htm
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Tokyo; is it safe to live in or visit? http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/tokyo-is-it-safe-to-visit-or-live-in.html
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I know, I know, I just have to say it once again and get it off my chest:
Any power source that, after 48 hours without cooling, can, even in the remotest chance, result in the phrase: "If this were to happen, residents in the Tokyo metropolitan area would be forced to evacuate." is without a doubt the most insane idea in history. Argh.
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The inmates began running the asylum long ago I am afraid.
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It is even worse when that 48 hours is 45 minutes and we are really talking about evacuating most of Japan.
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Agreed.
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Tokyo should have been evacuated over a year ago…
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You got it.
Anyone now living or working in Tokyo doesn't.
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Faraway – You could type that comment until the skin wears off your fingertips and it still wouldn't be enough.
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It does make sense for some people…those who will die with their pockets stuffed with money….aka the insane
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Farawayfan…DING DING DING! We have a winner!
"…without a doubt the most insane idea in history. Argh."
Keep typing. We'll send you some fingertip replacement gloves!
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Fukushima Reactor 4; Life Extinction Event If It Collapses; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/fukushima-reactor-4-life-extinction.html
12 reasons why all nuclear power plants must be shut down; via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/12-reasons-why-all-nuclear-power-plants.html
Super Solar Storm To Hit Earth In 2013 'Carrington Effect'; Year Long Power Outage? via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/super-solar-storm-predicted-to-hit-2013.html
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It's like all of Japan (and probably the US and beyond) is waiting to run and scream or something. I don't like this feeling.
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Is there any telling how much time we may have?
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The crazy thing is that 99,9% of the world's population are absolutely unaware of what is unfolding before our (enenewsers) eyes.
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We have known Unit 4 had that much waste in it since last summer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P6xArnXBwc&feature=relmfu
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What about that NRC transcription, wherein it was mentioned that they looked in Reactor 4 couldn't see spent fuel pool 4 and didn't think it was there anymore? Is it possible that it was gone from the beginning and they are just building us up to except it?
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My dear WorseThanChernobyl: NRC meant to talk about SFP 3, but spoke of SFP4 in error, IMHO. SFP 4 is still there, but has burned a couple of times, and sits in a leaning building. It has used MOX fuel in it, and if it falls in a heap on the parking lot, as it could in a m7 quake, may be the end of all life on Earth as we know it.
My dear huskey:
. Tepgov doesn't actually DO anything. It's only been ONY 1 ENTIRE YEAR, so they are still studying things. Maybe take 10 years to study things, than another 10 years to develop new robot technologies that can work in nuke hell. Then take 10 years to "decommission" the 4 plants, and take all the materials away (to where?). Since they can't deal with the 3 coriums in the ground, they will grade the site over and build a memorial. Tell everyone who visits not to soend over ten minutes there.
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@philipupnorth
"…NRC meant to talk about SFP 3, but spoke of SFP4 in error,…"
Even after Chuck Casto staked his career on it???
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Reactor 3 SFP is the one I believe has been blown sky high. I just don't see where any of the pool could exist in that pile of rubble. As for reactor 4 they are trying to stabilize the foundation and cannot even attempt to remove the fuel for a few more years. NO NUKES
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moonshellblue and philipupnorth,
What evidence do we have that R4 SFP still exists? Other than Tepco's testimony, the folks that brought us the "Cold Shutdown Tour 2011?"
How did an explosion blow out the walls and the roof of R4?
The simplest explanation for many issues is that the NRC was right, that the R4 SFP is already "gone," blowing apart R4 on its way.
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RE Spent fuel pool #4
The NRC transcripts describing unit 4 as essentially MIA were probably referring to unit 3
However, the NRC did report early on in the disaster that spent fuel pool #4 was leaking and damaged
I have to agree with NoNukes that spent fuel pool 4 may be already destroyed and that all these news reports about spent fuel pool 4 may be red herrings
(although I grant that the "experts" commenting about the #4 pool probably do not know its real status)
DATA
NRC March Email: “The walls of the Unit 4 spent fuel pool have collapsed, and there is no water in there”http://enenews.com/nrc-march-email-the-walls-of-the-unit-4-spent-fuel-pool-have-collapsed-and-there-is-no-water-in-there
March 16th, 2011 – Unit 4 SFP walls have collapsed – Fuel may no longer be intact, Enformable, Jan. 11, 2012:
From: Boska, John
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 11:31 AM
To: Guzman, Richard
Cc: Pickett, Douglas
Subject: Developments in Japan
Importance: High
Rich, please review and comment, for distribution to our branch.
In a briefing with Joe Giitter that just ended, we were informed that the situation is now much worse in Japan. The walls of the Unit 4 spent fuel pool have collapsed, and there is no water in there. There were a large number of fuel assemblies in the pool, and the fuel may no longer be intact. The radiation levels are increasing so much that it may prove difficult to work on the other 5 reactors at the site, which could lead to more fuel…
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more
http://majiasblog.blogspot.com/2012/01/on-spent-fuel-pool-4.html
On the morning of Tue March 15, the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) released a statement warning that the Japanese authorities had reported a fire in spent fuel pool #4.
Japanese authorities also today informed the IAEA at 03:50 UTC that the spent fuel storage pond at the Unit 4 reactor of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant was on fire and radioactivity was being released directly into the atmosphere.
At the time of these reports, dose rates of up to 400 millisievert per hour were reported at the site. Japanese authorities stated that the the fire in the pool was caused by a hydrogen explosion. (http://www.iaea.org/press/?p=1248)
The fuel pool fire was reportedly extinguished later on March 15 (IAEA http://www.iaea.org/press/p=1252).
However, Jim Riccio, a nuclear expert for Greenpeace, reported on March 16 to The Guardian that the spent fuel pool at unit 4 was still boiling: "The spent fuel pool in unit 4 is boiling, and once that starts you can't stop it… The threat is that if you boil off the water, the metal cladding on the fuel rods that is exposed to the air, and is volatile, will catch fire. That will propel the radiation even further"
(cited in Goldenberg, 2011 3/16). Goldenberg, Suzanne. “Japan Nuclear Crisis: Fire in fuel pools 'would raise radiation exposure'. The guardian (2011, March 16): .http://www.guardian.co…
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Ah majia…Scholarship. What a wonderfully scientific art form! TY!
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PS.From the NRC FOIA Documents..
Pg. 62…
Sorry.. I don't have time at the moment to transcribe here..a bit busy.
John Monager corrects himself..not Unit 3..Unit 4.
http://pbadupws.nrc.gov/docs/ML1205/ML12052A108.pdf
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It says:
JOHN MONAGER: Unit 1 and 2 is boiling
8 down, and Unit 3 and 4 is having zirc/water reaction.
9 They believe there is essentially no walls on Unit 3.
10 The explosion — I'm sorry — Unit 4. The explosion
11 leveled the walls, leveled the structure for the Unit
12 4 spent-fuel pool all the way down to the approximate
13 level of the bottom of the fuels. So, there's no
14 water in there whatsoever.
15 MALE PARTICIPANT: And no ability to
16 retain water.
17
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Right, how can there be a "pool" with no walls?
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Hey folks, slow down a minute and recall that there are images we have all seen of the SFP4 over the past year. Reactor, golden reactor top, pool, green trolly, parts of exterior walls missing, volumes of water being sprayed into the pool, fly-overs, robotic cameras, videos of workers and engineers walking all over the thing, taking elevators to the top, etc., journalists sneaking in and taking photos. It's there. NRC folks were talking without having correct information, all trying to assess a situation that they weren't privy to. I'll believe my eyes before i believe a NRC memo or discussion.
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Pool? When? I have been begging Tepco for a nice wide shot of the R4 sfp forever, and didn't even see one at the wheel of fortune birthday party.
walls missing, check.
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Wow maijia if this is really the deal then it seems the pool has been long gone…..
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@NoNukes, I have long held that SFP 4 has long since expired, mostly from the utter destruction on the upper structure… The debris alone which would have fallen into it would have totally compromised its.
We all realize that we read about it .long. after it has already taken place. This is simply an admission of what we already know. I think (the storm) will be an excuse for those (stockholders and governements) paralyzed to devote resources to right their egregious wrongs.
Face it they have long since written this off. Given up hope to correct, walking no, running away…
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truthseek,
Do you mean that they will try to help people, or just claim that the r4 sfp is gone with the storm, which would explain the drumbeat right now about it?
Why do you think that they sat on this for so long? Because they could?
Thanks for your help. Heart of the Rose posted some video from way back that reminded me that sfp4 is probably gone:
Heart of the Rose
March 31, 2012 at 7:14 am · Reply
@ Nuck ..thanks for letting us know…
I'm sure you've seen this one from March 18 2011. ..Nice shot of reactor 4 at 5:08
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSAnDtwcCX4&feature=related
Heart of the Rose
March 31, 2012 at 8:19 pm · Reply
Hi dharmasyd..4 can be viewed at 2:40 and both 3 and 4 at 3:40-3:53…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0catEdRqGX4
Heart of the Rose
March 31, 2012 at 8:23 pm · Reply
… the vid shot from helicopter…was two days after the RT story.
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NN, Thank you for responding. I am sorry for not being clear,
Exempt them from direct responsibility…
A convenient excuse to the many (victims) for "this magnanomous SFP loss"
with their ongoing lies and deception, they need even bigger, bolder
lies to serve their story…
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Last year report, there is no water in #4 FP,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gHel9qvxVpU
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No Solutions For Nuclear Disasters Or Nuclear Waste; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/no-solutions-for-nuclear-disasters.html
What Happens To Nuclear Waste In Your Country? via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/what-happens-to-nuclear-waste-in-your.html
93 Long life Radiation Contaminants; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/93-long-lived-nuclear-elements.html
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WorseThanChernobyl,
The NRC transcripts made it clear that the R4 SFP was "gone," and we haven't seen any video, or photos to the contrary in the entire year+ since.
While I would prefer that its contents were not already blown over the world, the NRC transcripts sound more believable than Mainichi, aren't they the ones who said that that radiation's effects below 100 millisieverts remain "unknown?" Why all this drumbeating about R4 sfp now? Cover for R2? Something else?
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We've seen videos, photos, etc. of SPF 4 for a year now. Unless every image, including Nuk's, has been Photoshopped, the reactor is there. However, the original fire in March 2011 burned many fuel rods and released massive amounts of ionized radiation before water began to be pumped in to re-submerge the fuel rods. I think it's getting attention because a nuclear engineer recently talked to the media about it being the biggest threat if it falls during an earthquake, the rods tumbling to the ground to lay uncovered and exposed to the air for the next several thousand years. Worrying about it might be a ruse to ignore Reactor 2, but, i actually think it has always been the most pressing concern since the original disaster, and is finally getting attention because the quakes have been larger lately, with the most recent ones very near Fukushima.
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Could you link to a photo/video of the r4 sfp? I haven't seen a shot of the pool nice and filled with water and fuel so that we could tell it was R4 in, well, I can't remember. It would make my day to see one.
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Ooops, accept not except!
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About freakin' time SPF got serious coverage. I hope this opens the media door to a little bit of journalistic investigation. I think SFP 4 has always been the most pending threat to a possible immediate and catastrophic airborne radioactive release, as Arnie suggested way back in March or April 2011. A liner could have been in place by now along the inside, or even the outside, foundation of the building in this time to catch much of the fuel rods as they toppled. It would then been far easier to water them down or encase them. Such wasted time. Inconceivable incompetence, hubris, greed, and an inability to look fear in the eye and overcome it.
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Send the US Navy, or Russian Army, or some smart Germans to prop up SFP 4.
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The Big Picture is that we need all of the above, plus others, sent in to actually begin to address the Fuku mess! Not only SFP 4, but the unliving hell that is Units 1, 2, and 3, along with SFPs in those buildings. TEPCO: Have you removed so much as one fuel assembly from SFP 5 or 6? Has anyone told you how useless you look to the whole world? Resign in disgrace.
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Says it all.
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I'd just shoot in concrete until I had a mound under the pool. Some support is better than none and you can't do better without clearing the rubble beneath it, which would kill man or robot.
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I have heard that a person at the railing looking into SFP4 has about one minute to get a fatal dose. But I agree that you must fill Building 4 to the roofline with concrete. For starters!
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Not sure. Just a few weeks ago several people spent about 20 mins looking down into the pool during repairs after one of the water pipes began to leak after a recent quake.
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Just because they looked does not mean that they lived. During the early part of Chernobyl many people looked at the core from a distant bridge all receiving fatal dosage.
http://villageofjoy.com/chernobyl-today-a-creepy-story-told-in-pictures/
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Free Ebook; Chernobyl: Consequences of the Catastrophe for People and the Environment; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/free-ebook-chernobyl-consequences-of.html
Chernobyl Coverup And Denial Of 1 Million + Casualties; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/chernobyl-coverup-and-denial-of-1.html
The Chernobyl Sacrifice; 1 MILLION Liquidators; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/chernobyl-sacrifice-1-million.html
The Battle Of Chernobyl Movie; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/battle-of-chernobyl-movie.html
Chernobyl Heart Movie; How Children Are Affected; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/chernobyl-heart-movie-how-children-are.html
Ukraine raises $785m to seal Chernobyl under new 'shell'; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/ukraine-raises-785m-to-seal-chernobyl.html
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So…. What do WE DO to prepare for that eventuality?
Respirators?
Stockpile food/water?
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billyedtimmy,
Go C.H.U.D. like the Elite and Goverment !
Yhey will come up to a dead world and die also !
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How To Live in a Public Or Private Nuclear Radiation Fallout Shelter; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/living-in-nuclear-radiation-fallout.html
This may not help at all, because what happens when you run out of food and water?
You have to come out. All food and water will be highly contaminated and poisonous, assuming there is any life left.
#4 will keep on spewing radiation, and the rest of the FUKU plant will self destruct without humans around, making it a life extinction event…
For millions of years, the planet will be a nuclear Hell.
At some point, all of these 1 percenters and government officials busy spending billions of our tax money building underground shelters for themselves will also have to come back to the surface.
But what happens when the Carrington Effect happens, and the other 400 nuke plants blow up and melt down. It will make FUKU look like a picnic in the park..
HOT dogs will take on a new meaning.
Super Solar Storm To Hit Earth In 2013 'Carrington Effect'; Year Long Power Outage? via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/super-solar-storm-predicted-to-hit-2013.html
Suggestion: live life as soul. Be grateful for every second of LIFE. It is precious.
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So the gravenes is starting to became clearer, but stil its like Hearing a Fotball match on the Radio, where the speaker stops talking when the teams are on One of the half feilds during the match.
The slow buildup of Radiation wil make it increasingly more and more difficloud to do anything reasonable in the compound.
Doring this year its steadily been worsened, and if this goes for on for a nother year, it may be imposible to be anywhere near the Reactorsites.
The hole compound will eventualy be dangerous.
Still this is like scasing shaddows, fruitless because of the downplaying and lies that stil comtinues to be feed.
This is bad, by that I mean the stand still in almoust everything regarding evac and the healt of children and the comoners in Japan. I am shocked that the silence is so penetrating.
From now on we are on Unknown ground, how nasty this will bem we dont know, but this year will be the revelation.
But the price we have to pay wil be horrific and the scope wil manifets it self, because the scale wil surpas the silence possible to maintain, thru controlling the MSM.
That price, ladys and gentlmen, is what we are dealing with, when we talk and talk.
Resulting in More talk and talk.
And so we talk.
Whilst radiation is been pumped up to the atmosphere, dayly.
3 bleading react.
S.F. Pols all over.
MOX all over the world.
And stil we talk.
And the visdom in the notion of You reap What you Saw, is still not aparent.
Instead we chuse to…
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Burying the reactor in a concrete grave is like building a dam, and therefore expensive. I think that it was because TEPCO’s general shareholders’ meeting was coming up (in June 2011) that the company tried to keep expenses low.” [...]
Do these shareholders understand that in a world full of radiation money won't have much merrit. You can't eat it or drink money…it isn't a plutonium sheild…this it?
Fine time to think about saving money!
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Time has already run out in North America. You've more than likely inhaled several fatal doses already.
As for the Media – they refuse to cover this. Every major news service from Russia Today to the Sydney Morning Herald is under strict instructions not to run anything on the truth.
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The question seems to me, "Has the other shoe already dropped? Or are we still waiting?"
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"Black substance is covering all the Kanto area↓ 3.44 μSv/h from 200g of the sample.↓ The person who found this has been having health problem, burn on finger (for 3 months) and the bruise on thighs (for 9 months). The black circle on the left bottom of the picture is the size of the bruise back in July. It’s growing."
This is from Fukushima Diary; Could we reasonably make a connection between all the
massive releases from Fukushima including Reactor 3 blowing up and SF4 being melted down
to the presence of this black substance throughout Tokyo and surrounding Kanto region.
Is this not an ELE event on going in slow motion. Perhaps Tacomagrove was telling us some
disturbing truths last Spring.
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ELE? Talk about alarmist get a grip … tacomagrove, nice source
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See my comment below
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Burying the reactor in a concrete grave is like building a dam, and therefore expensive. I think that it was because TEPCO’s general shareholders’ meeting was coming up (in June 2011) that the company tried to keep expenses low.” [...]
Those are (big shareholders) the people in power during WAR II who have been let go by the US.
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That person has beta burns. This is obviously something nasty. The real reading is probably 100-350 times more than that recorded, as that particular meter will not accurately measure the betas incidence upon it.
Remember, cheap meters will tell you that there is radiation, they will not detect all types, and they will not tell you the real dose! The sample, if stored, should be held in a plastic container with 20 mm thick sides – preferrably perspex.
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Recent photo of #4: click image to enlarge.
http://enformable.com/2012/04/real-and-present-threat-to-japanese-nuclear-safety/４号機原子炉建屋上部ガレキ撤去（作業前）/
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If the spent fuel pool in building four was destroyed on 11-03-11 then the radiation situation cannot get any worse, unless buildings 1, 2 & 3 collapse.
But I would make this observation, the three meltdowns and the fuel pool fire have released between 10 and 60 kilograms of ceasium137 in total. SFP4 contains about 0.48 to 0.62% ceasium137 or put another way 2208 kilograms to 2852 kilograms.
So you tell me, do you think SFP4 has all melted down, or do you think it will be a total disaster like nothing we have seen so far, if it does.
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Don't forget about this…
Fukushima; Pacific Ocean Catastrophe Confirmed; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/fukushima-pacific-ocean-catastrophe.html
Fukushima Leaking Radioactive Water Into Ocean Plume; via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/04/fukushima-leaking-radioactive-water.html
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Total Fukushima Radiation Released Into Ocean, Air, Groundwater, Storage Tanks; via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/02/total-fukushima-radiation-released-into.html
What really happened at Fukushima? via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/02/what-really-happened-at-fukushima.html
How Dangerous Is 400-600 Pounds Of Plutonium Nano Particle Dust Liberated By Fukushima? Via A Green Road Blog http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/how-dangerous-is-400-600-pounds-of.html
Is Fukushima really in cold shutdown? via A Green Road Blog
http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2012/03/fukushima-is-it-really-in-cold-shutdown.html
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The suicide workers spotted on the railings at Unit 4 would not be there if the fuel was all gone. Some has burned, but a lot remains in a stagnant pool of water.
I am guessing the late March 2011 prop-up repairs included patching some of the biggest leaking cracks. No telling how many workers died in that effort.
It has been a juggling act for feed and bleed at Unit 4 because of the fear of too much weight from cooling water. Nuclear fire episodes have occurred frequently. They drowned those fires with the water cannons in the first five months until the secretive heat transfer exchange system was constructed last fall. In my opinion it is that cooling system that has prevented meltdown at Unit 4. How else can we explain the stagnant uncirculated water in the pool itself? Just my guess… I could be 100% wrong.
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Sickputer, i agree, effort has been made to deal with SFP4 in some fashion because there is still fuel in the pool. Otherwise, why bother and just do as they have with SFP 3 – nothing and ignore it. You're right, the balancing act of making it stable, flexible, not too heavy with water, all in case of a quake. So, it holds water, but, not the full volume. Did they guesstimate how much weight the trellises could bear in case of a sizable quake? I figured those guys looking down into the pool were engineers, so i figured the radiation was low at that time. I thought the pipes installed last fall were to circulate the water and that this is what began to leak after anther quake?
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Sickputer,
When we see the workers on the upper level, they go to to the left opposite the sfp location (the left of the view looking at the webcam), where I think there is another pool, I'm wondering if that is what they check on.
If that video was really of the R4 sfp, why have they never given us a photo/video of the situation that shows that it is R4?
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Containment_building
it's gone. there is no containment, apart from the truth.
it happened last march
they said it never would
they are still in business
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blackrain66, that is in regards to the containment building for the reactor being breached. The reactor was empty and the total load of fuel rods were stacked in the SFP above the reactor. It has it's own support, but, this was heavily damaged in the quake and explosion and the pool also lost its water, most likely from boiling away when the circulation pumps shut down. There is also solid speculation that the pool, itself, was breached. At some point, it began to either hold water because it got cool enough to stop boiling with constant water being firehosed in, or because some brave souls gave their lives to repair the possible breaches, as sickputer thinks, or both. Shoring up the structure holding SFP4 was one of the first repair projects undertaken at Fukushima, one, because workers could get in there for periods of time to effect repairs because the surrounding radiation wasn't as high as the broken reactors of 1,2, and 3. Much of the radiation from the SFP4 went up in smoke in the early days and was ionized to float away on the wind to fall as radioactive rain elsewhere. Eventually, a water recirculation project began, and this had a very serious leak within hours of one of the more recent earthquakes this winter. Repairs were done on that leak. I think the reason it is making news now is because for all the repairs and work, it is still as vulnerable as ever. It is precarious, and one strong quake, or several smaller ones, could bring it tumbling down.
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VicFromOregon,
This is what Tepco has been saying, but Tepco is fond of the Big Lie, like "Cold Shutdown."
As Tepco's president said in 2002,
“We personally hurt the public’s trust in us” (1) were TEPCO’s President words after revelations that the main Japanese power company had filed falsified voluntary inspection reports at three nuclear power plants for years."
http://www.wise-paris.org/index.html?/english/ournews/year_2002/ournews020907.html&/english/frame/menu.html&/english/frame/band.html
So setting aside Tepco with their track record of falsification by their own admission, what other evidence do we have?
1. The NRC states, repeatedly, that R4 SFP is "gone," the walls are blown out, the isotopes would be out of the pool in 24 hours.
2. The walls and roof are blown out.
3. Absence of any visual evidence of an identifiable R4 SFP for most of a year.
4. Absence of evidence of any possible effort to shore up/move, etc. the R4 SFP.
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I still say this guy has changed his tune…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=b7iu7GwqXWo&feature=endscreen
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"recommend the evacuation zones be pushed back further"…to the Southern Hemisphere maybe! Damn, I wish I had just hopped on a plane and not been so "reasonable."
You have found amazing footage, Heart, thank you. Please let me know if I shouldn't copy and paste elsewhere, like above.
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Hi..NoNukes.. Thanks….Copy and paste anywhere you would like.
I quit listening to Mr. Gundersen a long time ago..but I do recall what he said.
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You have a better memory than I do, it is good to see that there was a reason we were all listening back then. I'll try to follow your lead and stop, it is the only smart thing to do…
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@Heart of the Rose
Thanks for the video which clarified some aspects re R4 SFP.
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Prop it up…? maybe they should try Lincoln Logs
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Ooooh..Arnie say SPF 4 ..dry..NRC ..dry…
Whaahhh..not good enough?
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May 7 2011.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukxCyzvafl0&feature=related
Repost from webcam thread.
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Heart, TY for this video and for
Secret Helicopter fly-over of Fukushima reactors 4-17-2011.flv
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSAnDtwcCX4&feature=related
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I am adding this short clip from the same fly-over..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM4A1BTdyEc&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PLBF25E47D6E366203
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I agree with No Nukes and others questioning the real status of SFP 4. We all must recall reports of serious problems there. If the pool really has water and is holding off meltdown, fine for now, but I would not be surprised if some fuel has melted already.
In the end all that can be done with nuke waste and highly radioactive substances is to bury them as deeply as possible. This was the natural path taken by Earth over the last few billion years setting up a liveable environment for complex organisms to evolve in. Even Rickover recognized this obvious misstep saying now idiots have reversed Earth's wisdom and 'dug up the cledge'. I think that is why Lehman fired him, to get on with nuclear propulsion using highly enriched fuels instead of telling the truth.
Since in the end to live on Earth we will need to bury the entire nuclear industry to prevent meltdowns of the four hundred reactors, and since the only natural solution to meltdown is corium vitrification (nature's cold shutdown as in the Chernobyl sarcophagus basement's 'elephants' feet'), why not expedite the natural process by burying the entire Daiichi site with its SFP 4, its pellets of MOX all over the ground, its coriums, and its memories of spewing, steaming disaster, to begin the healing that will take millenia for Fukushima. A good scouring glaciation will restore Japan, but until then the best move would be to massively landfill over the entire site at Daiichi.
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Hi sunpower, I'm not so sure if burying the whole mess deep down in the earth is really the best way to go. I'm afraid that geology is so complex that we'd never ever be safe from the stuff leaking into water / soil and coming back to surface when the future generations will be long having forgotten where it was put centuries ago…
Also, I think the "out of sight" option is the one the industry would prefer, as it would make sure they never again had to deal with the mess, as it can't be taken back up. On the other hand: the industry won't be existing anymore 50 years from now – it's the governments which will have to handle it.
I guess I'd prefer an accessible underground bunker which gives the opportunity to monitor and retrieve if necessary. And we need a "nuclear priesthood" to pass the knowledge on for 40.000 generations (if we make it that long, which I doubt).
Boy, what a mess for 60 years of "cheap energy".
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Good exposition a la Finland. It takes my breath away that they are going ahead with the abominable start up at Kudankulam.
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BreadAndButter,
Where's that Time Machine I asked for ?
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Experts worry because Unit 4 reactor core was emptied into 4's SFP while doing a shroud replacement, cramming more than twice as much weight into Unit 4 spent fuel pond than it was designed for i.e. typical stored spent and fresh fuel plus the entire load from the reactor.
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MSM quoting the NRC.
http://theintelhub.com/2012/04/02/video-is-shepard-smith-dying-radiation-poisoning-from-fukushima/
Thank you..xdrfox…
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Your welcome Heart of the Rose,
"No more water in fuel pool where water must be to prevent desaster" NRC
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*On Now* Rense Radio "Jeff Rense Program" here's the App, live feed for …
http://rense.gsradio.net:8080/rense/livefeeds/16k.asx
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So let me think… so if SFP4 corium has also left the building (which it surely would by now) then perhaps this is why there is so much earthquake activity. Given the recent admission of an unreported MELTDOWN 30 years ago it makes me wonder if this area's earthquakes have been in some part due to the 30 yer old corium?
I think we are underestimating the impacts a radioactive body such as these have underground. I think if they are going critical underground that would logically contribute to pressures or jolts to already active fault lines. I think even moving through the fault line has its consequences.
Maybe the 311 earthquake was caused by the 30 year old missing meltdown corium?
Now what does a corium the size of SFP4 have to offer us today?
Economy of scale.
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March 20 2011
Pg. 71 and 72 NRC FOIA docs..
An interesting discussion about 4.
Line 19:
Dave Skeen: The concern with 4 was always it should have been about 10 times the decay heat in there of 4 because they had to have full core offload in there.
Line 23:
JM: Right.
Line 24:
DS: Yet, when we see pictures, we never see any steam coming out of it, which would lead one to believe that there's no steam.There must not be any water to steam out there.
Pg. 73
Line 3:
John Moninger: Right.
Line 4:
Dave Skeen: And so it seems must be dry.
Line 6:
John Moninger: Right.
http://pbadupws.nrc.gov/docs/ML1205/ML12052A111.pdf
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