Nobel: Radioactive contamination in Western US and Hawaii a concern — “Particularly in the water and milk sources” -CBS (VIDEO)

Published: September 3rd, 2012 at 1:52 am ET
By

111 comments


Interview with Dr. Michael Nobel
Published on Sep 2, 2012
Uploaded by Koni Scavella
CBS Atlanta

[...]

Dr. Michael Nobel is a member of the Nobel family, famous of course for the Nobel prize. He’s the co-founder and chairman at the Nobel charitable trust and an award-winning scientist.

[...]

At 1:00 in

Nobel: I’m very concerned, as many scientist are, because elevated levels of radioactive contamination has been detected throughout Japan — and which is almost even worse, is that also in Hawaii and in the Western United States, particularly in the water and milk sources.

[...]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUv5aATKdLc

Wikipedia: [...] a co-founder and former Chairman of the Nobel Charitable Trust, and most commonly known for his part in developing the Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI). [...] Dr. Nobel is a consultant on energy issues and gives regular keynote lectures on the subject. He serves as a guest professor at the Solutions Science Research Laboratory at the Tokyo Institute of Technology, University of Japan, one of the world’s foremost institutions in its field. [...]

Published: September 3rd, 2012 at 1:52 am ET
By

111 comments

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111 comments to Nobel: Radioactive contamination in Western US and Hawaii a concern — “Particularly in the water and milk sources” -CBS (VIDEO)

  • TheBigPicture TheBigPicture

    True, U.S. is not the place to be (for many years to come), thanks to spewing nuclear reactors.


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  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    I couldn't tell from listening to the video that Dr. Nobel said that the radiation contamination was worse in the US than in Japan.

    Also Dr. Nobel is not a medical doctor that I can see:

    “Dr. Michael Nobel has a lengthy educational background which began at Harvard Business School in Cambridge, Massachusetts. In 1967, Nobel completed his studies at the Graduate Institute of Communications in Stockholm. Years later, in 1979, Dr. Michael Nobel obtained a doctorate in psycho-pedagogy at the University of Lausanne. His thesis evaluated the effectiveness of substance abuse prevention programs in Switzerland.[5]…”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Nobel

    Also, Pro-pectin is not made from organic apples, nor do they advertise what the special apples are that Dr. Nobel talked about. Neither the advertised link nor Dr. Nobel specified where the apples come from. If it is from an irradiated area, good luck.

    Also, contrary to the visual in the video, the residents around Chernobyl only took apple pectin, not the Pro-Pectin advertised by the video.

    So how can the advertisement call his a medical advisor, when Dr. Nobel has no medical education?
    http://propectin.com


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    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      more from Wikipedia:

      "A member of the Nobel-Oleinikoff branch of the Nobel family, Michael Nobel is the grandson of Marta Helena Nobel-Oleinikoff (née Nobel) and the great-grandson of industrialist and humanitarian Ludvig Nobel, the founder of Branobel and one of the world's richest men in his time."


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    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      Branobel
      “The Petroleum Production Company Nobel Brothers, Limited,or Branobel (short for cable communications meaning Nobel Brothers in Russian), was an oil company set up by Ludvig Nobel and Baron Peter von Bilderling, in Baku, Azerbaijan. Originally established by Robert Nobel (who contributed 25,000 rubles) and the investments of barons Peter von Bilderling (300,000 rubles) and Standertskjöld (150,000 rubles) as a distillery in 1876, it became, during the late 19th century, one of the largest oil companies in the world….”
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Branobel


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    • lam335 lam335

      Excellent analysis, Anne. I was thinking some of the same things. I agree with you that, given his phrasing, he is not necessarily saying that the amount of rad contamination in North America is worse than that in Japan (which is extremely unlikely, given the highly radioactive hotspots, etc., being discovered as far as Tokyo–not to mention the incineration program that continues to spread cesium across the country).

      I was also wondering where the apples come from; he does't say. Fukushima has given up a world in which some of the most healthful foods are not necessarily healthful anymore–such a leafy greens like spinach, any fruits from the west coast, etc. They may have been great apples once, but post-Fuku, the question of where they are coming from is crucial.

      Thanks for looking up this man's credentials.

      I'm not sure that this site should post advertisements like this. Pectin may or may not help remove impurities from the body, but I have qualms about anything that has the appearance of trying to make a profit off of people's legitimate post-Fuku fears regarding their own–and especially their children's–health.


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      • MCBEKRL

        Doesnt it depend on what he wants to do with his profits. For example, if he used them to help victims of this tragedy, would you be opposed to that?


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        • Maggie123

          McBerkrl – IMO, there should be no profits from a product such as this, for the purpose intended. IMO, such a product should be made available at cost – and by that I do mean all legitimate costs. The company need not lose money but should not accrue profit. This is probably a "personal philosophy/values" matter so many may not agree with me. But I do not view human health issues as appropriate for profit gains. (Other consumer products, fine, but not life/death support products IMO.) Groups, government agencies, or individuals who might purchase such a product have enough costs as it is. IMO there's no need to turn extra dollars over to a Nobel or whomever might profit and let that whomever "decide" where the "extra" dollars can do some good. The people who don't pay extra to cover profit can spend what did not go to cover profit on other necessities – or can make donations themselves to worthy causes. (That seems a tangly way to explain – hope it makes sense!) :)


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    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      The following study was based on citrus pectin, not apple pectin:

      Gig Tr Prof Zabol. 1991;(12):8-10.
      [Further improvement in the administration of pectin as a preventive agent against absorption of radionuclides by human body].
      [Article in Russian]
      Romanenko AE, Dereviago IB, Litenko VA, Obodovich AN.
      Abstract
      "The radioprotective properties of pectin-vitamin powder (PVP) were investigated. PVP was prepared from dry citrus (lemon, orange) peels by special technology. Besides unavailable carbohydrates, it contains pectin (more than 15%), vitamins B, C, P, PP, mineral components. PVP effectively protected from incorporation of radionuclides contained in food products. The blocking effect of PVP was found essentially higher than that of sodium alginate or dry pectins. The optimal daily dose was experimentally defined."
      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1817090


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      • BreadAndButter BreadAndButter

        Agreed anne and Iam, I think the headline is a bit misleading. To me he seems to say that not the levels are higher in the US, but he is more concerned by radiation in the US than he is by radiation in Japan.
        Which is, if he meant it how it came across to me, quite an unfriendly thing to say.


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        • ENENews

          Hello all,

          After transcribing Nobel's words I understood him to mean that radiation contamination in Hawaii/Western US is "almost even worse" than it is "throughout" Japan. So, more of a comparison of the average contamination around Japan vs. the US's most contaminated areas.

          I see the phrasing is open for debate, so I changed the headline.

          Also, didn't notice CBS Atlanta mention this was an advertisement. Unable to find the 'Better Atlanta' website, here's the closest:
          http://www.cbsatlanta.com/category/211544/better-health
          http://www.cbsatlanta.com/category/209315/bettermornings

          ————————-

          "I’m very concerned, as many scientist are, because elevated levels of radioactive contamination has been detected throughout Japan — and which is almost even worse, is that also in Hawaii and in the Western United States, particularly in the water and milk sources."


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          • lam335 lam335

            The Media sometimes present segments that are in effect advertisements, whether or not they appear during the actual news show or during a scheduled commercial break.

            This segment clearly is, in effect (and, I suspect, purpose) an advertisement, regardless what the CBS Atlanta producers might have labelled it.


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      • Sickputer

        Good article anne… Too bad the free abstract of the study didn't delineate the "optimal dose" of pectin.

        Perhaps this other article can help in the dose required and timing of ingestion daily:

        "Dosages: MCP [modifed citrus pectin] /modified alginate formula – start with 3 capsules, twice daily, on an empty stomach, at least a half hour before food. Best taken early morning and before bed. If radiation exposure becomes imminent, increase to 4 capsules, three times a day for as long as there is radiation exposure and for 2-4 weeks thereafter, then reduce to 4 capsules twice daily for one month, followed by 3 capsules, twice daily until there are no traces of radiation readings and damage."

        http://dreliaz.blogspot.com/2011/03/nuclear-radiation-protection-protocol.html?m=1

        SP: Sodium alginate is also extremely good at binding to toxic metals and carrying them through the digestive tract.


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  • Grampybone Grampybone

    The shear quantity of alpha emitters withing 250km alone will be enough to cause sky shine phenomenon for decades resulting in contamination "Pectin" can't protect from. Human cell tissue can expunge some Cesium 137, however plutonium is far too fast acting to stop from colliding into a cell nucleus with an extra strong "apple coating" (lol). Oppenheimer would slap this man right now. Right in the face. Repeatedly. It's a burning hot piece of continually reacting nuclear bi-product…not some cuddly little fuel air bomb or white-phosphorous roman candle. Fukushima has released a magnitude of elements we have yet to see take effect in many species of animals so to suggest that anything other than avoiding rain and the Northern Hemisphere you may be safer than the next guy. Go right ahead Mr. NoBel tell me how your product is designed to save me from eating pieces of fuel rod…It won't and your a fool if you think some of us are safer than others.


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    • andagi andagi

      Dear Grampybone,
      'It's a burning hot piece of continually reacting nuclear bi-product…not some cuddly little fuel air bomb or white-phosphorous roman candle.' Thank you for this fiercely honest description. Folks need to really get this and if/when some of us start getting ill -we need to clearly state what we were doing in March 2011, especially outdoor activities and make it part of our medical record. No more cover-ups, for me anyway. I wish there were lawyers lined up in the US.
      Thanks again :)
      Aloha.


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    • andagi andagi

      Dear Grampybone,
      I have a wonderful recipe for 'crispy, fiercely fresh fuel rods with hot sweet/sour sauce' :) Lovely over steamed Fukurice. On special now!
      Aloha.


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  • Atomfritz Atomfritz

    Most of this contamination is probably home-made.

    Remember that the affected fallout regions are downwind of the Nevada Test Site (NTS) where far more plutonium was released into air than all the three molten Fukushima reactors contained together.


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    • hbjon hbjon

      I don't remember that less plutonium was released into the air from Fukushima than Nevada bomb tests. Don't they harvest plutonium from spent fuel? Older spent fuel has more plutonium. How many millions of pounds of spent fuel were at Fukushima? Did you not see the npp's blow their guts into the air in spectacular fashion? That glowing pellet you have there. Is that a fuel pellet? What percentage of Pu239? Your not saying it is pure Pu239 are you?


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      • Atomfritz Atomfritz

        A normal modern reactor contains roughly 1 ton of plutonium. (Even light water reactors breed some plutonium).
        Thus we can estimate the plutonium in the Fukushima coriums at around 3 tonnes, of which only a very very small quantity was released and mostly fell out in a 100 kilometer range around Fuku-I.

        On the other hand, for one-stage nuclear bombs you can estimate the plutonium content at roughly 1 kg per kiloton.
        (For two-stage and especially for three-stage bombs there is needed less plutonium.)

        If you add up the kilotons detonated at NTS you can roughly estimate the quantity of plutonium finely dispersed in the air, as the nuclear bomb efficiency varies between 10% to 20%, meaning that 80% to 90% of the plutonium used doesn't get fissioned but becomes fallout.

        So you see, the abundancy of plutonium in western US soils is home-made pollution.


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        • hbjon hbjon

          Remember, I don't believe much anymore, but I can accept some of what you say here. One question remains somewhat obscure. That is the phenomenon of aerosolizing fuel and plutonium that reacts with elements in our atmosphere. If you could witness the plumes from the explosion for longer than a 5 second clip, how much keeps rising into the atmosphere? You say one ton per core. Does that include cores in the sfp's. I believe there are hundreds within the 5 pools.


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        • Atom Fritz I disagree on your plutonium assessment.

          I agree that US atmospheric testing was atrocious.

          However, I disagree that Fukushima produced less plutonium than atmospheric testing.

          Everything I've read indicates that atomic and hydrogen bombs use far less plutonium than produced in nuclear reactors.

          Keep in mind that unit 3 had Mox fuel.

          Additionally, the nuclear atmospheric detonations occurred high in the atmosphere and it is believed that much of the atmospheric contamination is still high up in the atmosphere.

          Furthermore, we have NO IDEA how much plutonium was actually released in the explosions because plutonium is not easy to detect and no one is reporting findings other than a few European studies.

          Do you recall that plutonium was detected in Lithuania?

          I've compiled data on plutonium detections here:

          http://majiasblog.blogspot.com/2012/08/plutonium-from-fukushima.html

          Finally, Japan has been stockpiling plutonium for years. We have no idea what reactors in Japan also suffered severe problems and had releases:

          http://majiasblog.blogspot.com/2012/06/why-does-japans-plutonium-stockpiling.html

          Tokai had many problems and plutonium was surely stored there. My link above has more links to information I've collected about Tokai and other reactors.


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        • Atomfritz Atomfritz

          @ hbjon & majia

          Thank you for your replies.

          The nuclear bomb fallout distribution is a very interesting topic by itself.
          It depends on many factors and cannot be generalized easily.
          For example, land, water- or air-based detonation, bomb size and design, presence of uranium tamper, mushroom height (almost 65km at the tsar bomba) and much more.

          But I think it's proof enough that the governments know about the dangers, and so agreed for a moratorium in 1962, at the climax of the cold war.

          Strontium accumulation in the human body reached a very dangerous level, and this was the reason for the test ban.

          Other details:
          32 Mox assemblies of 548 really don't change the reactor's plutonium content in a relevant manner. Thus this MOX hystery is exaggerated. The Mox problem is mainly a matter of reactivity control, which gets more complicated and reduces the safety margin of reactors not designed to run with reactor plutonium.
          The Lithuanian plutonium probably is Chernobyl heritage (remember, the plume of the reactor blaze was four kilometers high, and VERY VERY dirty.
          Actually there is no place on the world where no plutonium fallout can be measured, but far most was from atmospheric bomb tests.

          Gotta go shop, maybe more details later.


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          • JustmeAlso

            Guessing where anthropogenic Pu contamination comes from is not very scientific,but more greed drivven, especially when humans know it comes from uranium fission in uranium powered nuke reactors. or MOX for that matter.


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          • Sickputer

            I think we give too much human compassion credit to the 1963 nucleocrats who ushered in the first atmospheric ban on nuclear testing. They have never given a damn about people's health.

            Instead, they were worried about damage to military infrastructure by the tests. The US whacked a bunch of outer space assets and ground damages occurred in Hawaii and New Zealand from Starfish Prime.

            Then the Russians proved the EMP dangers from big bombs:

            "The worst effects of a Soviet high-altitude test occurred on 22 October 1962 (during the Cuban missile crisis), in ‘Operation K’ (ABM System A proof tests) when a 300 kt missile-warhead detonated near Dzhezkazgan at 290-km altitude. The EMP fused 570 km of overhead telephone line with a measured current of 2,500 A, started a fire that burned down the Karaganda power plant, and shut down 1,000-km of shallow-buried power cables between Aqmola and Almaty.

            The Partial Test Ban Treaty was passed the following year, ending atmospheric and exoatmospheric nuclear tests. The Outer Space Treaty of 1967 banned the stationing and use of nuclear weapons in space. The Comprehensive Nuclear-Test-Ban Treaty of 1996 prohibits all kinds of nuclear explosions; whether over- or underground, underwater or in the atmosphere."

            http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-altitude_nuclear_explosion#section_2


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      • Sickputer

        I toss in on AF's estimates…The nuclear tests just from America may exceed current (and future Fukushima) plutonium releases. 10 tons was one estimate for the US tests. Add in the other super powers and the figure doubles.

        But those bomb tests were spread out over nearly 70 years. Fukushima does have tons of plutonium (some reprocessed from France, the rest created by "normal" reactor fuel conversions over 5 decades and held in the seven spent fuel ponds.

        Fukushima's plutonium releases from the Unit 3 explosion and the numerous spent fuel fires probably sets a record for most plutonium vaporized in a single year. Add in the water washes over residue fuel and coriums and the leaching of that bleed water into the Pacific and you have another huge dispersal of plutonium particles as well as the other 1,000 plus toxins.


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        • Atomfritz Atomfritz

          SP, if you take into account the longevity of plutonium, it actually doesn't matter much whether the deposits were created in the course of 70 years or by means of a single event.

          Plutonium is hard to distribute, as it is a heavy metal with a high melting point. Actually, the only effective method to spread plutonium over a wide range is to finely-disperse it in high altitude (i.e. mushroom cloud).

          The largest fission-only bomb ever ignited was 700 kilotons, iirc it contained 465 kilograms of fissile material (not sure if it was U-235 or Pu). If it was Pu, then you can expect a Pu release of 400 kilograms in a single blast.

          Chernobyl released only 1-2 percent of the Pu in the reactor, while it was blazing in open air, yielding a 4-kilometer-high plume.
          Compared with that, Fukushima was just a dud.

          Two interesting links with some detail regarding this topic:
          About plutonium toxic properties: http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp143.pdf
          About nuclear blasts: docs.nrdc.org/nuclear/nuc_01019501a_138.pdf


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          • Sickputer

            Longevity of plutonium is the same, but point of issuance and timing is also important. Some a-bomb tests were exoatmospheric and still have particles that filter down to atmospheric levels. But most plutonium fallout long ago fell to earth in single events over 70 years. Sediment along the ocean seashores and inland soil sediment layers hopefully covers a large percentage of the old test particles. Not totally safe from disturbance, but safer than wind blown fresh deposits.

            Fukushima NPP is unique in that it is a major plutonium polluter that is continual. Mostly now the danger is radioactive water flow to the ocean, but emissions through the air have been non-stop for over 500 days. Some of the super heated vaporized isotopes have risen to the jet stream and spread worldwide.  

            Comparing old nuclear tests to nuclear plant disasters is comparing cherries to apples. Nuclear plants in full meltdown mode disperse more isotopes and the effects linger longer. Atomic bomb tests have many variables and the physical location and the specific type (ground, air, or subsurface) is  important in assessing fallout patterns.


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            • Atomfritz Atomfritz

              Don't worry, SP. Plutonium dispersal needs high temperature and large plume height to achieve some range.

              The actual current gaseous releases of Fuku are according to last Tepco "information" 0.01 Bq/day. I suppose they just accidentally confused Bq with Ci. 0.01 Ci (Curie) is still 370 million Bq.

              And, this are apparently mainly noble gases and the such, not really relevant.
              On the other hand, Kr-85 has been suspected of being a major contributor to the ozone hole.

              So, don't worry about plutonium releases from the Fuku duds.
              Their releases to water are much more important than the air releases now.


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              • Sickputer

                Oh the plumes and outgassings are plenty hot to rise into the jetstream:

                Repost from August 18, 2011: (Part 1).

                I guess you can also see why I say the lag effect for big plumes to get to North America is 8-10 days using the lower altitude winds…wind knot speeds are in the 20 to 35 knot range…the 100 to 200 mile an hour jetstream is way up high in the atmosphere and requires supercharged ejections of nuclear radiation for the most part or really super hot particles (which we have certainly seen) to rise into its path.
                More on wind patterns: an older post of mine from June 11, 2011.

                I have been trying to track the wind patterns using other methods and also verbalize with my non-scientific background if the rise [of reactor radiation] to the jet stream is a premise even possible.
                First the premise involves the old scientific fact that hot air rises and cools as it meets colder temperatures. How far it goes up is the million dollar question for hot radioactive ground clouds. Now here is a little background blurb:
                http://www.srh.noaa.gov/jetstream/synoptic/clouds.htm

                “As a bubble or parcel of air rises it moves into an area of lower pressure (pressure decreases with height). As this occurs the parcel expands. This requires energy, or work, which takes heat away from the parcel. So as air rises it cools. This is called an adiabatic process.
                The rate at which the parcel cools with increasing elevation is called the “lapse rate”.


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                • Sickputer

                  Part 2:

                  The rate at which the parcel cools with increasing elevation is called the “lapse rate”. The lapse rate of unsaturated air (air with relative humidity <100%) is 5.4°F per 1000 feet (9.8°C per kilometer). This is called the dry lapse rate. This means for each 1000 feet increase in elevation, the air temperature will decrease 5.4°F.
                  Since cold air can hold less water vapor than warm air, some of the vapor will condense onto tiny clay and salt particles called condensation nuclei. The reverse is also true.
                  As a parcel of air sinks it encounters increasing pressure so it is squeezed inward.
                  This adds heat to the parcel so it warms as it sinks. Warm air can hold more water vapor than cold air, so clouds tend to evaporate as air sinks"
                  June 12th post continued:
                  As the massive superheated cloud obscured the plant during the 7 hour time frame ending about 4 AM Japanese time the hot cloud had the heat potential to rise easily 20,000 feet (less than the height of Mt. McKinley, to the lower edges of the jetstream)…at that point it is still over 50 degrees hot in the lower zone of the jetstream wind movement. The radioactive atmospheric particles start cooling more as they hit the faster area of the jetstream at 32,000 feet (a little above Mt. Everest height) and now lose temperature rapidly and may latch onto other windblown particles. Ready to fall when opportunities and conditions ari


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                  • Sickputer

                    Part 3:

                    At that point the toxic cloud (maybe cirrus wisps in shape) is zooming eastward through the Northern jetstream rapidly. How fast can it travel this time of the year? Well, it’s nearly summer and temperatures are warmer up in the jetstream and below compared to fall and winter and early spring. Zooming along the jetstream helps shape and direct the path of typhoons and hurricanes.
                    Oh yeah…they just developed that knowledge not too many years ago.
                    Data on the Internet does notabound for jetstream speeds. NASA probably knows better than anyone, but sharing is another thing. So for the jetstream movement this week in the Pacific region let’s turn to someone who appreciates wind…our surfer friends:
                    http://www.stormsurfing.com/cgi/display_alt.cgi?a=npac_250

                    Now looking at that I am guessing a rough speed range of between 75 to 100 miles per hour for the west coast of America. That’s significant because lower speed ground winds may meander at about 20 mph as they have little resistance in the ocean, but not as much energy as the jetstream. So at 20 MPH the front edge of the plume might arrive at Seattle (4,615 miles away from the nuclear plant) in well over 200 hours or about that 8 day lag so many experts claim.


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                    • Sickputer

                      Part 4:

                      BTW, you can measure your distance from Fukushima at the URL below. It seems to have received a lot of hits lately by how fast it auto fills as you type. *;-)
                      http://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between.htm

                      But if some or a lot of the ugly cloud that just literally boiled out of the plant on Friday did make it up to the jetstream then the time it takes to arrive in Seattle now becomes much quicker…46 hours for the 100 MPH wind and 62 hours for the 75 mile sustained winds. That potentially puts the beginnings of the plume in Seattle early Sunday morning at 4 AM with sustained flow for seven hours or so. If it was the slower jetstream model then later Sunday night the leading edge will pass over Seattle. I guess you can figure your jetstream impact for your city or town based on your time zone difference from Seattle.
                      Now that doesn’t mean the bad seeds will drop out evenly and descend to earth in a uniform plume. That’s too tidy with the vagaries of the earth’s atmosphere. Side winds, storms, other vapors, all these things can make one place become the proverbial hotspot dumping area and another spot adjacent remains fairly pristine (for now), But one thing is for sure, the cloud is coming and it will not all drop in the government-vaunted “vast” ocean.

                      Take care.

                      SP

                      http://enenews.com/doctor-tokyo-attributes-symptoms-radiation-exposure-begun-increased-nosebleeds-stubborn-cases-diarrhea-flu-like-symptoms-children/comment-page-1


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        • Johnny Blade Johnny Blade

          I'm gonna set up the tooth fairy with a micro-GPS,x-mitter hidden in a tooth and track her ass back to her lair so I can heist her stash of baby-boomer teeth and then compare them to the findings on analysis of pre,and post-3/11/11 baby teeth and post the results for the world to see….well,"maybe"??!…I just noted that the micro GPS transmitter is stamped with the G.E. logo which makes the device more likely to fail at it's intended mission… :(


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      • Atomfritz Atomfritz

        Yes, my avatar is a piece of plutonium-238 (not Pu-239!).
        I like it.

        Isn't it warm (800 degs C) and cosy?

        The recent Mars rover is driven with several kilograms of that cosy substance.
        Luckily the launch didn't fail like Challenger!

        Actually I'd love to have a Soviet strontium RTG as domestic heater and electric supplier in my basement, as radioactive strontium is cheap and abundant, doesn't need to be produced with much effort like Pu-238!
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator


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  • Maggie123

    Thank you Admin, Anne, and others who've commented here – Anne, for the extra time taken to look up info and share. I'm glad to read "reservations". I was uncomfortable with the video. If Dr. Nobel is aware of water contamination in Hawaii and on the US West Coast he should have given supporting data and should have given geographical information that better pinned down what he means by the "west coast". His comments re Pro-pectin, including that it's "from a specific apple only growing in one place" added to what felt a "proprietary" attitude and marketing language on behalf of the product. It did not feel like his mission was primarily to inform. I wandered off after listening, wondering what company makes the product and whether or not the company has shareholders waiting for dividend checks from profits to be made of extreme misfortune and anxieties. I don't like to hold such suspicions but in today's world it's wise to know underlying motivation of products advertised.

    I hope there's not a "run" on this product given the limited information on it in the video. If this product has some real value, I'm pretty unhappy at how it's being brought to public attention. (Close to outraged, actually, but am holding off until more is known.)


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  • Anthony Anthony

    This has to be some of the most responsible and honest scientific opinions expressed in the press on the matter to date. Until now there wasn't proof the scientific community even acknowledged what we discuss here daily.


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  • kalidances

    I'm not sure why people are attempting to discredit Noble. He's not a doctor but he is a business man with a lot of money and power. He can literally pick up the phone and call any research scientist on the planet who has won the Noble price for science, chemistry, or medicine, any time he likes. It is possible for him to hire scientists to make his assertions. No businessman will put money into any potential project without research. The 2011 winners for Medicine/Physiology are Bruce A. Beutler, Jules A. Hoffmann, Ralph M. Steinman. Guess what they won for? http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/2011/#


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  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Pectin of all varieties can be purchased in bulk..on-line.


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  • fuckyoushima

    Biochimie. 2006 Nov;88(11):1837-41. Epub 2006 Sep 28.
    Comparison of Prussian blue and apple-pectin efficacy on 137Cs decorporation in rats.
    Le Gall B, Taran F, Renault D, Wilk JC, Ansoborlo E.
    Source

    CEA/DSV/DRR/SRCA/LRT, Bruyères-le-Châtel, France. Beatrice.le-gall@cea.fr
    Abstract

    Cesium-137 (137Cs) is one of the most important nuclear fission elements that contaminated the environment after the explosion of the Chernobyl nuclear power plant in Ukraine (1986). The aim of the study was to compare the efficacy of two chelating agent, Prussian blue and apple-pectin on 137cesium decorporation in rats. Rats were intravenously injected with a solution of 137cesium (5 kBq per rat). Chelating agents, Prussian blue or apple-pectin were given immediately after Cs contamination and during 11 days by addition of each chelating agent in drinking water at a concentration corresponding to 400 mg kg(-1) day(-1). Efficiency was evaluated 11 days after contamination (at the end of treatment) through their ability to promote Cs excretion and to reduce the radionuclide accumulation in some retention compartments (blood, liver, kidneys, spleen, skeleton and in the remaining carcass). In these conditions after treatment with Prussian blue a fivefold increase in fecal excretion of Cs was observed and was associated with a reduction in the radionuclide retention in the main organs measured. In contrast, no significant differences were observed between untreated rats and rats treated with…


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    • fuckyoushima

      this chap was shaking his head NO as he extolled the great benefits of his product

      he is full of shit, smells it and therefore knows it


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      • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

        Wow…then many people are being misled..by this type data?
        "Yablokov et al., writing in Chernobyl: Consequences of the Catastrophe for People and the Environment, quote research conducted by the Ukrainian Center of Radiation Medicine and the Belarussian Institute of Radiation Medicine and Endocrinology with the conclusion that "adding pectin preparations to the food of inhabitants of the Chernobyl-contaminated regions promotes an effective excretion of incorporated radionuclides". The authors report on the positive results of using pectin food additive preparations in a number of clinical studies conducted on children in severely polluted areas, with up to 50% improvement over control groups.[10]"
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pectin


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        • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

          PS..Perhaps he is trying to "corner the market".


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        • fuckyoushima

          Swiss Med Wkly. 2004 Jan 10;134(1-2):24-7.
          Reducing the 137Cs-load in the organism of "Chernobyl" children with apple-pectin.
          Nesterenko VB, Nesterenko AV, Babenko VI, Yerkovich TV, Babenko IV.
          Source

          Belrad Institute of Radiation Safety, Charity House, 11 Staroborisovsky Trakt, 220114 Minsk, Republic of Belarus. nester@hmti.ac.by
          Abstract

          As a complement of standard radioprotective measures, apple-pectin preparations are given, especially in the Ukraine, to reduce the 137Cs uptake in the organism of children. The question has been raised: is oral pectin also useful when children receive radiologically clean food, or does this polysaccharide only act in binding 137Cs in the gut, blocking its intestinal absorption? In this case, pectin would be useless if radiologically clean food could be given. The study was a randomised, double blind placebo-controlled trial comparing the efficacy of a dry and milled apple-extract containing 15-16% pectin with a similar placebo-powder, in 64 children originating from the same group of contaminated villages of the Gomel oblast. The average 137Cs load was of about 30 Bq/kg bodyweight (BW). The trial was conducted during the simultaneous one-month stay in the sanatorium Silver Spring. In this clean radiological environment only radiologically "clean" food is given to the children. The average reduction of the 137Cs levels in children receiving oral pectin powder was 62.6%, the reduction with "clean" food and placebo was 13.9%,…


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          • fuckyoushima

            fair enough.

            it looks like in the first study – the rats were injected with cs

            (apple pectin is not digested nor absorbed – its fiber)

            in the human studies the children are being exposed for an ongoing basis in the food which is in their gi tract and thereby chelatable or bindable

            so it works if you are still eating cs, but if it is already in your body this stuff wont help.


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            • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

              Well.there goes a few mother's hopes dashed..


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            • fuckyoushima

              well.. even that hypothesis doesnt make complete sense… there are inconsistencies in the literature.

              some cs may be recirculated through the biliary system, which may be bindable and represent a true body burden reduction.

              we should measure the cesium in the childrens stools.


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  • ShineTheLight

    The radiation does not magically disappear once it hits the Western US. That is convenient thinking. But, it is false and misleading. The perpetuation of this "myth" by many is even murderous. Perhaps unintentional….? Nonetheless, it causes Midwest,Southern and East Coast mothers to think that their children are safe from harm because they are "fortunate" enough not to live out West. Is that the point? Minimize panic by sacrificing only one geographic area. Let's get updated side by side data on air, soil, food, water and milk from all regions,consistently updated, then debate contamination impact.


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  • Tumrgrwer Tumrgrwer

    WTF, "Fuku painc mongering." As outrageous as it may seem, 3 full core melt downs have little to do with mongering other than what I read from your posts. The tumors I've been growing are Fuku panic- mongering me to death!

    Let us be kind, one to another, for we are each of us together in our pain!

    -monger
    comb. form
    denoting a dealer or trader in a specified commodity: fishmonger | cheesemonger.
    • a person who promotes a specified activity, situation, or feeling, esp. one that is undesirable or discreditable: rumormonger | warmonger. "fearmonger:"
    ORIGIN Old English mangere, from mangian ‘to traffic,’ of Germanic origin, based on Latin mango ‘dealer.’


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  • Tumrgrwer Tumrgrwer

    You can tell Atomfritz hasn't been reading his lessons…look up "buckyballs" filled with plutonium and what they might have already done to your lungs. My lungs are damaged by these floating balls of godlessness.


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  • Sol Man

    No panic mongering. The whole of the world needs only the truth, about this, the most devastating circumstance ever encountered by humans, and the entire world. The topic of tipping point is absolutely appropriate.


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  • razzz razzz

    Looks like an info commercial to me. If this product is effective or any other product is effective the nuclear industry should be handing it out for free.

    Special apple trees?

    http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-500-PECTIN.aspx?activeIngredientId=500&activeIngredientName=PECTIN


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    • It's a TV COMMERCIAL for pectin supplement that uses somebody with a name while pretending to be a CBS News program. So it's sort of a news-like infomercial.

      The problem is some facts about Fukushima slipped in while other things like 'evacuating children' and the ongoing severity are ignored.

      A real "NEWS" article should provide factual information about the benefits of Apples/Pectin and why, NOT where to buy it.
      [re-post]
      ___________

      How did his TREES and WATER go uncontaminated?
      Maybe they are indoor hydroponic trees?


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      • Maggie123

        ChasAha – will add this to my list below of "ingredients" used in marketing as #8! You're so right – "some facts sprinkled in" (discourages viewer's rational mind from rejecting overall message.) Thanks!


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  • CaptD CaptD

    Nuclear waste dumped at “SEA”
    Ocean disposal of radioactive waste:
    Status report: http://is.gd/tiugbX

    Note it is also been dumped around California, for all to enjoy!
    Maybe that is now also part of our Background readings!


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  • Pierpont

    This is nothing but disgusting fear-mongering for commercial purposes. There should be zero tolerance for this BS and it surely doesn't belong on a website dedicated to providing accurate and unbiased information. People might well come to the conclusion that this site is being paid to show this crap, in which case the site loses its credibility as does its owner, Gunderson.

    Look at this Nobel dude's "results" — very carefully crafted BS. It says children "taking Propectin" had a reduction of Cs 137 by 62%. So? Doesn't say a word about the reduction in controls or in those taking other forms of pectin. This is just a crass, misleading infomercial.

    A lot of people, mostly "experts", are cashing in on Fukushima. Keep your eye on them.


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    • razzz razzz

      People need the exposure to 'mis-information' so they can see how it works and what to look for.

      When TEPCO and/or the Japanese government resorts to using Windows Paint to alter photographs then you know they think everyone are complete idiots to be manipulated.


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    • Maggie123

      Pierpoint and Razzz – "fear mongering for commercial purposes" and "exposure to show how it works, what to look for." 100% agreement! Because this video is brief, it would be a prime resource for me if I were still teaching. It's a classic – excellent for analysis.

      Among "ingredients" 1-"voice of authority" = double whammy mix of "reassurance and superior knowledge"(usually with meds industry it's a physician as per constant meds commercials running all the time.) 2- "dread condition can be healed" (This commercial stoops to the extreme dishonor of using an actual and well-founded deep worry, more common meds industry commercials introduce "newly diagnosable" conditions). 3- "Sophisticated laboratory technology creates the remedy" (unspoken – "don't expect to concoct a replication more cheaply".) 4- Remedy is "not readily available" (only a certain plant, grows only in a certain region, you won't find it where you live.) 5- Language of urgency (in this case known to already exist in minds of target audience, more commonly viewer/listeners are urged to "see doctor asap" to "maintain or increase quality of life".) 6- This one lacks imagery of suffering or smiling client in a sunlit setting.

      I'm impressed with ENE community's constant awareness of our world's abundant mis-information. I hope this is representative of general population. (We've got misinformation in *all* marketing, including politics!)


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      • Maggie123

        Thought of one more classic persuasive ingredient: 7- use of the "some people say" or "we all know" argument. He does this without directly saying either phrase when he uses Hawaii and the West Coast as "evidence".

        It may be true that "some people say." But genuine, honest, argument requires that he either supply data and cite his source, or admit he's not yet got supporting data. He does neither – rather he "plants" the notion that he's got information about Hawaii and the WC.

        "We all know" (directly stated or not) is never truth. Any statement that says or implies "everyone", "all", is logically inaccurate. (Except for universal absolutes such as "everyone is born and everyone eventually dies".)

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies (I've not studied the list .. am generally aware from other studies … I keep meaning to tackle logical fallacies as more formal study but it's not at top of my to-do list!)


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        • Maggie123

          ChasAha: "some facts about Fukushima slipped in". This, too, is classic! Ingredient #8! Sprinkling of known facts has psychological effect of discouraging viewer's natural rational analytical thought processes.

          It's especially in use with current political campaign – I hope my 'wider net' doesn't offend but for me this video is highly relevant both re "vulture marketing" to deeply troubled populations on the specific issue of radioactive contamination, — and also as vital instruction so that we generally can be less easily persuaded on *any* matter of consequence.


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      • Maggie123

        "Pierpont" (sorry for misspelling!)


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  • aigeezer aigeezer

    "Michael Nobel has no relation whatsoever with the Nobel Foundation" – apparently this person has seen controversy before:

    http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2008-09-19/mumbai/27916636_1_nobel-prize-prestigious-prize-new-award


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    • Maggie123

      Interesting! Maybe this explains his almost meek low-key demeanor in the video. It seemed vaguely "odd", almost as if a part of him was thinking "I know I shouldn't be doing this but …".

      I thought I was probably over-reading – "body language" is not always as accurately read as we're sometimes encouraged to believe.


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  • kauaisoapbox

    I would bet money that "atomfritz" is Antiproton. Why the need to hide. Ugh!


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  • ProfitOfDoom ProfitOfDoom

    Hello ENENEWS people … has anyone here considered the idea of using amateur radio (ham) to communicate with IF/WHEN (I am betting "when") we lose the internet ? … I must confess that I am very vulnerable without this internet communication tool … if we lose "Devil Canyon NPP " (just south of my location about 25 miles) I reckon I would get my behind out of here ASAP … it's not exactly sitting on solid ground over there and were gonna see " UNO GRANDE " probably any day now.


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    • Johnny Blade Johnny Blade

      13 years and counting-as a FCC-licensed Amateur Radio Operator and a few "other" handy skills I'll not mention at the moment. Problem is that while "THEY" can't do much about "listening" in to RF communications signals-they sure the hell WILL be seeking out any "clandestine" signals being transmitted should the scenario you cited be something that has the country in a declared war which historically made "transmitting" illegal. There are modes of operation that allow using ham radio's interfaced with computers to access the internet over long distances although very limited in their uses and agonizingly s-l-o-w…kinda like me! lol :)


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  • ProfitOfDoom ProfitOfDoom

    The big problem when a lot of humanity begins to flee is serious communication breakdown ! (no kidding) … I am pretending to try and get out ahead of the problem here … anticipate and prepare for the new paradigm … Ungawa !


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  • ProfitOfDoom ProfitOfDoom

    About "Ungawa" ; When Tarzan needed help from his animal friends he would say "ungawa" when he was talking to them … when he needed everybody to come running you all know what he did, the famous Tarzan holler of course. Our animal friends really are our/my friends.


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  • CaptD CaptD

    Much more on the radioactive Ocean pollution problems in the comments here:

    Gundersen in Japan: Lawmakers told me they don’t believe Tepco or NISA — Crowd laughs out loud when Tepco responds to Unit 4 comments (VIDEO)

    http://enenews.com/?p=38550


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  • CaptD CaptD

    Regarding the solution to the highly radioactive water in Fukushima:

    Because the problem is of Global importance, I suggest that the Japanese Government immediately host a Conference of noted scientists to develop a solution to the pollution to the Pacific Ocean before it is allowed to get any worse! Each day that goes by yet more highly radioactive water is entering the Pacific Ocean at Fukushima and this cannot be allowed to continue!

    One solution they might consider is to capture the water and load it aboard large tankers to be slowly pumped overboard as the tanker sails IN A CAREFULLY PLANNED APPROVED route to truly speed up the dilution process by using all the oceans and seas …

    Comment from: http://enenews.com/?p=38516

    As it is now the Fukushima radioactive pollution is creating a dead spot off the coast of Japan due to the concentration of radioactive pollution that continues to be added there and that is far more dangerous to mankind than far, far lower levels spread over the entire Planet.

    Note: We all need to always use the words "radioactive pollution" instead of just "pollution" because one is quite different, than the other, ask The Japanese!


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  • CaptD CaptD

    Great News: Future of fossil fuels: Back-up for renewables
    http://wp.me/p26pKF-2Ff
    snip
    The two largest electricity utilities in Germany – E.ON and RWE – have declared they will build no more fossil fuel generation plants because they are not needed, challenging a widespread belief that the phasing out of nuclear in Europe’s most industrialized economy will require more coal-fired generation to be built.


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  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    I guess someone who had heavily invested in GE and the nuclear industry will now need to find another source of income.

    Magnetic Resonance Imaging
    http://www.gehealthcare.com/euen/mri/index.html

    I can't see any connection to MRI's for Dr. Nobel, on the basis of his education, other than as an investor.

    I suspect that organic modified citrus pectin is much more effective than the Propectin he is advertising.


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