Experts: Fukushima is “increasingly critical due to decay of buildings… reactor blocks are sinking… alarming cracks in foundation” — “It was built very poorly, Japan cannot deal with problem alone… it’s a big problem” (VIDEO)

Published: December 19th, 2013 at 6:15 pm ET
By
Email Article Email Article
93 comments


City of Berkeley City Council Meeting, Dec. 17, 2013 (at 2:25:00 in): Good evening, as many of you know I spent 13 years in the nuclear engineering department at Cal.  So I’m very familiar with the construction […] The reactor was designed poorly and also the way it was built was very poor and Japan cannot deal with the problem alone. […] The biggest part of the story is Japan by itself is not capable to fix the problem. We need to get the United Nations, the United States, all the countries — It is a big problem. [...]

Article in the German economics paper ‘Deutsche Wirtschafts Nachrichten’ on Oct. 9, 2013 translated by pixigirl: Fukushima – German physicist: “The probability that the rescue succeeds goes to zero” [...] The German physicist Sebastian Pfugbeil [President of the German Society for Radiological Protection] is extremely pessimistic that an elementary Fukushima disaster can be averted. The consequences would be felt over the entire northern hemisphere. [...] Pflugbeil explains the situation in Fukushima: “The situation is becoming increasingly critical due to the decay of the buildings. The fuel rods have not been brought to safety. The reactor blocks are sinking. The ground on which the reactor sits can no longer bear any weight…It is floating. There has been such dramatic shifts that there are 1 meter height differences between one corner to the other which have caused massive cracks in the building structure resulting in alarming cracks in the building foundation and soundness.” [...] It requires only a small earthquake or a storm surge or simply the failure of building structures to set this disaster in motion.” [...]

Watch speaker at the meeting here (starts at 2:25:00 in)

Published: December 19th, 2013 at 6:15 pm ET
By
Email Article Email Article
93 comments

Related Posts

  1. “Problem after problem after problem” at Japan’s restarted nuclear plant — Self-sustaining chain reaction to be established Monday morning (VIDEO) June 29, 2012
  2. NYTimes: Countries increasingly worried about Fukushima Unit 4 spent fuel — Experts: Concern over potential cracks in pool walls — Professors: “In deteriorating condition”; “This is a critical global issue”; “Could have fatal consequences for Japan” September 6, 2013
  3. Report from Fukushima: ‘Total levels of radiation are not decreasing at all’ — Japan gov’t ‘does nothing’ — ‘Individuals are left to deal with the problem’ May 21, 2012
  4. CNBC: Fukushima crisis “a global problem, not just a Japan problem” says professor… “Denial & cover-up clearly not working” — TV: “Many now say disaster has spun out of control, and its full extent hidden from public” (VIDEOS) September 5, 2013
  5. Gundersen: Fuel already “very close to going critical” at Unit 4 — Must be extraordinarily careful about starting chain reaction (VIDEO) November 15, 2013

93 comments to Experts: Fukushima is “increasingly critical due to decay of buildings… reactor blocks are sinking… alarming cracks in foundation” — “It was built very poorly, Japan cannot deal with problem alone… it’s a big problem” (VIDEO)

  • Styxhexenhammer666 Styxhexenhammer666

    Way back in 2012 anyone with even minor architectural or engineering knowledge could have told you the ramifications of pumping these buildings full of water while also building a containment wall when the foundations had already been likely damaged severely.

    It always surprises me when people ignore Fukushima, as though its distance from, say, the USA or Europe means it doesn't matter- you try to explain bioaccumulation and similar concepts and their eyes glaze over.


    Report comment

  • OldFool

    In California, I tried to explain to several engineers all the risks and the great danger of leaving the Fukushima reactors unrepaired and the molten cores where they are now. The engineers and other technical people got angry at me for saying so much nonsense. I feel like a passenger on the Titanic, watching the passengers argue over the rearrangement of the deck chairs, while the iceberg rapidly approaches. Perhaps the human race will richly deserve the coming disaster and spectacular face plant into the mud. One more close earthquake will trigger it any day now.


    Report comment

    • We Not They Finally

      Once it gets to people not being able to imagine disruption of their WAY OF LIFE, suddenly even scientific and technical realities don't seem to matter.


      Report comment

    • fireguyjeff fireguyjeff

      Styx, SPS, OF:
      As a career design engineer (ICs) with a fair bit of mental health training, I have this to offer. Hopefully it will help to explain the behaviors you are having to deal with.

      Fundamentalist thinking can be described as a rigid attachment to one or more "beliefs" or paradigm(s) while offering extreme resistance to accepting any new information or data that is in any way in conflict with the latter beliefs/paradigms.

      Such is the mind set of Islamic extremists, many variants of Judeo/Christian faith and "modern medicine". Yet probably the most rigid fundamentalist religion is science, especially physics.
      The personal academic history of de Broglie is a prime example.

      A healthy mind understands that change is the norm and that our perception of reality will always be changing as we learn more about it.

      Human cultures are inherently slow to accept change.

      Human behavior is such that what we are all dealing with here (enenews) is accepting and processing a reality (of Fuku) that severely threatens the comfort and status quo of Ken and Barbie.
      They do not have a Plan B in case what they believe turns out to be not quite correct. That terrifies them. It forces them to deal with their own mortality, which they will expend great effort to avoid doing.

      As the addictions lecturer Bob Earll makes clear:
      Change itself never killed anyone.
      Resistance to change has.


      Report comment

      • unincredulous unincredulous

        Is it too late to get a Fukushima Ken and Daichi Barbie doll for Christmas?

        Oh, nevermind, I guess I can just get any old Barbie and Ken dolls. Put them in the oven at 500 degrees for 6 or 8 hours = instant Fuku Ken and Barbie.


        Report comment

    • Anger covers fear. Fear comes with denial.

      Denial is not a river in Egypt.

      You planted a seed. It may take root and grow..

      Good work!

      Keep asking them questions, let them be the experts and try and answer your questions.. Feed their egos.. Let the questions trap them in their own denial..

      Then they force themselves to wake up.

      Just ask questions… people love to be 'experts'.


      Report comment

  • We Not They Finally

    What the German physicist above predicted early this past October about even just "a small earthquake or a storm surge" may well have already happened. Those two major typhoons plus the 7.3 earthquake, which we never got ANY damage reports about. Just radiation going exponentially up, up, up….

    Like we'd be told or something?


    Report comment

  • Sickputer

    Yes, people don't understand the dangers headed their way. But don't blame them. The history of the human race has experienced natural disasters, wars, animal attacks, and in all cases for surviving groups a handful of leaders stepped up with solutions.

    The leadership or lack of leadership today in the Northern Hemisphere is sorely lacking in ideas and resolve. When leaders fail to respond, populations suffer losses. Ask not what the common man can do for us, but ask what your leaders can do for everyone.


    Report comment

    • StPaulScout StPaulScout

      I do think Fukushima pretty much fucks the whole planet. Ocean currents run deep and it all does turn over.


      Report comment

      • StPaulScout StPaulScout

        Think how much radiation will be ex once the entire northern hemi is too poisonous for humans. How many other reactors go ex. 74 or so in the USA, 50-ish in Japan, about 50 in France, etc, etc, etc….. So much radiation, it kills everywhere and everything.


        Report comment

    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

      The entire world has been turned into one huge gambling/party house.

      Everything has a bet, to short or not, to go high or low, to invest or not, to buy or sell.

      This gamble/game did not pay off, unless you were on the inside, (like insider trading), and then you will make many billions on the downside of the equation/bet..

      The losers are all the laymen who allowed this entire Nuclear Industry to keep playing their purposefuly rigged game.. :(


      Report comment

  • Nick

    To this day I still shake my head in wonder when I realize how few people understand how f'd up fukushima was on 3/11.

    The very ground UNDER the buildings lurched several feet, ripping the complex into a tangled jumble of useless plumbing and containment.

    We are not talking about a melt-down or melt-thru, we are talking about a seismic shift in tectonic plates which tore the complex apart.

    Yeah the tsunami was bad enough but it was the earth itself that initiated the nightmare. Airlines to valves were severed. Reactor vessels cracked.

    This was FUBAR from the get go.


    Report comment

    • We Not They Finally

      That is SO WELL SAID. From the start, there was a concerted effort to downplay what the EARTHQUAKE did, because then it would not be possible to re-start reactors without upp-ing safety standards.

      Turns out that reality happens anyway, whether anyone highlights it or not… And now we pay.


      Report comment

  • Nick

    The decay of the buildings is not a surprise. You build on the cheap, you get cheap.

    Problem is……no nuclear plant in the world is really BUILT with the proper specs, it's all been done by risk assessment assholes who obviously aren't worth their 6 figure salaries!

    We have to admit that, yes, indeed the worse that possibly could happen, has happened.

    Going forward?

    Not sure. Maybe this is why the 2020 Olympics and shopping are all that the Japanese can grapple with. (no offense meant)


    Report comment

    • fireguyjeff fireguyjeff

      Nick:
      Reminds me of a job interview I had once with a consulting firm that specialized in signal analysis.

      Turned out one of their hot topics was the idea of how to detect and confirm a nuclear launch (from Russia).
      Some IR signatures can look just like a missile starting up, while
      it may be something else, or a missile test that has nothing to do with any threat.

      My point to them was so what if you calculate some high probability that what you are measuring is actually an ICBM launch. If it is a real launch and WWIII ensues, the probability
      calculation will be a moot point.
      They didn't get it and my response seemed to have thrown the interviewer off balance.

      They clearly did not appreciate my take on it.

      Didn't want that job any way.


      Report comment

      • We Not They Finally

        fireguyjeff, Arnie Gndersen, ho is pretty under-stated, just said that we are dealing with "low probability, high consequence" territory. In other words, don't go playing Russian roulette with the end of the world.


        Report comment

    • We Not They Finally

      Nick, what you call "risk assessment experts" is probably more like what we use to call "efficiency experts." Squeeze every penny to pay as little as possible.


      Report comment

    • Kashiko Kashiko

      I live in Japan and have for many years. Your observation shopping and Olympics is correct, you just forgot the most important thing….. the IPhone.


      Report comment

  • StPaulScout StPaulScout

    "The biggest part of the story is Japan by itself is not capable to fix the problem. We need to get the United Nations, the United States, all the countries — It is a big problem. [...]"

    This is a huge admission by the Japanese. Especially, "It is a big problem…".

    Once 3 shot it's load, it was all over folks.


    Report comment

  • Nick

    https://plus.google.com/101929026904107212747/about
    from Netc.com

    The future is gone. Love for today. Cherish the past.

    Nick out…


    Report comment

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    A conversation about the interaction between radiation and corium has to be addressed.

    "From p. 533, “Upon contact, the molten core material (the so-called “corium”) starts to react with the material of the basemat concrete… when the reaction zone is flooded with sump water… the highest temperatures might be reached… the molten-core – concrete interaction is the principal source of the release of the low-volatility fission products to the containment. The volatilization of these elements, such as barium, strontium, lanthanum, and cerium, is strongly supported by the gas bubbles which penetrate through the molten zone.”

    "The underground coriums are leaking strontium, americium, uranium, and plutonium. Re-criticalities in these coriums are releasing iodine-131, iodine-129, and a host of other isotopes into the air and sea. The ratio of strontium to cesium in seawater, previously at 2.65%, has now reached 44%."

    "It should be clear that Arnie Gundersen, who by all accounts is a competent nuclear engineer, is deliberately distorting the facts in an egregious manner. Any anti-nuclear persons, organizations, and message boards that support him should also be questioned."

    Molten corium-concrete interaction at Fukushima.
    April 2 2013

    http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/04/molten-corium-concrete-interaction-at-fukushima-2610028.html

    PS. The point of contention..
    Where is the corium?

    These emissions will have an affect on the ruins of the reactor.


    Report comment

    • KiloCharley KiloCharley

      Nice find Heart, Seems to be a death of a thousand cuts as this news trickles out. Although it is dated April 2 2013, I had not seen this, so thanks for sharing.
      I also don't know enough about Bobby1 or his credentials to make this the end all report. But some sources are cited, and it's worth paying attention to.

      We sure could use a little good news…

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTJcchmKhPw


      Report comment

    • We Not They Finally

      I don't think that Arnie Gundersen is distorting anything "deliberately." It very heavy to say ignore him, or condemn him, when he is doing so much. You also need to look into the back story here. He embarked on this out of CONSCIENCE, because he said he was fed lies himself in the wake of TMI and passed hem on to the public. He could have had a nice retirement — instead, he is doing this.

      Starting a witch hunt against Arnie Gundersen and "anyone who supports him" is totally the wrong way to go!


      Report comment

      • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

        'A line drawn in the sand' is not a witch hunt..


        Report comment

      • This is cheap character assassination.

        Arnie's not deliberately misleading anybody. He's just still clinging to formal education and somewhat limited operational experience for his analyses of what's what when these things blow.

        For instance, our CII investigation of the accident at TMI2 focused on three primary routes of release for meltdown level radioactivity (primarily gases, since the reactor vessel and containment building weren't breached by corium). These were:

        1. The Main Steam Dump Valves, which released reactor coolant water straight to atmosphere following the interior tubing blow-out of the B steam generator.

        2. The Vent Gas Header valves on the Letdown tank in the unshielded auxiliary building, which were (for some never explained reason) left in the full-open position before the accident and weren't "discovered" open until three months after the accident.

        3. The ~million gallons of reactor coolant water pumped from the containment building to the auxiliary building basement in the first hours of the accident. Emissions of iodine from this water completely saturated the aux building air filtration system in less than 15 minutes.

        (Cont.)


        Report comment

      • Arnie didn't become an 'expert' on TMI2 until the 1990s, whereas we'd been on site 3 days after the accident gathering data. Nor was he around when we delivered our reports to Congress and NRC. He did see our analysis of the sequence of events from GPU [April 16, 1979] – or perhaps the slightly altered one included in the Kemeny TATF appendices – and noted several large hydrogen explosions of the containment atmosphere, the largest of which pegged the gage at 32 psi.

        His Nuclear Engineer mind hit a hard concrete wall with that. Apparently these guys weren't taught and never found out on their own that melting reactors produce large volumes of hydrogen gas, which then tends to explode. So he focused his analysis almost entirely on that as the route of escape for dangerous levels of radioactive contaminants, which then traveled in plumes to expose the population north-northeast of the facility. Neither we nor he ever got to give our analyses in court because Judge Rambo (I kid you not) dismissed the suit in 1996. It was not until Fukushima that these "secrets" – hydrogen and contaminate plumes – could no longer be kept secret.

        (Cont.)


        Report comment

      • So Arnie decided that it must have gotten out of containment by way of the huge hydrogen explosion he'd never considered possible in all his education and experience. That doesn't make him a deliberate deceiver. It makes him a product of his sheltered view of the technology.

        We all get things wrong on occasion. He does learn pretty quickly, and has been a strong – and thankfully calming – voice against this industry for as long as he's been fighting it. I see that as a good thing, am glad he's on our side.


        Report comment

        • Questionit

          Arnie has a pattern of speaking up only after others have done the work to show through analysis, and have then convinced the activists, what has or is occurring. Then he soft sells it and downplays it.
          He is a deliberate deceiver or he is so incompetent and counter to the good efforts of others he needs to STOP being the voice.

          Do you notice how he is chosen so often by the media, who want the story to minimized, for interviews. He serves their purpose.


          Report comment

          • And you would prefer… what? All Gloom and Doom All the Time? That's certainly available. I've seen uncountable posts around here for two years and nine months steady – every day – whining that We're All Gonna Die and bemoaning the late, not-so great Planet Earth. I've been called a sell-out and/or shill more than a few times just for suggesting people look around and notice they're not dead yet, maybe get busy working to turn things around. Personally, sociologically, politically… there's plenty to do, even just for one's self and loved ones. Arnie has done more in the 20+ years he's been working against the nuclear industry than anyone here has done to convince the public they just need to roll over and die.

            Yes, we're all going to die eventually. Life is and has always been a 100% fatal condition. You'd think it would be seen as a good thing for people to be reminded that so long as they aren't dead yet, they should busy themselves trying to leave the world a better place than they found it. But then again, to do that one would have to want to live. Apparently a surprising number of people don't. And just can't stand it when others don't follow their script.


            Report comment

            • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

              Hell..doom and gloom is moving even faster than we can report.
              Think that tsunami garbage isn't headed this way ..etc.?
              IT MOVES BEFORE US.

              Arnie wants to soothe it out,,fine.


              Report comment

              • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

                That's the deal isn't it?..come here day after day.
                The news worsening..
                Half the day spent..arguing with those that say..it should be said in a more toned manner…when we barely have time to spit it out.

                The truth has to be told… and we have to be 'hot' on it.
                Life evidently isn't pretty.


                Report comment

              • It's tsunami debris, Rose. What do you suggest be done with it? It's hard to burn entire islands of debris while its moving through water, you know. So we wait until it washes up and deal with it then. Tsunamis happen. They kill large numbers of people and harm countless other lives. So the survivors rebuild, or move uphill a bit to rebuild so the next tsunami doesn't wash them and their towns, villages and loved ones out to sea.

                It would be nice if we lived on a planet that was seismically stable, but we don't. That's just reality – life and death on planet earth. It's a great reason to shut nuclear power down flat, for sure. But so far that's not happening anywhere but in Japan, even though the risks have been recalculated upward by a large extent. Pressure needs to be applied, some are trying hard to it.


                Report comment

            • +1000000

              The paradox is hard to grasp.. and there are so many paradoxes in this mega disaster.

              Yes, it is terrible.

              Yes, it generates fear and depression feelings.

              Yes, it has been covered up.

              Yes, it is hard to understand.

              Yes, many people have different views of it.

              Yes, it still could be an ELE or lead to one.

              Yes, it is worth doing positive things to make a difference, no matter what.

              Yes, it is all chaotic, looks like it is going to end badly and there is no hope.

              But then again, that has been said by many for the last 2,000 years, correct?

              So what is left is hope, and keeping a grateful, positive outlook in SPITE OF the seeming paradoxes, difficulties and potential of a Carrington Event or other catastrophe..

              Who knows how this will all turn out?

              Certainly, we do not claim to know the future for absolutely certain.

              We also lay out a course/green road map for how humanity can have a very bright future.

              But as Joy says, it is up to us and the choices we make each day, from here on out.


              Report comment

              • Thanks, Doc. I know it seems strange, but noticing the instilled blindness displayed by so many 'elite' nuclear SuperBrain types is actually kind of hopeful to me. Arnie's had to come to terms with uncomfortable truths about the technology he devoted the best years of his life to serving. Greg Jaczko recently had to learn the same truths, and he's not even a nuclear engineer (he's a theoretical 'elite' from the academic end).

                It's a hard blow to find out all of a sudden that "Everything You Know Is Wrong." The technology itself is fatally flawed, and given the fact that it's deadly dangerous, there's simply no excuse for its existence once you do know. Those brave enough to swallow their pride and say so in public have my grateful support, because they're the only ones the still-diehard nukes would ever listen to (if they ever listen to anybody).

                I'm not done here on this planet until I'm done (or God hits us with a billiard ball). I love life, plan to live it with passion for as long as it lasts. I've seen death, have a lot of living to do for those who died too soon. One of 'em because criminal f*cking nukes murdered him. THAT will make ya mad, for sure! A life to invest is all any of us ever had… what's it worth?


                Report comment

                • Cisco Cisco

                  Joy…thoughtfully put.

                  Those in-charge know fully well, and some of their willfully ignorant reports are now discovering the real conditions; but, there are plenty of shills and brownnosers that will continue to pump out the bullshit, covering for their masters.

                  The best we can hope for, is some in the ranks go postal and take out a few of those masters before their time. Karma?


                  Report comment

                  • Violence is not necessary.. there is enough of that to go around already.

                    The hardest part of 'revolution' or in shifting paradigms is the discipline of staying in peaceful, non violent actions despite the many 'temptations' to seek revenge, act out on feelings, which then seem to justify radical violent actions, etc..

                    Violence only begets equal and opposite reactions, which then escalate.

                    Violence is also how the 1% derail movements. They hire people to go in and commit violent acts inside the movement that is growing and threatening their control. They then make sure the press covers it, ad nauseum for weeks, repetitively.

                    The whole movement then collapses, police move in, arrest everyone, they all go to jail and that is the end of that.

                    Gandhi is a good example of how to take a country back.. peaceful, non violent, massive civil disobedience.

                    The 1% cannot stand against the 99% who have made up their minds and take action.


                    Report comment

                    • Cisco Cisco

                      Dr. G…the non-violet revolution you suggest was neither nonviolent, nor successful in the amount of time required to "fix" of "re-mediate" Fukushima. It took Gahndi 20 years, hardly a revolution.

                      In the US, current federal, state and many municipal laws prohibit spontaneous public assembly of even small numbers of people. They've got us boxed in for any type of peaceful protest. Look at what happened to "Occupy Wall Street". Peaceful revolution is a concept taught (propaganda) in school to discourage future violent revolutions. You play nice to bullies and you get your ass kicked. That's who and what we are dealing with…those who are in-charge of this clusterfu#k.

                      Do you think with the current political state of affairs in the US, that there are enough congressman and senators that will do what's fair and just to protect us from Fukushima. It's not going to happen.

                      It's too late to fix Fukushima or try to convince our executioners to do the right thing. There is no fix for radiation in the wild. As the radioactive volume increases in the atmosphere and water, so does the disease and destruction of biological systems, exponentially.


                      Report comment

                    • Cisco Cisco

                      continued…

                      Do the math on the atmospheric and water discharges, do the math/counts on the soil and air counts around the US and the globe, do the disease, mutations, and death counts on the insects, the birds, the fish, the mammals, and the plants.

                      This my friend is a preview of what's to come for us. Not very hopeful I suggest.


                      Report comment

    • Socrates

      Heart of the Rose,

      Interesting post from Before it is News. Rather depressing.

      I have wondered from day one whether we are being let down slowly. So much information has been kept back. Now the secrecy law.

      When corium hits concrete we see the Strontium 90 and the other radionuclides. Surely, some of the core material blew upwards….

      What is your overall assessment? We could be burnt toast twice over already.


      Report comment

  • shamwow shamwow

    This is like a dike that springs a leak, it either gets fixed or it will get worse leading to massive failure.

    The problem is that we cannot fix Fukushima, we can only pretend to fix it. Where it leads nobody knows but the wreck won't be pretty.


    Report comment

    • There are potential answers which have not been pursued yet.. We need to think outside the box..

      For every problem, there is a solution.


      Report comment

      • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

        Yes, think out of the box! Run like hell! :(


        Report comment

        • In a positive, light filled way…

          Fear is useful sometimes, but not as a way of solving problems.

          F false
          E evidence
          A appearing
          R real


          Report comment

          • shamwow shamwow

            Seeing a situation for what it is should not be equated with being fearful. It is being realistic. Fear will come in due time :) .

            We cannot solve every problem no matter how positive we are. Take toast as an example; very difficult to un toast it.

            Fukushima is toast. The question now is how bad will it get.


            Report comment

            • Unless there are open air meltdowns in the SFPs, Fushima is as bad as this kind of sh*t can get. Has been that bad since the first 3 days. We can question whether or not the tonnage of nuclear garbage gets released slowly or quickly, but it's already 'out'. That's what happens when you throw open the gates of hell and tempt the beast to come on through.

              IAEA and the world industry favors full and relatively quick release -just shrug and say "I'm Sorry," which is better (to them, for the purpose of salvaging their beyond-Zombie industry) than spending a whole lot of money over a long period of time to do the right thing. Which must include the shutdown and decommissioning of every gateway to hell that humans have built anywhere on the planet. No matter how sturdy they claim their locks are.

              Only thing I'd change is the pretense of "responsibly managing" the ruins and their fuel loads over the next few centuries while the slow releases are ongoing 24-7. I'd drop the whole mess into the mud pit, fill it from seawall to mountains to about a hundred feet, build The Mother Of All Seawalls with closable outlets only at the top, out well beyond the groundwater seeps (to keep the heavies from escaping), and top it off with a jet black carbon nanotube/lead-based ceramic pyramid easily seen from the moon with a deeply-etched skull and crossbones on top.

              That's a human project, not just a Japanese project.


              Report comment

              • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                .. :) Yes it must be dealt with and we must as a species guarantee that such a massive horrible tragic Nuclear Radiation Contamination disaster event never ever occurs on the surface of this planet ever again!

                We humans better get to putting these people out of business and then shutting down this entire industry and all these Nuclear Power Plants and this must happen now, immediately!

                Time is a wasting and another one will blow up very soon and that is now a scientific fact! That one was for some our here who/that doubt science…


                Report comment

              • HoTaters HoTaters

                JoyB, so love your analogies and your telling it like it is. Like your description of what needs to be done there, too. And like the suggestions for how to deal with it, too.


                Report comment

  • jackassrig

    I have been trying to find out if the concrete that was used in the construction was mixed with salt water or fresh. I have searched all over the net and I have found nothing. Knowing TEPCO and GE, they probably went the cheap route-saltwater. If TEPCO/GE used saltwater, then the structure is in more trouble than we know.
    Thanks Nick, fireguyjeff, WNTE, Obewanspeaks, and of course Anne and HoftheRose. None of use should give up but give out on this tradegy.


    Report comment

    • Questionit

      Water for the mixing of concrete would have been potable water. No sea water was used.


      Report comment

    • razzz razzz

      There are standards for mixing concrete. Rock has to washed, sand washed. No foreign materials allowed in the mix. Not even pond water is to be used, has to be filtered or purified first. The strength projections via the compression breaking points of test cans all depend on following a proper mix design.

      With underwater pours in freshwater or saltwater, the forms have to be purged or emptied of liquids before placing concrete. If not possible, a larger volume of concrete will be used to ensure the structural portion of the concrete reaches its optimal strength.

      Saltwater or corrosive intrusions are kept from steel reinforcing bar by placing and by keeping rebar further away for the surface of the concrete (since concrete is not water proof) or nowadays coated rebar is used, dipped in like liquid plastic to waterproof it from corrosive salts. There are additives to be used in situations that will allow for it. Even an additive that temporarily bursts the air bubbles in the mix to prevent voids and less need for mechanical vibration to settle the concrete. Or additives to 'air entrain' the mix with tiny air bubbles to aid the concrete in withstanding freezing temperatures.


      Report comment

  • ftlt

    What is to be done?

    Is there enough so-called excess money in the world to help deal with this..

    Europe and the USA are going into "Austerity" convolutions already before another upcoming economic meltdown – part 2.

    Where is the extra funding to combat FUFU going to come from?

    The treasuries of the West have been drained empty and sent offshore. The economies of the West are weakened shell economies and states.

    Japan is broke and in decline (for obvious added reasons now).

    China and Russia are boogie men – (and have their own problems – both real and unreal when FUFU is thrown into the equation.

    There is nothing left to squeeze from the working class and even very little from middle class worldwide.

    It is a dream state idea/hope to think any massive aid will be let loose at this problem.

    There has been no slow down anywhere by power or industry in the rush to exploit the planet resources/reserves. Ocean regions are being contested now all over the planet for future exploitation. (future warfare for them?)

    Lastly, there is a vacuum of real power worldwide today. Nation states have been stripped of any real power to exert a national will of their own – as their governments are controlled by outside fiscal forces.. The same forces that have gotten us into this mess in the first place; are proven deniers of any impact on the natural world that their moneymaking activities create and are to be held responsible for nothing – ever!

    We're…


    Report comment

    • ftlt

      The only thing that will help now is a mass worldwide political uprising that creates change through direst action, one that meets out real justice and puts an end to the exploitation to the planet for the short term personal profits of the few. — The "very" few, who are pulling the strings and are ultimately responsible for the crisis we are faced with – all because of their endless greed for more and more and more..


      Report comment

      • Socrates

        The oligarchy has always pulled the strings….

        The problem is that they too depend on the environment to support themselves. It will require a frank recognition by the oligarchy that it is in their interest to preserve what is left. The masses may riot but that will be met with violence with high tech crowd control. The masses have no leaders or ideology to replace exploitation and handle freedom. With freedom comes responsibility. Revolutions are bloody and result in a new aristocracy. I hope I am wrong but look at history.


        Report comment

        • bf9 Fitz

          I believe there is still hope, albeit not much, but it's going to take an extreme shift in the paradigm very quickly. Will this happen? Hard to say. A good start would be to close down all the nuclear plants and devote resources on the scale of the Manhattan project (in actuality much more) to get rid of this waste, blank check and as fast as possible. 400+ plants exploding are not the type of fireworks I want to see… a "Compton project" won't cut it here. As many have said what good is money or even possession outright if nothing is left alive?

          Unfortunately now is not the time for justice, that can wait. At the very least they go down too eventually. I refuse to believe that nothing can be done, something can always be done even if futile. I'm not going quietly into the night with this one and am contemplating a means of raising awareness in my area.


          Report comment

          • Socrates

            Good for you. Wish others had your awareness and resolve. There is much worth saving.


            Report comment

            • +100000

              When London was bombed by the Nazis, they left only huge areas of utter destruction. Many people were killed. Then Germany was bombed back into the Stone Age. Many were killed. Whole cities were leveled.

              Those who survived could easily have given up and thrown in the towel. They endured Nazi genocide, destruction of large cities, takeover of the government, and worse..

              The people left on the other side looked at this utter Armageddon like chaos, death and destruction and said;

              WE WILL GO ON… in the miracle of LIFE and LOVE.

              As long as two people are left alive with a few green plants, life will go on. That is the miracle of life. It endures, no matter what, as long as it can.

              So far at least, we have vast resources to work with, and whole communities of caring people to harness into this effort.

              So let's focus on building a bright future, a sustainable future, a green future for many generations. But without nuclear power.


              Report comment

              • Cisco Cisco

                Dr. G…Nice thoughts, but there's something missing in your hopeful "WE WILL GO ON… in the miracle of LIFE and LOVE." expectations. Those who were left in Germany could find and have drinking water, food, and shelter albeit compromised, but not radioactive. The physical circumstances of Fukushima are incomparable to bombed out cities.

                Granted, some populations here on earth will survive the radioactive fallout from Fuku and numerous other NPP's that will also fail and catch fire. I don't mean to bust your bubble, but the facts on the ground tell me, in 10 years things on the ground will look pretty ugly for all of us.


                Report comment

          • ftlt

            Fritz: We are out of time… The Compton project??? Lost me???… They are not worth worrying about or what???

            I agree with you about the risk to the plants in social breakdown… Scary!!

            But I believe, social breakdown is on its way regardless and soon..

            I think, the risk to the still functioning plants is greater with the rapid onset of climate change; a world of a depleted water supply, ever expanding resource conflicts and the runaway do-as-it-wants-anywhere nuclear power industry and their ilk in other industries..

            The world is screaming towards war because of these things above.. A war on the Mucky-Mucks terms…

            Who is going to protect the nuclear plants in a war when they become first strike targets???

            I believe in peace… But, a direct challenging to the normal day to day business as usual is needed right now..

            The fight against nuclear, the system that promotes it and the other horrors overtaking our planet must be challenged in the street by the masses – even in the barricades if necessary..

            You are living a pipe dream if you think they – the powerful – will change at all without a good strong push…

            Hell is soon coming for breakfast.. And Middle America will not be spared..


            Report comment

            • bf9 Fitz

              It was a really poor joke that if we half-ass this it won't be good enough, full throttle is needed as it were. 'Manhattan' is a 'nice' town where as 'Compton (Los Angeles for those who don't know)' is a 'ghetto'. Manahttan project/Compton project. Apologies, sometimes hard to use sarcasm or jokes through the interwebz.

              I think a dramatic peaceful uprising as ftlt has stated below is the best course. We have attack this thing all the while monitoring all the other plants, reinforcing the power grid for some defense against a CME from the sun, biomed research to repair broken genes and animal/plant life etc…violent revolution will get in the way of all that and all are necessary if we're gonna make it here. I do believe there's a chance but we need to get our ass in to high gear right about yesterday.


              Report comment

        • ftlt

          Soc: Disagree..

          """The problem is that they too depend on the environment to support themselves. It will require a frank recognition by the oligarchy that it is in their interest to preserve what is left"""

          Wow, that is wishful thinking… They have not slowed down even with the preponderance of evidence pointing to a rapid collapse of biosphere for many reasons… It is just one more project to make more money, in their minds… TOMORROW, when, I have enough money we'll deal with the environment.. Right

          You are wrong on protest and revolutionary thinking and change..

          Certainly, the French/European revolutionary movements 1780s to 1840s were successful and changed their world.. The so called "Terror" was nothing compared to what had gone on before it daily under Bourbons and other Euro aristocracy (most of our history of the time is drawn from the English with its pro-monarchy thinking and writings)

          China's and Vietnam's though bloody were successful..

          Cuba's was too.. And not very violent either – success

          Indian Sub-continent was non violent mostly – success

          Poland's peaceful one brought down the entire Soviet Empire eventually.. success

          The civil rights here and the anti Vietnam war movements were successes to a point..

          I believe in peaceful non violence as the best course..

          How much more bloody can revolutions be than Iraq, FUFU and what else is going on in the world???

          The death of our Biosphere for life as we know…


          Report comment

          • bf9 Fitz

            I'd think it wouldn't take that much convincing to show them that saving the world can be profitable too…on more than one level. Besides a habitable planet in the abstract, if we attacked this thing like the Soviets did it's going to take a lot of resources, production, manpower…etc. All opportunities for profit. Offense and defense like I said, defense being biomed research to try undo some of the damage that has already been done. It's time to hit this thing as hard as we can internationally.


            Report comment

            • +1000…

              Each person is important. Everyone can do SOMETHING.

              Be the light.

              Shine on, shine on.


              Report comment

            • ftlt

              Sorry for re-post Enenews – I had put it out of order

              Fritz: We are out of time… The Compton project??? Lost me???… They are not worth worrying about or what???

              I agree with you about the risk to the plants in social breakdown… Scary!!

              But I believe, social breakdown is on its way regardless and soon..

              I think, the risk to the still functioning plants is greater with the rapid onset of climate change; a world of a depleted water supply, ever expanding resource conflicts and the runaway do-as-it-wants-anywhere nuclear power industry and their ilk in other industries..

              The world is screaming towards war because of these things above.. A war on the Mucky-Mucks terms…

              Who is going to protect the nuclear plants in a war when they become first strike targets???

              I believe in peace… But, a direct challenging to the normal day to day business as usual is needed right now..

              The fight against nuclear, the system that promotes it and the other horrors overtaking our planet must be challenged in the street by the masses – even in the barricades if necessary..

              You are living a pipe dream if you think they – the powerful – will change at all without a good strong push…

              Hell is soon coming for breakfast.. And Middle America will not be spared..


              Report comment

            • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

              Pretty sure the "hit this hard" and profit numbers are in full swing and already projected. Hospitals are being expanded and people being hired with good jobs.

              There will be 31,750,000 cancer deaths just in Japan's population of 127,000,000.

              Then extrapolate those numbers out worldwide..massive profits.

              Massive profits in death and disease my friend and the beauty is that it's all legal.. :(

              Guinea pigs, now owned by the insane, should be so lucky if they do not get cancer in their lifetimes and the numbers are increasing and will increase after Fukushima and they always go up at a generational pace as Nuclear bioaccumulation continually increases… :(

              Human slaughter houses are what we have created and what are now needed…


              Report comment

              • So true, and the irony of it all, is that radiation and chemicals are used to try and 'solve' this problem.

                The root of the problem IS radiation and chemicals..

                None are needed. None need to be used. They cause more harm than good.

                There are free or very low cost answers available for energy, health, etc…

                The underlying problem beneath all of this is inside; greed, power hunger, and ego.. For every problem or illusion, there is a solution, very close by, in the last place that most people look for it.

                If we can solve 'that', all of this will go away.

                It can ALL be solved in an instant, if everyone gets a taste of what 'that' looks like. And it may happen, but don't count on it.

                The 100th monkey effect is possible.


                Report comment

                • Cisco Cisco

                  Dr. G…I respect your work and agree with most your postulations; but, I think the best we can expect out of this ELE is justice through retribution. I believe most of us succumb to some disease very prematurely.

                  I wish you were right; but, I think you are kidding yourself about a solution to the end of this little known-about, nightmare.


                  Report comment

    • HoTaters HoTaters

      I do not agree it is fiscal forces at work. That would be government entities, acting through taxation. The real problem originates at the level of central banks, with their economic cooperation entities, along with multinational corporate interests and member banks, other large banks. And the very wealthy. The influence "trickles down" to the level of nation states and "fiscal" policy & actions.


      Report comment

  • wetpwcas1 wetpwcas1

    Ho Rose, alsome. On you tube or what left of it, this man has deep insight just bad it is , please give a look, BeauifulGirlByDana, easy to find on you tibe, MsMilky, RadChick & many others who have been on Fukushima from day one! You are a source of giving & living here, please join in where all are trying to make a difference also! GOD BLESS!


    Report comment

  • unincredulous unincredulous

    We are so f*c*duh .

    matter of time.

    Unload your stocks in nuke companies.

    Don't be caught with your pants down…

    oh what the hell, let 'em fall. Might as well take it like it a pervert. BUY ! BUY! BUY!


    Report comment

    • That is the nature of the beast inside all of us…

      There are two wolves inside of everyone.. the dark, and the light.

      Whatever one we focus on the most grows and feeds.

      We either feed the darkness or the light.

      What are we creating in our personal lives? More darkness or more light?

      The evidence speaks for itself.

      We are either buying and supporting nuclear, oil, gas, coal, and chemicals, which destroy our future, or the opposite.

      Everyone can do something to move towards a lighter, brighter future. EVERYONE is important. Everyone matters. It is not about leaders. Do not wait for leaders. YOU are the person making the difference.

      Sell nuclear stock. Tell others to do the same.

      Buy solar. Get off the grid. Buy organic foods.

      Buy renewable energy if you can, if given the choice..

      Put in LED lights.. Every small step matters.


      Report comment

You must be logged in to post a comment.