Published: August 20th, 2012 at 12:10 pm ET
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Follow-up to: Gundersen: We've got some never-before-seen video related to Unit 4 coming out -- "My conclusion is it's really serious" (AUDIO)
Title: Can Spent Fuel Pools Catch Fire?
Source: Fairewinds Energy Education
Date: Aug 19, 2012Source: sandia.gov
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The Nuclear Regulatory Commission wanted to know if a fuel bundle can burn in air too. And they commissioned Sandia National Labs to run a test. Just by coincidence, the test was done about 2 weeks before the Fukushima-Daiichi accident.
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The first video shows a bundle immediately before the heat was applied. Shortly after, it’s the same bundle, the heat is on, and it’s already beginning to smoke. A little further on is the bundle, again, smoking considerably. Well, where’s there smoke there is fire. The last one in the sequence shows the bundle on fire. Now, what you’re seeing is zircaloy burning in air. There was no match applied to start this fire, it just got hot enough so that it began to combust of its own volition – in air.
Just to be clear one last time, that was a simulated test we just watched using electricity in place of spent nuclear fuel. But it is clear that a single nuclear fuel bundle can burn in air. Now Fukushima-Daiichi Unit 4 would be even worse. Inside Daiichi’s fuel pool, are 1500 fuel bundles, not one, 1500 fuel bundles, 300 of which are just removed from the nuclear core. So instead of one very hot bundle, we have got 300 very hot bundles.
Now it is even worse than that. The Japanese put all of their nuclear fuel from this latest core offload in a very confined space in the pool.
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Published: August 20th, 2012 at 12:10 pm ET
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sending...
I want to clarify that my disagreements with A. Gundersen are not about scientific oneupmanship..or politics..or an attempt to crush the nuclear industry.(I wish)
Some of us..let's say.. "march to a different drummer".
And yes.. I am using a thread I think will be popular..to promote it.
SOS from Minamisoma..part 5..438 views.(sad)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DToA8yxuK8&feature=relmfu
All none truths as to the condition of Fukushima Npp seals the deal for these people.
We want mercy for the people.
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Hi H.O.T.R
Personally i think Arnie is an artist in walking fine lines of compromises to the advantages that he can keep walking in the right direction (global awareness) because he never steps too hard on the toes of the people he is undermining, slowly but steady…
I don't want to see the importance of hes presence as a pion on the global chessboard or the appreciation for him being undermined….
@H.O.T.R , no offence pls , but if there is another drummer to follow , could you be so kind and focus on shining a light on the speakers you wanne hear instead of trowing shadows at Arnie ?
Because you are probably not aware of it, but your negative remarks contain bits of a "divide an conquer" effect…
Pls ?
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I never really give my opinion any weight..
It's just my opinion.
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PS..I am grateful..I am not in a position..to "have".."to ride the fence".
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Then you are leaving a lot of potential unused i think.
The collective consiousness (internet) response to a bit of opinion is not influenced by the perception of the sender of the message.
As soon as it is send , it travels and has impact on its own, depending on what it says and how it is constructed (resonating , convincing, sound logic, makes people wondering, talking etc).
When i post a serious message , i always try to keep myself aware that i'm potentially talking to All the good and the bad guy's at once, including this one
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sry above got displaced due to my slowness of typing.
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I do not agree with Mr. Gundersen's opinion of the state of Fukushima.
He has plenty of well-wishers.
I have a right to my own opinion ..yes?
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Yes Heart , we both do
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Indeed..
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All BS. Arnie, show me your tax returns!
And your college transcripts!!!
Until then, stay away from the tuna!
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Thanks Arnie for the clips of the wrecked fuel pool and glowing poolium. And the entertaining video. I will be sure to donate.
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@DIS: "…I always try to keep myself aware that i'm potentially talking to all the good and bad guy's at once…" Very astute on your part. Which is also why I question your admonition of Heart and her outspoken stance on Gundersen. Your not-so-subtle inference that her opinion is having "bits of a "divide an conquer" effect…" on the "…collective consciousness…" is troubling. Is she not to speak her mind? Cannot Gundersen weather the very public opinion he would want to influence? Are we to comply with yet another line of politically correct mind-speak on the way to utopia?
Personally, I welcome all – honest – inquiry and opinion…
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Thankfully..many, many people are trying to express their opinion about this situation.
Creativity is on our side..
Fukushima: Hell on Earth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=he7wDF_GBs8
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I'd rather suffer the truth over the risk of never knowing it…
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Ah, a Red Pill-head . . .
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Many thanks to Arnie Gundersen for the truth about zirconium. Zirconium is the metal cladding for nuke fuel bundles, and is the big dirty secret design flaw that will absolutely kill the nuke industry. Because every fuel bundle has the potential to burn or explode if it the cooling water goes away. And this isn't only true of fuel rods in a nuclear reactor. It is also true for spent fuel bundles in a spent fuel pool. As we saw at Fuku SFP4, when the water goes away, decay heat in the spent fuel bundles will ignite the zirconium cladding after just a few hours.
Zirconium vapor mixed with cesium vapor creates an explosive mixture. Zirconium fires cannot be extinguished by water.
http://cameochemicals.noaa.gov/chemical/8183
Cesium will explode when it comes into contact with water:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS3cIK9jlB8&feature=related
Zirconium and cesium may have caused the explosion that demolished Building4.
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@PhilipupNorth, good links about materials interactions, especially about zirconium fires and water. You answered a question I had after viewing Arnie's vid! Given the 'Related Articles' above indicating an overheated pool, cracks, and severe water loss at R4 sfp and Arnie's careful explanation of 'cold' and 'hot' fuel, the risky, temporary configuration of cold/hot assemblies, the July '11 boiling R4 sfp event, and how zirconium interacts with air; can we safely assume that R4 fuel is intermittently burning? IF there is intermittent burning of R4's sfp rods, does it makes sense to remove fuel rods at this point? Are they increasing the risk of pool collapse? Thank you for your take on this, if you want to answer-
Disregarding the structural bowing for a minute, ground settling, by itself, could cause more foundation cracking and/or more lateral beams to pop out between remaining pillars to dump the sfp. One big quake away from total northern hemisphere contamination and all we can do is 'stir the smoldering pit,' to remove a few undamaged rods, i.e, whatever 'undamaged' rods are left? This might not take long, after all. It seems we are in a countdown to destruction, with no long term plan except to let R1-4 burn and pollute the entire Pacific Ocean- :/
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"…Can we safely assume that R4 fuel is intermittently burning?" Many thanks, bluerthanblue! My take on your questions:
Fuel in SFP4 is not burning. It is under water, and the water is calm.
http://video.search.yahoo.com/search/video?p=spent+fuel+pool+4
There is every reason to remove fuel assemblies from SFP4 ASAP.
This work should be proceeding every day (they now take weekends off).
Some damaged burned fuel assemblies will be difficult to handle.
Debris on floor of SFP4 can be expected, after empty racks are removed. (If not a puddle of melted fuel.)
Risk to SFP4 from construction of Fuel Removal Structure is minimal.
But risk to SFP4 from another EQ is pretty high.
SFP4 can either spring a leak and dewater, or the building can collapse. Both would be very bad.
Here is TEPCO plan and timeline:
http://enenews.com/tepco-foundation-improvement-work-begins-tomorrow-at-reactor-no-4-also-trying-to-prevent-rainwater-penetration-photos-english
So they have a plan, and are running ahead of schedule. Ready to lay foundation for Fuel Removal Structure. Let's get this going, TEP.gov!
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"Hot bundles"..now what?
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Hydrogen will combust on contact with oxygen. Zirconium will combust on contact with oxygen. Cesium will combust on contact with water.
What absolute morons came up with these materials to use in the construction of a nuclear power plant, where combustable bundles are sitting in that which makes them combust? And if something happens to the material that makes them combust, they get exposed to a different environment that makes them combust?
What can anyone say about this idiocy?
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TimeIsShort: Design flaw.
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I read somewhere that zirconium is not susceptible to neutron embrittlement. On the other side of the coin it is susceptible to heat and burning as pointed out above. GE couldn't fine a metal that would do it all so that went for the hydrogen embrittlement and hoped to God the monster never lost cooling.
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But reactors can (and did) lose cooling. 4 SFPs and 3 Reactors at Fuku melted and burned. Nukes have many design flaws. (Zirconium, SFPs 100' in the air, tiny containments, etc., etc.) Destroyed Reactors1,2,&3 are still too hot to work on. So, nuke industry must be shut down. Let's back away from nuke power before it does us all in.
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Reactor 4:
June 26 2011
The people must not be so blind..as to not believe what they see with their own eyes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3_Ek-NErIk&feature=plcp
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