FORUM: Off-Topic Discussion Thread (Non-Nuclear Issues) for Feb. 26, 2012 – Jan. 5, 2013

Published: September 3rd, 2012 at 5:28 pm ET


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Published: September 3rd, 2012 at 5:28 pm ET


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9,856 comments to FORUM: Off-Topic Discussion Thread (Non-Nuclear Issues) for Feb. 26, 2012 – Jan. 5, 2013

  • Anthony Anthony

    Record Arctic Storm Melted Sea Ice
    Becky Oskin, OurAmazingPlanet Staff Writer – Dec 26, 2012 03:15 PM ET

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    STEIN: Bipartisan fiscal scam lays groundwork for austerity
    January 03, 2013
    “As daylight begins to shine on the fiscal cliff deal just passed by Congress, it’s clear the expected bipartisan betrayal has occurred. And even worse, it lays the groundwork for much more to come.
    “In brief, the deal protects wealthy households earning up to $450,000 annually from tax increases, as it makes Bush tax cuts permanent for 98.5% of Americans. With this provision, Obama broke his promise to raise taxes on those earning over $250,000 per year.
    “The deal also ended the payroll tax holiday, hitting vulnerable working and middle class families with significant tax increases likely to take further steam out of the economy. This increased tax burden – of about $1000 for a family earning $50,000 per year- should have been replaced by another tax break for working families to prevent a reduction in demand that’s likely to further stall the ailing economy.
    “The deal also ushered in an additional $205 billion in wasteful corporate tax favors. New racetracks will get tens of millions, Goldman Sachs gets $1.6 billion in tax-free financing for its new massive headquarters, banks get a $9 billion dollar loophole for offshore financing, and U.S. multinationals are allowed to dodge taxes on income earned by foreign subsidiaries – giving them all the more reason to move jobs offshore.

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      “Taking care of ill family members at home was dealt a set-back with a provision in the Affordable Care Act designed to let millions of elderly and disabled people get help at home rather than be placed in institutional care being repealed.
      “The deal included an urgent renewal of unemployment insurance, though many observers considered this virtually a given. It also deferred the self-inflicted devastation of the ‘sequester’, which would impose $110 billion in across the board domestic and military cuts, but only for two months.
      “In supporting the bill, President Obama gave away the one bargaining chip – the expiring Bush tax cuts – that he could have used in the upcoming negotiations on spending cuts and the debt ceiling. Not only did Obama get little of substance in return for his only bargaining chip. He actually ceded nearly half the $1 trillion in new revenue that John Boehner agreed to, (getting only $600 billion in tax increases on the wealthy over the next decade).
      “This lays groundwork for a disaster. Obama has already agreed to 4 trillion in deficit reduction. The revenue side of the deal he just signed generates little more than $600 billion. That means we can expect bipartisan collaboration on more than $3 trillion in cuts going in to the next round of brinksmanship over the debt ceiling. Obama has already indicated his willingness to cut Social Security, Medicare and other health programs.


    Being Green

    Checking out at the store, the young cashier suggested to the older woman, that she should bring her own grocery bags because plastic bags weren't good for the environment.
    The woman apologized and explained, "We didn't have th…is green thing back in my earlier days."
    The young clerk responded, "That's our problem today. Your generation did not care enough to save our environment f or future generations."
    She was right — our generation didn't have the green thing in its day.
    Back then, we returned milk bottles, soda bottles and beer bottles to the store. The store sent them back to the plant to be washed and sterilized and refilled, so it could use the same bottles over and over. So they really were truely recycled.
    But we didn't have the green thing back in our day.
    Grocery stores bagged our groceries in brown paper bags, that we reused for numerous things, most memorable besides household garbage bags, was the use of brown paper bags as book covers for our schoolbooks. This was to ensure that public property, (the books provided for our use by the school) was not defaced by our scribblings. Then we were able to personalize our books on the brown paper bags.
    But too bad we didn't do the green thing back then.
    We walked up stairs, because we didn't have an escalator in every store and office building. We walked to the grocery store and didn't climb into a 300-horsepower machine every time we had to go two blocks.
    But she was right. We…


      We didn't have the green thing in our day.
      Back then, we washed the baby's diapers because we didn't have the throwaway kind. We dried clothes on a line, not in an energy-gobbling machine burning up 220 volts — wind and solar power really did dry our clothes back in our early days. Kids got hand-me-down clothes from their brothers or sisters, not always brand-new clothing.
      But that young lady is right; we didn't have the green thing back in our day.
      Back then, we had one TV, or radio, in the house — not a TV in every room. And the TV had a small screen the size of a handkerchief (remember them?), not a screen the size of the state of Montana. In the kitchen, we blended and stirred by hand because we didn't have electric machines to do everything for us. When we packaged a fragile item to send in the mail, we used wadded up old newspapers to cushion it, not Styrofoam or plastic bubble wrap. Back then, we didn't fire up an engine and burn gasoline just to cut the lawn. We used a push mower that ran on human power. We exercised by working so we didn't need to go to a health club to run on treadmills that operate on electricity.
      But she's right; we didn't have the green thing back then.
      We drank from a fountain when we were thirsty instead of using a cup or a plastic bottle every time we had a drink of water. We refilled writing pens with ink instead of buying a new pen, and we replaced the razor blades in a razor instead of throwing away the whole razor just…


      because the blade got dull.
      But we didn't have the green thing back then.
      Back then, people took the streetcar or a bus and kids rode their bikes to school or walked instead of turning their moms into a 24-hour taxi service. We had one electrical outlet in a room, not an entire bank of sockets to power a dozen appliances. And we didn't need a computerized gadget to receive a signal beamed from satellites 23,000 miles out in space in order to find the nearest burger joint.
      But isn't it sad the current generation laments how wasteful we old folks were just because we didn't have the green thing back then?
      Please pass this on to another selfish old person who needs a lesson in conservation from a smartass young person.

      • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication


        Thank you FR, it made me recall all the things we have done and some of the things we still do. I washed thousands of diapers and hung them on the line when my children were small. Is there anyone left who does that today?

        The soft drink association makes sure they lobby effectively so we will never again have to return bottles to the store for our deposit or to the milkman. Some of us even remember using ice to refrigerate our food and "Aladdin lamps" to light our living room after dark. We lived without electricity or even indoor plumbing. We listened to the radio (the shadow knows) and did not have television for most of our young lives.

        Baths were taken in a #3 washtub and the cleanest child bathed first. :>) That must have saved a lot of water. :>) And yes, we didn't have the green thing then.

        • richard richard

          it is a good read that story. i've found it back as far as May 2011. No author is quoted there. Can't seem to find an earlier reference to it though.

          Here …

          Second page.

        • FREEDOMROX

          I have no idea who wrote it, but also remember the importance of a paper bag to put potatos in, and quick ripen tomatos, and to start the wood stove up in the morning, and to insulate the chicken coop with in the winter.
          I remember a chamber pot in winter at my grandparents who then slopped the hogs with it, and an outhouse in the summer…nothing good I can tell you about that, except it made the Sears&Roebuck catalog a valuable commodity.
          We never threw food away, we used it to feed the hogs with, sometimes the chickens, depending on if we had corn that night, and also threw ashes from the Wood Stove into the garden over the winter.

          Whoever wrote that, brought back how my ancestors and my departed grandparents still lived until 1979. No, we weren't going green then, we were stained green from working in the fields and playing in the grass….

          • richard richard

            yes mate. and i've mentioned it before, but when i was growing up (not so long ago 🙂 ) i used to dig up raw carrots out of the soil, and if i bothered, washed the dirt off with rain water.

            and ripe tomatoes off the vine, eaten raw, crisp and moist and delicious.

            oranges that were almost glowing red on the inside with vibrance. to my young eyes i still recall them vividly for some reason. not seen the like for a decade or two.

            by the way, it's a great story that you posted freedomrox, i appreciate the find.

            • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication


              Yes, and I remember my sister and I pulling up peanuts directly from a nearby farmer's field and brushing them off and eating them when we were children. Snacks in the wild. :>)

              Those oranges are called "blood oranges" in Italy. They are delicious.

              • richard richard

                Yumm, that makes me hungry thinking of those peanuts like that, that must've been very morish. Thanks for the point about the oranges, could very well be.


    the kinda of news every one-world'er wants to start their day with…

    Government Dependents Outnumber . . . Private Sector Jobs In 11 U.S. States

    Keep up the good work cumrags!!!


      speaking of rags…

      NY Times: trashing the Constitution for fun and profit

    • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

      A few years ago, I would have predicted comments like those expressed in this article, Aftershock. But my prediction was that we would hear this level of condemnation from young workers, by maybe 2030, directed towards social security recipients. Now I find that I am hearing daily rants about "entitlements" from tea party Republicans and Libertarians nearly every day.

      Tell you what: Let's get Congress to quit engaging in unfunded foreign wars, cut defense spending by 20 or 30%, end subsidies for nuclear power, agribusiness, and oil companies. Then we'll talk.

      BTW the fix is to double Medicare tax (from the puny 1.45% to a more reasonable 2.9%), and end the cap ($109,000) on Social Security wages. Both Medicare and Social Security are fixed permantly. (Please be aware of the current $2.6 trillion Social Security Trust Fund. And that SS isn't counted in the deficit or in the national debt.)


        totally agree philip. What's imperative is that we refrain from polarization of what we should all agree too: taking care of Americans first! It does no good helping your neighbor rearrange their furniture while your house is burning. We need an honest assessment of our national priorities and how detrimental the last thirty years of trade policy has been to our fiscal health…

        Couple of good articles that relate to these issues:

        Solving the Mystery of America’s Persistently High Jobless Rate

        Fiscal Cliff Postmortems

        • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

          "Free trade must be restructured to make it fair trade."
          The above quote comes from Aftershock's link to Veterans Today, above.
          What, exactly, are US unemployed workers supposed to do? For each job opening, there are now 6 unemployed workers, plus employed workers hoping for more hours or more pay, plus new graduates entering the workforce for the first time. That's a room full of people trying for every job opening.
          "Let unemployment run out," say many. "Make people take jobs flipping burgers, delivering pizzas, and working the night shift at the convenience store. Let them pay their own bills, and stop making the rest of us pay their bills."

          Hey, America, wake up! There is only one reason why unemployment is this high, and will stay high indefinitely: US corporations move every job overseas that they possibly can. The corporations only hire US workers to move imported goods from ports to market, man the stores, and deliver and maintain the products they sell.

          The very least we can do is to tax corporations, corporate directors, managers, and shareholders to pay for the unemployment benefits of their former US workforce. Long term capital gains should be taxed as regular income, at 39.5% for the super rich. Only fair.

          If you automate away all the jobs, then what? People should be entitled to food, clothing, shelter, healthcare, education, and transportation. (Jacque Fresco, The Venus Project). Only makes sense.

          • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

            Sending jobs overseas & automation works towards forcing labor costs down. Add in more lenient rules for foreign workers & you force the wages lower again.

            Corporations that have a certain percentage of their work force overseas should pay a penalty…

            Governments are contributing to this activity by allowing the tax breaks, reducing regulations & providing subsidies to these very same companies that are destroying not only the economy, health, safety & all life forms with their activities.

            • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

              It was Barack Obama who appointed Jeffrey Immelt, General Electric CEO, his Chairman of the Council on Jobs and Competitiveness. ..GE who payed no taxes & is moving more jobs to China.

              August 24, 2011

              GE said it is moving the company’s headquarters in charge of X-Ray technology to China. In an effort to increase sales to the giant Asian nation, and cut costs in the process, the largest manufacturer of imaging machines in the world is closing its US headquarters after 115 years. ..amid a broader parent-company plan to invest about $2 billion across China, including opening six “customer innovation” and development centers.

              Immelt calls China “GE’s second home.”


                regarding this thread MaidenHeaven, your last addition pretty much says it all…

                BTW. I've taken the time to listen interviews of Jeffrey Immelt. He's an incredibly intelligent man who's obviously doing service to an invisible cadre of influential interests.

                Intuition tells me that many powerful people look down upon the 'great unwashed' and use our foibles as excuse for selling us out. Sad fact is, they're only buying the honor of being the last available grave digger…

              • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication


                Bill Clinton offshored jobs as well. Somehow everyone forgets he also did it.


            as usual, good thoughts phillip. Thing to keep in mind is the de-industrialization of America was sanctioned by the elite and it's been long running. I liken it to the farming technique of letting the field go fallow. We're looking at what's now becoming generations of Americans who've come to expect unaccountable aid and know nothing of their progenitor's work ethic and stuggle. This condition applies across all race lines and regions of the country.

            I fear for the day when the bottom drops out and these people find their mail boxes empty; which, as things are going, will likely include most of us. Will we resort to 'thinning the herd' as solution to this burgeoning class of 'have nots'? Such solution does not sit well with me, nor should it with any thinking person. It's time (long overdue!) for a complete reassessment of our national priorities…

    • Actually, the corporate welfare entitlements are orders of magnitude above any social benefits that ordinary citizens get..


    your choice…red or blue pill?

    Government democide and disarmament are greatest threats of violence

    Though I can't stand Alex Jones, the figures presented in this InfoWars video production are – by all accounts – accurate.

    Of course, like every thing else in our world, claims of Nazi Germany's repressive gun control regulations are in dispute. The following is a comprehensive analysis of gun control history in pre-WWII Germany and on-through the reign of the National Socialist. It's interesting history. When you click on the following link, some browsers will flag the site as being potentially dangerous. I'll leave it to you to ascertain the purpose of such prejudicial warning and why it's being applied to an otherwise benign account of history…

    Gun Control in Germany, 1928-1945


      If you want to see true history of Gun Control, then watch "Innocents Betrayed"

      Please exercise good judgment, as some images are HIGHLY disturbing!


        I'll check it out FREEDOMBROX.

        BTW…Rivero was talking about this on RBN, today…


          Sorry I mashed your handle, FREEDOMROX. Eyes getting tired…

        • FREEDOMROX

          Don't sweat it AfterShock…mine too. I mean we are really getting hammered all at once… Feinstein, the architect of the comprehensive 2013 Assault Weapons Ban.., as well as Private Donors handing out thousands for gun buy backs, and Bloomberg getting on Jimmy Fallon's show and spouting off about total gun bans, yet no similar outcry demanding an end to nuclear power–after four nuclear plant meltdowns at Fukushima, along with Obummer signing the NDAA with the provisions for 'imprisoning US citizens without trial' provision…Obummer giving raises to all Fed Employees, and punting the debt ceiling down the road…

          It's been one helluva year, and we are only four days into it…

          Honestly, my eyes are killing me. 🙁


            not to dismiss your anxiety FREEDOMROX, but none of this surprises me or those who've been watching. It was predicted they'd be moving on citizen gun rights. Aside from the 'useful fools', the harder they beat the media drum, the more people will begin to question the 'wisdom' in destroying our Bill of Rights to "save the babies".

            In truth, no one in their right mind wants to go to war against its reigning body. But if they think tens-of-millions of Americans are going to roll over and accept such edict, then they're unwittingly giving us grounds for a long overdue revolution. And believe me. I have no delusions as to how ugly things can get. I just have faith in people, as a whole.

            None of us believes in integrity of those who profess paternal concerns for our welfare. We know they're thieves, deceivers and murderers.

            And when this kicks off, every-other people on this planet will see this as a signal to rid themselves of their parasites. When they globalized the world, they overlooked the fact that only so much can go onto the plate, at any-one time.

            Just between us (and the little squinting satellite that's passing overhead), I want them to think they're going to win. Reality has it, everything they've done is failing! Like the bully who's yet to be beaten down by the new kid, they're simply too self-important to know their limits.

            History is made by those who survive it.

            Now…do the math…

            • FREEDOMROX

              Oh this anxiety has been there since I was a schoolboy. I loved true history, and actually saw all of this coming 39 years ago. It is not the anxiety my friend…it's the anticipation.

              Agree with everything you stated above. Nice to know when you are not alone. I really loved the Marine's response to Feinstein.


              and Occupy's


                just heard about this marine's statement, FREEDOMROX, on RBN. Thanks for the link; pulling it down for circulation.

                I did have a grammatical error in that reference to 'useful fools'. It should've read 'useful idiots'. Doubtless you'll know its historic context, so I'll leave it others to glean.

                Believe me, you're not alone. We all want a better world; one that's not controlled by sociopaths. Like the myth of racial integrity, they want us to buy into the idea we're incapable of common ground. That's why I abandoned the bogus Left/Right paradigm. Given enough dialogue, I found that we're all in agreement on the pertinent issues. Such 'Bodhidharma' has also illuminated my understanding the elite and how we can evolve past class differences, as well. If we all start expressing the truth and listen intently to those we'd differ with, we will eventually emerge a more robust species.

                If you haven't detected it by now, the enenews server is in need of a serious reboot, so I'll take my leave until later.

                Ciao for now!


    a must read…

    Pentagon Held Secret Meeting With Nuclear Industry 2003

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      GMOs: The ultimate solution

      “We know that when Obama campaigned in 2008, he promised he would label GMOs. When elected, not only did he renege on that promise but immediately appointed former Monsanto VP and attorney Michael Taylor, aka ‘Monsanto Mike’, as the Head of Food Safety at the Fraud and Drug Administration and Tom Vilsack, another biotech hooker, as the Secretary of Agriculture.

      “I don't know about other States, but in Hawaii, from the Governor on down, almost all the Legislators have been bought, with none wanting to bite the hand that feeds them.

      “In Hawaii, Monsanto has six registered lobbyists – John Radcliffe, George "Red" Morris, Dawn Bicoy, Paul Koehler, Alan Takemoto, Fred Perlak, and Alicia Maluafiti. Radcliffe and Morris have an iron grip on our politicians and Maluafiti is the Executive Director of the Hawaii Crop Improvement Association and along with Radcliffe and Morris, they have bought off with thousands of dollars our, if you will pardon the expression, lawmakers. The other biotech monsters are Syngenta, Pioneer (DuPont), Bayer (aspirin anyone?), and BASF, each having their own lobbyists as well….

      “For those of you that have never seen the film ‘Soylent Green’, please get it and watch it and realize that in the generations to come, if we do not unite and fight, Monsanto will ultimately open the first Soylent Green factory.

      • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

        “In closing and to apologize for saying the same thing over and over in every article I write about GMOs, if the following do NOT say non-GMO or organic, DO NOT BUY THEM – soy, corn, cotton.

        “Those are the big three to stay away from. Canola, whether it says organic or non-GMO, do not touch it with a 10 foot pole unless you can tell me how an industrial solvent can be organic and good for your health.

        “The biotech demons are also getting into alfalfa, sugar beets, and potatoes. So sprout your own alfalfa seeds or buy them from a reputable place where you can ascertain they are not GMO.

        “Stay way from sugar and go with honey or maple syrup. And for the most part, buy and eat as much organically grown vegetables and grains as you can to be safe.

        “And for you non-vegetarians out there, your dead animals are fed GMO grains as well as the feathers, blood, the dead, dying, diseased, and decayed animals not fit for sale, as well as road-kill. And if you are so fixed on the range-fed scam, it's the saturated fat that found in all animal flesh that gives you just about every disease known to mankind.

        “Oh yeah, all the fish in the world are loaded with mercury, radiation, heavy metals and toxic wastes. And now, Frankensalmon does not have to be labeled as such….”

        Learn more:

        Learn more:

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      +100000. TY, Aftershock.


        …thank you anne. And though we may differ on some things, we should – all – keep in mind, "Many branches make for a healthier tree!" Yeah…one of mine…

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    Study: 97 percent of children affected by 2009 mumps outbreak were vaccinated for condition

    Learn more:

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    Human genes engineered into experimental GMO rice being grown in Kansas

    Learn more:

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    “Why are companies spending billions on this crazy idea? Because they want to own copyrights on a genes that no one else 'owns' – so that they can make billions of dollars from them.
    “Don't believe the people who say there is no evidence of the harm they do:
    “To give just a few examples:
    “1. The lifespan of ladybugs (ladybirds) was reduced to half when they ate aphids that had fed on genetically altered potatoes in Scotland, according to a London Times article (10/22/97) by Science Editor, Nigel Hawkes.

    “The ladybugs also laid fewer eggs. Note that the ladybirds did not even eat the genetically modified food directly, as we are doing now. They ate something ELSE that had eaten the GMOs. The danger lived on in the food chain. For more information.
    “2. A recent TV Show by PBS (Public Broadcasting) on GMO's showed how people have now created salmon that is several times bigger than normal salmon, and grows faster. Thankfully, these salmon are currently being farmed inland. However, to save a few dollars the salmon farm is currently seeking permission to farm the salmon in fenced off sections of the ocean. The problem is that if even a couple get away, they could cause the extinction of salmon, because wild salmon prefer the larger salmon because they assume they are better mates, and the resulting offspring have much less chance (if any) of surviving and reproducing.

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      “3. The danger to many humans who are allergic to certain foods is guaranteed, because no one will know what they are eating. For example, say someone is deathly allergic to peanuts. A GMO may have a gene from a peanut in them. The allergic person could get a reaction from eating ANYTHING that contained the peanut gene. They wouldn't even know what caused it – because there are no labelling laws about GMOs.
      “4. Pesticides are now going to be INSIDE the food you eat!…”

  • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

    Open net-cage salmon farming is currently one of the most harmful aquaculture production systems and poses environmental threats in all regions it is practiced.

    Go to article for links on each of these:

    The Environmental Impacts of Salmon Farming

    Sea Lice
    Chemical Treatments: SLICE
    Algae Blooms
    Marine Mammal Deaths
    Marine Debris
    Waste on the Ocean Floor
    Escapes & Alien Species
    Fish Feed

    The Human Health Impacts of Salmon Farming

    PCBs & Contaminants
    Excessive Antibiotic Use & Resistance
    Healthy Fats From Healthy Oceans
    Chemical Dependence
    Organic Farmed Salmon?

    The Economic Impacts of Salmon Farming

    Value of Wild Fish Marine Industries
    The Jobs Myth
    Skeena Salmon: Risking a $110 Million Dollar Industry

    • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

      Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Farmed Salmon!

      Much more info in article. Also find more links.

      If you knew that a friend was unknowingly consuming a product full of cancer causing agents, a product that kills other species and could cause diseases as serious as mad cow disease, would you let them eat it?

      Among the many other problems with salmon farming there are diseases such as infectious salmon anemia (ISA), heart & skeletal muscle inflamation (HSMI) and salmon leukemia virus (SLV) spreading to wild salmon. All three viruses have been found in BC farmed salmon and all pose a lethal threat to wild salmon.

      Farmed salmon is just such a product. Raised through measures that are entirely unnatural, farmed salmon is harmful to wild salmon, the oceans, and to human health. Studies have shown farmed salmon to be the most PCB contaminated protein source in the food supply.

      • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

        Sign the Petition to STOP Farmed Salmon…learn the dangers for both the oceans, its inhabitants & to Your health~!~ ~Please Share~

        These feedlots operate as intensive livestock grow-outs in the ocean with up to a million fish raised on a single site. Factory salmon are fed colourants to turn their grey flesh pink and given antibiotics and de-lousing drugs to fight disease and parasites. There are no barriers for disease, viruses, bacteria and lice between salmon feedlots and the surrounding environment.

        Salmon feedlots do not remove their waste. Instead, excess feed and feces produce massive pollution as it is released untreated into coastal waters.

        Initially, the uneaten feed and feces attracts numerous species and increases the biological diversity around a salmon farm. As the waste from the farm increases, the chemistry of the sea bottom begins to shift from an oxygen-rich to an oxygen-poor environment. Sulphide levels begin to rise. The colour and quality of the sediment changes. Extensive mats of white bacteria develop and species diversity begins to drop off.

        In the Canadian Maritimes, sea lice have become highly-drug resistant. To combat this, farm salmon are bathed in de-lousing drugs that are released into the ocean. This industry refuses to use an effective barrier to stop their lice and drugs from entering the natural environment.

        • aigeezer aigeezer

          MaidenHeaven, I agree completely with those sentiments. I lived in BC for half my life and saw the fish farm effects. I moved to the East Coast and am now seeing the fish farms being set up here. In each case it was/is done with government assistance. BC didn't learn from Norway's experience. Atlantic Canada didn't learn from BC's experience.

          I'm not convinced the "buy wild" argument is effective though, for two reasons. One is that the wild stock has been decimated everywhere, and the other is that the argument is often perceived as serving the self-interest of any remaining fishers (never thought I'd use that word) of wild salmon.

          Regardless of anyone's position on the wild product – stay away from the farmed stuff. "Farm" sounds so bucolic, so innocent, which is why we have "tank farms", "mink farms", "cube farms" and so forth. Semantics is a weapon of the propagandist.

          Oh, and one more tidbit for anyone trying to up their intake of Omega 3 fatty acids… "Farm-raised fish contain much higher amounts of pro-inflammatory omega 6 fats than wild fish."

          Many citations, but this is a good example:

          • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

            I read somewhere that they want to have farms in the ocean in pens. If some of these fish escape, there will no longer be any wild fish anymore.

  • WindorSolarPlease

    Since this is the beginning of a New Year 2013 and a New Congress here is my want list

    Take care of our Country first and then help others.
    Seems like they have been doing it backwards.

    Wonder if it's just an easier way to hide the flow of money, into the back pockets? Got to pay for those special bunkers some how.
    I believe there are those who even have gotten rich off of war.
    Sorry got side tracked.

    Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid should not be touched unless it is to increase benefits, "without" being Corporate privatized owned.

    Keep the extended unemployment benefits going, it somewhat helps the economy and helps those who need it.

    Problems caused by natural disasters should be taken care of, not left for the displaced to figure out. Help should be available to them right away.

    Equal healthcare should be available to all, even those who can't afford it, "without" mandatory insurance or an RFID chip.

    Leave the Constitution alone, and not trash it.

    Get rid of the Military to Indefinitely Detain American Citizens on suspicions of supporting terrorism.
    Close Fema Camps

    Protect the Environment and the Public instead of the Corporations and others.

    Get going with Solar, wind, new products, and so on that are environment friendly instead.
    Fraking, drilling, nuclear plants, uranium mining, dumping, making salt domes as a dumping sites, chemicals, synthia, and so on, not good for the environment.

    Check our air, food, water,…

    • WindorSolarPlease


      Check our air, food, water, products closely

      Letting the public know the test results, being honest to the public. A Disclosure Act Bill To The Public

      Protect schools and education, trouble students need help

      Give those a break who start a business and hire inside the US
      Those who have business over seas, charge them extra and that fund goes to the unemployed here.

      Keeping up with Peace Talks around the world.

      I'm sure there is more, these are just a few things that I could think of now, that would be nice in the US.

      Please feel free to add to this, of any wants.


        wonderful wish list, WindorSolarPlease! Can't find a thing I wouldn't support. As to what else needs adding? Hmmm…where do I begin?

        Dismantle all military bases that are in foreign lands.

        Return all military personnel for defensive duty within the continental USA.

        Restore all military bases that were either down-sized or dismantled under the BRAC program. (A decentralized military within our borders has been established as the best defense against foreign invasion. These bases also act to support local economies.)

        Eliminate foreign aid to any country, unless such assistance is clearly established to be in the exclusive interest of US citizenry. (We are, after all, the ones who pay for foreign aid programs.)

        Add curricula to all private and public sectors that inform citizens how government works (or is supposed too!) and what our obligations are (and aren't!) to each other.

        These are but a few of my favorite things…

        • WindorSolarPlease

          Those are really good ideas. I agree..

          Think they will listen to us?

          • aigeezer aigeezer

            WSP, I hear you but there is a danger in labeling the world as a "powerful they" vs. a "victim us".

            As an alternative, how about "we (humanity) will no longer listen to them (the suddenly-unclothed irrelevant)", while not forgetting that power corrupts?

            It's a start.

            At one level it is trivially easy… just ignore them. Don't pay them tribute, taxes, respect, service, support, funds, homage, endorsement, attention, loyalty… legitimacy. What have "they" done for you lately?

            Oops, drone approaching. BRB.


              …love you aigeezer!

              • aigeezer aigeezer

                Thanks, AFTERSHOCK, I appreciate that. From the geezerbunker – I suspect we're miles apart on the little things, but in total synch on the big things. Here's to humanity and to all the critters we carry in our wake. As you know, "This ain't no party. This ain't no disco."



                  ahhh…Baader-Meinhoff. Those were the days, aigeezer, when lines were clearly drawn. Guiltless bombing missions over rice farmers in East Asia. The beneficent "Green Revolution" was but dormant and waiting for GMO wings. You wouldn't have thought it so, back then, but those were the days of innocent promise.

                  Yeah…doubtless we're miles apart. Which is why we're going to win this struggle. Diversity – at all levels – guarantees survival…

            • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication


              Above all, don't forget watching the evening "news" on television!

              The presentations are mostly completely or partially false and the actor-presenters have to KNOW what they are doing.

              Get your news from the alternative media.


            be assured WSP, they're looking at everything we have to say. If they're as 'intelligent' as they'd have us believe they are, they'd be well advised to heed what's being said…

            Never confuse theft with owning the cookie jar.

            • aigeezer aigeezer

              "Never confuse theft with owning the cookie jar."

              Woot! New to me – right on.


                and if they continue abusing that cookie jar, very soon they're going to be surprised by what they greedily bite-into…

          • WindorSolarPlease

            You two are too young for me, this site is as far as I go. I'm in my rocker stage of life, no revolution here.
            My cookie jar is empty, so they can have it.

            I'm all for peaceful and lawful demonstrations for our environment, even though our environment has had it.

            I think we are already radiated victims, at least I feel like one.

  • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

    Off-topic , i can no longer acces or read the Off-Topic section on ENE unless i'm logged in… The other threads are still visible ?

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    I can see this thread now. I clicked in on an old comment in the comment archive.

  • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

    Nope , i still need to be logged in it seems .

    • or-well

      anne, DID, I can only see "Off-Topic" thread if logged in, otherwise, all I see is the top of the Off-Topic page.
      I am logged in now.

      • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

        Securing the OT section a bit further maybe , or are some of us out of line ?


        • richard richard

          Hopefully admin will unsecure the OT thread. It wasn't visible to me either while logged out.

          To me, it makes sense to still leave it publicly available, no matter the login status.

          • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

            I agree richard , its suppose to be a thinkthank where the world can pick up ideas, and some spanking with the truth .

            • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

              BTW , i'm typing this from my laptop . I can no longer boot from my win7 pc. Log in procedure failiure just a few hours ago. I guess someone don't like my french .

      • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

        TY, Or-well. That's the secret. I have to be logged in also to see it.

    • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

      But it can be something in my safetysettings , i think i fumbled with them lately somewhere . Maybe it IS time to bite the bullet and switch to linux . Less spyware watching me.

      • or-well

        Aw DID, that sounds like something I would say –
        "I think I fumbled with them lately somewhere", not a statement from somebody with the confidence to switch to Linux 🙂

        • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

          It was during one of those " why i'm in the kitchen staring inside my fridge ??? " moments i guess lololol .

          For browsing and posting its easy enough nowaday's . Knoppix or something , just boot from cd , and save something you like to usb stick or something .

      • DUDe DisasterInterpretationDissorder

        Before i forget , thanks for chiming in both of you !

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    Resignation of EPA's Jackson is "serious warning" that climate in danger from Obama White House
    January 04, 2013
    “Jill Stein, the recent Green Party presidential candidate, said today that the resignation of Lisa Jackson as head of the Environmental Protection Agency underscores the resistance of the Obama administration to dealing with climate change and the environment.
    "’President Obama has been a climate change evader. Even when he briefly discussed climate change right after the election, he said any action would have to take a back seat to getting the economy moving again. He just doesn't grasp that the path to full employment starts with building a clean energy future. And that climate change is already underway and further delay will be a disaster,’ noted Stein.
    “Numerous media reports said that Jackson decided to leave due to her frustration over constant fights with the White House over climate change and the rejection of key environmental proposals such as regulating ozone. Obama last year decided to suspend EPA's new rules to reduce smog….”


      Oh, but rest assured Anne, Obummer will be screaming 'Climate Change' from the rooftops as he pushes Carbon Tax schemes off onto the People, and coming soon.

      I would just like to say that climate changes all the time. We live on Earth…duh!

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    Obama Warned To Prepare For Hillary Clinton Death
    Jan 2nd, 2013
    “A startling Foreign Military Intelligence (GRU) report circulating in the Kremlin today states that President Obama was informed by White House medical personal shortly after Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s [photo top right] return to the United States that her health prognosis was “grim” as her likelihood of survival was ‘diminishing by the hour.’
    “As we had previously reported in our 30 December report, Clinton Injured, US Navy Seal Killed In Secret US Mission To Iran, Secretary Clinton was severely injured over a fortnight ago when her US military C-12 Huron aircraft [photo 2nd right] crash landed at Iran’s Ahwaz International Airport during a US secret mission to that Persian Gulf nation where she was reported to be ‘unconscious’ and ‘bleeding profusely.’
    “US mainstream propaganda news sources have, so far, denied the truth of this incident and as late as 28 December were reporting that Secretary Clinton would be returning to work this past week after her having suffered a bout of the flu and a concussion.

    “Within hours of the GRU releasing their information on the Iranian air crash of the US military C-12 Huron, however, these same American media propaganda news sources began reporting that Secretary Clinton was hospitalized for what they described as a blood clot on her brain near her skull….

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

      “Russian medical experts quoted in this GRU report state that Secretary Clinton has “more than likely” suffered what they call a Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI) as a result of the plane crash and that they say is the “only reasonable explanation” for a blood clot appearing in the location between the skull and the brain.
      “Further confirmation of true facts relating to Secretary Clinton were, also, released by the Israeli MOSSAD linked news site DEBKA, who in their 31 December article titled, Hillary Clinton In Hospital Amid Speculation Of Plane Accident In Iran, wrote:

      “’…around Tehran and the Gulf Emirates, debkafile was already picking up insistent rumors claiming that Clinton was seriously injured while on a secret mission in the region in the first week of December. Some claimed that in the same incident, Americans in her party – advisers and security personnel – were either injured or killed. Those rumors did not say what her secret mission was. However, the episode described occurred shortly after Dec. 1, when, as debkafile reported at the time, Obama administration officials and senior representatives of Ayatollah Ali Khamenei launched secret talks on Iran’s nuclear program.’…”

  • RealityControl-1984


    Guess who gets the most donations from nuclear weapons contractors?

    Drum roll….

    "The top single Senate recipient is Diane Feinstein (D-Cal.), who chairs the Intelligence Committee and the appropriations subcommittee that handles the Energy Department’s nuclear weapons budget; she collected $74,500 in this election cycle and $421,747 over her 20-year career…"

  • Sickputer

    Two big Iran rumors circulating:

    1. Clinton injured and near death from plane crash in Iran early December 2012.

    2. 1.5 million Iranians evacuated from city as result of nuclear accident.

    SP: I am almost inclined to believe Linda Thompson has awakened in South Carolina from her two decade slumber and is up to some more super Patriot mischief.

    I feel there is some sort of vendetta being waged here against the lame duck president and maybe some sour grapes aimed at the outgoing Sec. of State. But who knows? They have made a lot of enemies.

    Certainly it is possible Clinton went secretly to Iran. But unlikely. Too many folks traveling and observing her entourage. Too many cellphones to keep plane crashes secret.

    Even more cellphones and spies in Iran who could report on a bad nuclear accident. And lots of downwind who would confirm.

    As several people noted… the pollution reason for the evacuation is founded in fact. Namely that the embargo has limited low sulphur gasoline to Iranians and their old cars are big polluters (another embargo issue). The country is a holy rambling wreck.

    If I am wrong I will take a walkabout for three days in penance. 😉

  • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar anne

    • Friday, January 04, 2013 at 13:52:58 UTC
    • Friday, January 04, 2013 at 10:52:58 PM at epicenter
    36.910°N, 141.338°E
    63.5 km (39.5 miles)
    43 km (26 miles) ESE of Iwaki, Japan
    54 km (33 miles) ENE of Kitaibaraki, Japan
    59 km (36 miles) ENE of Takahagi, Japan
    70 km (43 miles) ENE of Hitachi, Japan

  • Dogleg Dogleg

    Sorry, old news

  • razzz razzz

    Declaring contents of a package sent from and out of the US…

  • kalidances

    New fault found on seabed near Kanto region