Gundersen: Move south of equator if Unit 4 fuel pool goes dry, that’s probably the lesson there — Like cesium from all 800 nuclear bombs ever dropped on Earth, except all at once (VIDEO)

Published: May 4th, 2012 at 7:20 am ET
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Follow-up to: Caldicott: If Spent Fuel Pool No. 4 collapses I am evacuating my family from Boston (VIDEO)

Arnie Gundersen Interview
KGO Radio’s Pat Thurston
April 15, 2012

Gundersen at ~25:00 in

There’s more cesium in that [Unit 4] fuel pool than in all 800 nuclear bombs exploded above ground…

But of course it would happen all at once.

It would certainly destroy Japan as a functioning country…

Move south of the equator if that ever happened, I think that’s probably the lesson there.

Listen to the full interview here

h/t rumorecurioso

KGO 810 San Francisco

Pat Thurston

  • Saturday: 6:00 PM – 9:00 PM
  • Sunday: 4:00 PM – 7:00 PM

Pat Thurston joined KGO Newstalk 810 in 2007, and began hosting her own show in September 2009. She began her long career in broadcasting during her days in the United States Army where she hosted a television show.

Pat was raised in the East Bay in a family of 8 children. She left California to work for the United States Secret Service and attended Indiana University and Purdue University. She returned to Northern California, and was married in 2002.

Please visit our hourly archive directory for her audio.

See also: Gundersen: "The water is steaming and boiling" still at Fukushima; "Yes, there's some radiation being given off " (AUDIO) -- Visible in recent Tepco webcam footage? (VIDEO)

Published: May 4th, 2012 at 7:20 am ET
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180 comments

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  2. Reuters: Corrosion is weakening Fukushima Unit No. 4 — Concern quake to ‘topple’ bulging structure — Holds 14,000 Hiroshima bombs worth of cesium-137 August 14, 2013
  3. Nuclear Professor: 5,000 Hiroshima bombs worth of cesium-137 in spent fuel pool No. 4 — “Low estimate” (VIDEO) May 8, 2012
  4. Nuclear Expert: Everybody is now paying attention to Unit 4 because we have four years to go before fuel removed — If water lost, a beacon of radiation will bathe site in ‘sky shine’ from gamma rays (AUDIO) May 3, 2012
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180 comments to Gundersen: Move south of equator if Unit 4 fuel pool goes dry, that’s probably the lesson there — Like cesium from all 800 nuclear bombs ever dropped on Earth, except all at once (VIDEO)

  • goathead goathead

    Out of the nuclear fire and into the frying pan folks!


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    • It's difficult to live if you are dead !


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      • He says move to Southern hemisphere !
        He says more cesium then all bombs before, …= HOW MUCH MORE ???
        They got to get the fuel out of unit 4, …= or else !


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        • If the #4 pool collapses or merely ruptures to the point where it can no longer hold water, the facility will have to be abandoned. They might get a rotating crew of "liquidators" to oversee the remote-control collapse-and-bury operations, but operations at all other facilities at the reservation would be abandoned. Including the common pool [with more than 11,000 assemblies], which is a mere 50 yards from #4 SFP.

          TEPCO's "on vacation." The Japanese government just gave them a billion yen, maybe they skipped the country? The sudden onslaught of public pronouncements and please to the UN, other nuclear nations, and the Japanese government have a purpose. Let's hope it's not too late.


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          • Joy

            I personally think the show is up.

            The vacation plus onslaught of public pronouncements are part of the picture.

            The iodine detections and scary fukushima webcam predictions are another.

            However, I'm still holding out hope that the pools are intact.

            I'm very interested in your gut feeling?


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            • Oh, my gut's been in knots since March 11th of last year, Majia. And every time I analyze a report as to what's really happening, it's rudely denounced (with prejudice) for months before TEPCO or Japanese government officials finally confirm it as having already happened.

              I don't like the current goings-on one little bit. First TEPCO was taking weekends off, now entire weeks. And we don't know yet if they'll bother coming back. The money transfer has already taken place. It's the government's problem now, and they can't handle it any better than TEPCO did. The situation is dire, and as earthquakes keep building, there's not much time. If there's any time at all, of course (it could have already happened).

              I hope the #4 pool hasn't already collapsed and isn't burning. I think we'd get some indication of that regardless of coverup efforts. I view the steam 'events' over the last few days to be a play-out of what I previously predicted – exit of one or more corium flows from the cliff into the lagoon (or intake area south). They began laying borated concrete in those areas a couple of months ago. And I am not entirely technologically ignorant about what capabilities first world governments have deployed in space. I think they've been following the corium flows all along. That event could do the same thing as collapse of the #4 pool – make things far too radioactive for humans. Either way, it's the same end game.

              Immediate world response is entirely…


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              • jump-ball

                Moon's closest monthly position to earth (perigee) on Sunday, coinciding with full moon, for so-called "supermoon", along with U.S. west coast high tides of 7.1 and 7.2 feet on Sat. and Sun., combine to form Jim Berkland's and others earthquake 'windows' from today into next week.

                Our inverted pendulum 'P-Wave' quake detector is set to high sensitivity, the van will be parked outside the garage for 5 more days, and a Pacific or nearby San Andreas shaker won't catch us off guard.

                If we're not looking for it, what chance do we have to see it coming?


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            • ARGH!!!

              Immediate world response is entirely warranted. And it's got no time for "study groups." Fortunately, those studies have already been done by the NEIs of the various countries, and they know precisely what the challenges are. They even have game plans on dealing with it, because all nuclear nations must game the scenario. It's a National Security concern (under which all nukes have always been listed).

              I just don't see the coordinated response we might hope the nuclear nations would now, more than a year later, be prepared to deploy. Disconcerting, since their families and nations are at threat from this catastrophe too.


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              • thank you

                I figured that experts around the world have been following this but I haven't understood why there has been no visible response.

                I guess our culture and civilization are more hindrance, than help, to mortal self preservation.

                The willingness to allow the charade seems now to be what has allowed the situation to exceed our remotest capabilities

                I do think some people know what is happening and I agree with whoever suggested (maybe Still Jill) that we watch privileged elites' actions, rather than words, when interpreting developments


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  • apostrophes

    Gunderson seems to be saying a lot more stuff, and a lot more significant stuff, than previously. Perhaps he thinks everything has got to such a point where he has got nothing to lose?


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    • apostrophes

      Please note I reported on my own comment. I wanted to contact Admin about difficulties accessing the site.


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    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

      @apostrophes: "Perhaps he thinks everything has got to such a point where he has got nothing to lose?" We should welcome the truth; harsh as it my be. But is it responsible for such a prominent representative of the anti-nuclear movement to be making such statements in pubic? Perhaps his statement's being taken out of context or freely divulged. If he's freely making such statements in public, then it's irresponsible on his part.

      The fact is, there's no way of moving such populations to the southern hemisphere. Assuming he's made this statement and that it's not been taken out of context, his advising that we make our way to the southern hemisphere borders on recklessness.

      If SFP-#4 goes, ninety-nine percent of those who reside in the northern hemisphere will have to suffer-through the immediate consequences. The balance of humanity will be 'gifted' with the remains of these radioactive gases as they gradually make their way throughout the entire planet. It will be an extinction-level-event; albeit, an agonizingly slow one. Predicting such horrors will not eliminate this sword of Damocles.

      We've long needed a structured response to this threat, not headline-grabbing speculation. Feeding such fears (in public) is dangerous and counterproductive. There's very little that any can do to protect ourselves from this scenario. Making it overtly public will lead to untold suicides, murders and accelerating chaos. We all need to be more…


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      • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

        …responsible!


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      • selfsovereign

        Hi AFTERSHOCK,
        Arnie Gundersen is pro-nuclear energy. A MUCH NEEDED and MUCH APPRECIATED voice, but pro-nuke nonetheless.
        I'm sure you have all seen the youtube video where Gundersen gets up on stage with those psychopaths from the navy, whom dump their reactor cores into the ocean, and profess to all that nuclear power IS SAFE, but only if it is done OUR way, with these small reactors designed for submarines.

        No offense intended, just a genuine review of the available data.
        Perhaps, in much the same way that noam chomsky is dissmissive of the near free-fall speed of the building 7 collapse, or, amy goodmans' infamous funding by the ford foundation, Arnie Gundersen MAY be a gatekeeper for his industry. I believe the term is called 'controlled dissent'.

        I LOVE Arnie, Amy and Noam, they ARE priceless voices in a callous, apathy filled world. But I must keep my emotions @ arms length when objectively analizing all available data.

        By the way, Mr. and Mrs. Gundersen (if you're out there), we would all appreciate full disclosure of the data concerning the Portland Oregon farm that shut its doors of operation after testing their soil. Please complete this compelling story YOU started, PLEASE.
        PEACE


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        • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

          @selfsovereign: your overview explains much. As stated in my post, his 'revelations' seem incredibly irresponsible on his part. I cannot fathom his motives for such public discourse, unless it's meant to create panic; thus generating unquestioned support for something that's yet to be imposed on us all.

          Thanks for your insights!


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          • selfsovereign

            Hi AFTERSHOCK,
            Thanks for the feedback.
            Perhaps Arnies motives are created out of the frustration he feels, knowing there isn't going to be any responsible actions by the governments of the world.
            IF Arnie believes bld 4 has already released some/most/all of sfp4 as a volatolized particulate, perhaps THIS is the only way he can BEGIN to approach the subject of such a permanent reality. A lot of 'ifs' on my part, for sure.

            Other people on this site are far braver than I in their frank review of bld 4.

            Personally, I always look for the cause of something. As in, looking at the damage of bld 4 today,what would it take for this damage to have occured? A massive energy source, unleashed.
            With no video of the damage as it happened to bld4, we only have 'after the fact' images.
            Early on, we saw a panel blown out on the south side, with a brownish/red oxidized-looking stain @ the lowest center point of the blowout. This location is near the sfp. An energy source inside the building must, in my mind, have been released, inside the building @ that location. The progression of events forward since that panel blowout has included big explosions, or energy releases, from this building, as we all have witnessed. I believe the sfp in bld4 to have already been aerasolized, as the far brighter and braver folks on this site have stated for quite some time now. Forgive my rambling on………….PEACE


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            • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

              @selfsovereign: rants and rambling are always welcome!

              You'll have to forgive my paltry response, but I'm not as well versed on the conditions of these facilities, as others. I have a difficult time digesting the massive amount of analysis and data that's presented on this site. Many are miles ahead of me, in their ability to make sense of this catastrophe. I've also come to trust more in those who frequent this site than those claim professional insight. I sometimes feel like a fumbling TEPCO executive, trying to make sense of the day's report. That said, I'll try to keep from gnawing away at what's left of my fingernails…

              …keep-up the good work selfsovereign!


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            • StillJill StillJill

              Yes, selfsovereign,…#4 has aerasolized into the atmosphere,…at best-imo.

              We need to judge more by what 'they' do,…not what they say. No one has lifted a finger to stop this mess,…other than tepco's circus show. What does that tell us? Why would other governments,…who DO KNOW what's up,…do nothing? There is ONLY one answer,…we all know what that is. Some just 'want to WISH'. They need a baby blanket and a binky in their mouths! :-(


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              • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                @StillJill: I'm laughing so hard…almost choked on my binky!!!


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                • StillJill StillJill

                  There, there little AFTERSHOCK,….we'll just pin it to your onezies! :-)


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                  • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                    I had such a deprived childhood, my parents would stuff used cigarette butts in our mouths before lulling us off to sleep. We were two to a bed; sometimes three if the crates collapsed. It was a wonderful childhood. Cold drafts would insinuate themselves through the creaky windows, late at night. We shivered under used army blankets. Didn't know what a binky was until my first child was born. Did my best to make sure my kids would never have to endure what I had. And now this nightmare comes-up over the horizon…


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                    • StillJill StillJill

                      AFTERSHOCK,….I heard Dolly Parton talk about her childhood too. She said they were 3-4 to a bed,….and that they were so cold, they'd pee in bed just to get warm for a few minutes! (I swear-West Virginia, I think).

                      If you are not pulling my leg about the cigg butts,….abuse was clearly involved here,….and for that,….I shall grade you on a GIGANTIC curve my friend! I am truly sorry you had to maturate around those odds! You're a PURE miracle then too, BTW!

                      Baptism into the good guys club,….(pardon the vernacular),…don't come easy!

                      I am always blessed when I hear such self-disclosure!

                      I wish (pray) COMFORT finds you and envelopes you. (I know He will!) :-)


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                    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                      @StillJill: Aside from the drafts and huddled nights, the rest is pure entertainment. I knew you'd love the imagery of the cigs hanging from my pouting lips…


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                    • aigeezer aigeezer

                      AFTERSHOCK, in case you haven't seen this before, here's an animated avatar with your name all over it, pouting lips and all:

                      http://img1.jurko.net/avat2.gif

                      Enenews doesn't allow animated avatars – perhaps it's just as well.

                      I don't know of any animated avatars for 800 simultaneous nuclear bombs though – probably a snow crash would work.


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                    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                      …thanks aigeezer! Cute little brat looks as satisfied as I was, with that smoke…


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                • selfsovereign

                  Much respect to ALL the souls on this site.
                  Not only are you all a source of inspiration in these dire times, but you've actually raised my hypocrytical view of humanity – and I NEVER expected that. TY


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        • el

          none of these talking heads should be taken at face value.


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          • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

            agreed el…


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          • Time Is Short Time Is Short

            Here's a key omission. Arnie's talking about cesium again. All the 'limited' press we might get on the MSM is always about cesium levels. The guy testing his seafood, the kelp in California, it's all 'cesium'. These are 'talking points' given to them, nothing more.

            When was the last time anyone seriously discussed levels of aerosolized uranium and plutonium? I don't give a damn about cesium, I want to know where the uranium and plutonium is. How far has it been blown in the upper atmosphere? What are the levels being spread in the rainfall?

            All the MSM health stories are about cesium levels. How much plutonium in the water supply will cause massive cell damage in our biosphere?

            20+ plants, 20+ SFPs, ? common SFPs, no truth on how much MOX is involved, WTF?

            C'mon, Arnie, grow a pair!


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            • StillJill StillJill

              +1,0000000000000


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              • selfsovereign

                TIS, I love it when someone cuts right to the quick of an issue. We know the plutonium made it as far as Lithuania – three quarters of the way around the world. One half of a millionth of a gram is fatal.


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            • moonshellblue moonshellblue

              Yes, I also wonder about the plutonium as it has been stated that one rod contains enough plutonium to wipe out 2.89 billion people. If this statement is indeed true Reactor 3, full of Mox, blew sky high and while I don't think this is an ELE as some men that flew above the Chernobyl reactor as it was spewing lethal amounts of radioactivity are still alive but of course this would be at least 85x worse. I digress, I know there is a map showing plutonium dispersion? It's here on Enenews I think somewhere or maybe it was Agreen…that did some calculation. If anyone knows please post. Thanks in advance.


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            • Don't worry. If most and/or all of the cesium inventory gets out, it'll kill you long before the plutonium will.


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        • VanneV anne

          Arnie Gundersen is not pro-nuclear. He has stated that he is anti-nuclear.


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          • NoNukes NoNukes

            anne,

            I don't know of any time that Gundersen has claimed to be against nuclear power. He is against some types of nuclear power plants, and seems to be for smaller nuclear power plants. Do you have some other information? I believe that he has the position that he does because he is pro-nuke.

            "This is a 20-year-old decision," Mr. Gundersen explained. "We proved to them that would be cheaper to stop construction now and then build smaller plants as the need developed, but they are stuck in a mindset. Because they have spent so much money on it, there is a feeling that they have to go forward.

            http://www.state.nv.us/nucwaste/news2000/nn10410.htm


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            • No Nukes

              In his latest interview linked by Enenews, Arnie states that his thinking has evolved and now he believes we "are not smart enough" to handle what mother nature can throw at us.

              He has changed his position after Fukushima and thinks all forms of nuclear are unsafe and too expensive to boot.

              That is what he said in the latest interview.


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      • I don't think the head hunters will waste time targeting whistle blowers if they are scurrying to their caves/bunkers !


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      • I think that's what this site is for AfterShock – to prevent panic.

        People can learn and make their minds up as they do so. They've had a whole year to prepare.

        If they had listened to Arnie in the first place ("Chernobyl on steroids"), and now, they would have been out of there a long time ago. Some are already leaving – in a steadily-increasing trickle rather than a rush for the doors.

        In any case, it's not just Arnie saying it – many others are saying the same thing – so no one person can be accused of panicking the rabble.

        Helen's been trying to 'panic' them for years, to no avail.


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        • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

          @Pu239: there's a big difference between informing and panicking the masses.

          We might be girded for the truth. We've been gradually tempered by these revelations over the last year. I simply want no part in anything that inadvertently leads to the destruction of others and offers no hope. It's imperative that we remain measured in our public discourse. We must avoid nihilist predictions.

          Many look to this forum for advice and direction. We'll serve little purpose if our work offers nothing-more than a shovel and veil…


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    • All that cesium at once,… would that mean masses would die of heart attacks soon after ?

      : |


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      • selfsovereign

        Hi Doc,
        I had rapid heartbeart throughout last summer, even while just sitting and NOT reading enenews/fuku diary(lol).
        On top of the cesium there is one of the decay products (krypton?xenon?) that ends up as regular, stable potassium, lots of potassium. This could cause rapid heartbeat.
        I previously posted a calcium chloride source, a heart muscle food, that I used (bugleweed) all through the summer. It slows the frequency of the heartbeat, allowing more rest time between beats – as well as increasing the heart pulse, delivering more blood per contraction. Instead of a quick pitter-patter-pitter-patter of a heartbeat that fatigues the muscle without moving much blood.
        http://www.horizonherbs.com/product.asp?specific=1767
        Anyone else experience rapid heart beat last summer, that you never had before? HHHMMMM…..


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        • StillJill StillJill

          I did. Sometimes I could,…and can,…hear and feel my rapid heartbeat up in my head. A loud, thumping, almost like crescendos! :-(

          Sometimes in the sauna,….I have to lay down and practice slow, deep breathing,….to slow my heartbeat. I have mitral valve prolapse as it is,….so it gets scary.


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        • selfsovereign,
          We know that only a few pounds can make a nuke bomb in the thousands of tonnes, so we have hundred's thousands of rods weighing in at about 15 hundred lbs. a piece !
          I think the release pf cesium would be astronomical !

          : |

          Stilljill, … be still my heart !


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    • Anthony Anthony

      Everybody is talking more. It's hitting the fan time.


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  • voltscommissar

    "go south young woman/man"

    Well, it's been said before, in Nevil Shute's blook "On the Beach", also made into a movie in 1959 at the height of the Cold War. So of course the scenario then was an all-out nuclear exchange between US and USSR (CCCP) making the top hemisphere top-heavy with toxic nuclear pollutants.

    So those who could get out, came south, but in this fictional fantasy the intense radiation continues its deadly march all the way to the South Pole and thus wipes out civilization entirely (not to mention lower life forms)

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0053137/
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Beach_%281959_film%29


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  • voltscommissar

    what the?…. "blook" = book


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    • voltscommissar,
      No problem, it's happening to all of us ! LOL

      These types of problems are not as common in adults since the brain has completed its development but high enough doses of whole brain radiation can lower intellectual capacities in adults as well, as noted on the Abramson Cancer Center of the University of Pennsylvania website.

      Full Brain Radiation Side Effects | LIVESTRONG.COM

      Sep 2, 2010 … Memory and Learning Difficulties. Full brain radiation therapy may impact memory, learning and IQ. Full brain radiation in children may lower IQ …
      http://www.livestrong.com/article/222670-full-brain-radiation-side-effects/

      Protected from external energy from radio frequency radiation that decreases IQ, organ function, stamina and lifespan. The artist depiction above is a generally …
      http://www.us-government-torture.com/KIT.html


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  • Whoopie Whoopie

    Incredible. So that's 2 experts saying they will move. Wish I could. :(


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  • stopnp stopnp

    Damn it. I really hope the pool doesn't go.


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    • cossack55

      Wish in one hand and spit in the other.


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      • stopnp stopnp

        Right, never heard that one before… I'm south already. I have quite a few friends on the west coast. I'm praying. 419 days. A@@holes.


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      • arclight arclight

        ive got spit dribbling down my hand… now what? ;)


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        • Sharp2197 Sharp2197

          lmao, I have never heard that cossack.???


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          • StillJill StillJill

            I like cossak's version better. Have heard, "Yeah,…wish in one hand,…and a pile of shit in the other". My roommate keeps saying , "I wish", also. Drives me crazy! Like,…O.K., wish all you want,…while Rome burns down,….wanna do a STUDY? Fucking idiots!


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            • moonshellblue moonshellblue

              "If wishes were hoses beggars would ride" I could go south but will not leave my family. Also, I don't think there is any where on this planet if the entire facility bites the dust or rather creates a lethal dust which will blow everywhere. No where to run to baby, no where to hide. IMHO


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              • moonshellblue moonshellblue

                Rather horses geez my typing/spelling is abysmal and apologize.


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                • What-About-The-Kids

                  LOL!!!! Thanks you guys for the belly laughs this morning! I needed them! :-D

                  I love Arclight's comment "I got spit dribbling down my arm, now what?" LOL and MoonShell's typo: "If wishes here hoses…" LOL!!! You guys are too much!

                  Ahh…I feel much better. One can only take so much doom and gloom without at least a bit of comic relief. :-)

                  Thanks everyone.


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              • PoorDaddy PoorDaddy

                Mornin moonshellblue……
                If wishes were hoses……..we could all put the "fires" out at Fuku!
                Thanks for the chuckle!


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  • Ariana

    There is a part of me that wants to bury my head in the sand and stop reading things like this. I am a teacher, and my husband is a police officer. The odds of us ever having the money to make such a move are slim to none. Then, there is the rest of our family to consider. I don't think I am capable of just leaving the continent, leaving my family here to die horrific deaths. I would rather stand in the flames with them. This whole situation is so sick. :(


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    • Whoopie Whoopie

      It is ariana. It is amazing to witness these people, experts admitting this truth. Where is the rest of the MSM? The whole world has gone mad. People aren't 'waking up' to this danger in Japan like they should. Wake every morning to the front page of HP – and the news is just damn crazy…but nothing about Japan. I dont know if they aren't aware or dont want to cause panic. I'd much rather have panic than a whole country taken down by surprise, which will happen if 4 goes. What the hell is wrong with our MSM?


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  • Whoopie Whoopie

    Must have missed this on the 1st @ HP
    The French Presidential Election: the Roles of Fascism and Fukushima http://huff.to/Jbu8OV via @HuffPostWorld


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  • Ariana

    I don't know what is wrong with everyone. I really think it has to do with politics. The government does not want us to "wake up" to the reality that nuclear power will be the end of civilization as we know it. So we see all of these people riding around with bumper stickers that say "say no to coal" and "clean energy" but they don't know what they're actually saying. If you consider the big energy companies, they do not care about a few million cancer deaths because their company will still be around even after those deaths. Even if the ceo drops dead, they still make money. It's all about the almighty dollar.
    I am ashamed of our government because I think we should be properly informed of this danger rather than having to search "underground" news sources. Although, in the back of my mind, I always knew they would fail us. When it comes to money or life, money will always win. It's pure evil.


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    • Bobby1

      These non-human entities called "corporations" are granted personhood by the government, though they don't live, love, feel, get sick, or die like humans do. It is truly a dystopian science-fiction scenario where aliens are in control, aliens that worship the god Mammon, where human life and all life on earth is just an expedient.


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  • stopnp stopnp

    Our government is a joke. I'm glad I've payed my taxes. Thank you EPA for lying and shutting yourself down. Thank you FDA for lying about the food. Rant…


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  • PhilipUpNorth philipupnorth

    Thank you once again Arnie Gundersen! :) The young will take only a backpack, as always. The rich will be buying second homes in the southern hemisphere. But us poor old people will still be right here, looking out our window as the radioactive rain falls outdoors.

    Arnie Gundersen is telling the truth. TELLING THE TRUTH IS NEVER IRRESPONSIBLE!


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  • stopnp stopnp

    Where is Obama right mow?


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    • 3C

      Me thinks he is paddling like hell under water.
      He has as much to loose as the rest of us including his two beautiful daughters and wife. Something tells me that he gets a daily brief, has many quietly working on a plan B and C. Notice,
      if you will, that he has said nothing about atomics in his vision of future enrgy supplies. Plan D has to be shutting down all of the reactors in the U.S. and securing methods to keep them, and their SFP cool forever ( and forever is a very long time).


      Report comment

  • Ariana

    He's sitting there with his thumb in his ass planning out how many nuclear facilities he can build in the US in the next few years.


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  • Whoopie Whoopie

    Tepco started manipulating dosage of nuclear workers | Fukushima Diary: http://bit.ly/ILX29f


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    • moonshellblue moonshellblue

      Whoopie I think the workers themselves do this as they do not want to exceed the maximum dosage and thus lose their job as for TEPCO I'm sure they turn a blind eye.


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  • many moons

    There are nuclear reactors in the southern hemis. and so when there is a problem with one of thse reactors do we shoot for the moon???
    What's the plan?
    We should have learned from Russia just what kind of sacrifice is involved when dealing with a nuclear "cleanup." If a country doesn't have 200,000 young men available to die the shouldn't have nuclear reactors.


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    • apostrophes

      Last time I looked, there were only 2 or 3, and all of them were in South America. Should be easy to check if you have the time.


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      • moonshellblue moonshellblue

        If the lightening don't get ya the thunder will. In the southern hemisphere not just nukes but volcanoes and earthquakes. I really don't think heading south is a panacea or the answer to radiation. So those of you who just cannot leave don't feel like you are missing the boat to a long, safe, happy life. JMHO


        Report comment

    • The_one

      There are three in South America and one in South Africa. So a total of four plants in the southern hemisphere… Wonder why that is? Some people know how to plan ahead maybe?


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  • Dog

    Yeah, I must admit that our governments are joke. We should have known better: it is nuclear all right whether we rely on it as energy source or bomb. However, you heard Gundersen fair and square. In fact, this is not news-some of Japanese specialists have been warning about it. Simply, it's our systems where major media are not designed to tell us such info.


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  • many moons

    Here is a wonderful video of Brazilian actors trying to inform the general public about a hydro electric plant that will be built, that will destroy a lot of the amazon, that isn't a good choice as a power source and what people can do about it.
    Maybe we should make some of these videos….I for one would like too question the US goverment on their choice to not test for radiation, to turn off the radiation detectors and the list of questions goes on…I like the format that was chosen for the video.
    http://youtu.be/kAAdXrdXSpM


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    • selfsovereign

      Hi many moons,
      Do you know if there is an english version of this one?
      I sure wish we had just one language on this planet, don't care which one. All these different tongues leaves a lot of knowledge undiscovered by simple-minded, single-tongued folks like me.

      Hows the weather down there 2-day?


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      • many moons

        I don't know of an audio translation but there is a written translation at the bottom of the video.
        I'm in the states right now I don't know the weather is today.


        Report comment

  • khaake

    Too little and maybe way too late, but here's a recently-launched Facebook page calling for the nuclear industry to be shut down. They are trying to push a petition calling for a 100% nuclear-free power grid in the US by 2022.

    http://www.facebook.com/ShutDownNuclearPower
    http://www.change.org/petitions/nuclear-power-too-dangerous-too-expensive-not-worth-it


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  • Hot Tuna Hot Tuna

    There is a conference about Fukushima in New York starting about now (7am PST).

    http://www.psr.org/news-events/events/press-conference-on-fukushima.html

    I think you can watch it live here: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/test-erf


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  • Dog

    Searched for an English source. One of the specialists is Dr.Koide (http://www.eurasiareview.com/20042012-is-fukushimas-doomsday-machine-about-to-blow-oped/). Also, please search the net for "spent fuel."

    Due to the mechanism, which is up in the air literally, only miracle would save Japan as a nation but, for the Earth, I think it shouldn't be too late.


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  • Gotham

    FUKUSALL – sums it up.


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  • Ganxet Ganxet

    why not to build a solar plant like Sevilla's (spain) one?
    it produces solar energy 24/7.


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  • Ganxet Ganxet

    Is new zeland in southern hemisphere? Why had been found hot spot on there?
    Why to move to southern hem.?


    Report comment

    • voltscommissar

      sick migratory birds don't poop enough radioactivity to seriously add to New Zealand's radioactive pollution, which is probably mainly due to US/French nuclear testing decades ago in the Pacific ocean region.


      Report comment

      • voltscommissar,
        Hundreds of deing and dead whales last past year tell a story too !
        I won't list the dolphines !

        Carcass of endangered Bryde's whale found off Waiheke, New Zealand11
        To Mass Animal Death on Wednesday, March 21, 2012

        Southern Right whale washed up in Rakaia River, New Zealand47
        To Mass Animal Death on Thursday, March 08, 2012

        Dead whale found at sea near Napier, New Zealand10
        To Mass Animal Death on Wednesday, February 15, 2012

        Dead Orca carcass off New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand27
        To Mass Animal Death on Friday, February 10, 2012

        True's beaked whale Beached, first of its kind in New Zealand57
        To Mass Animal Death on Wednesday, February 08, 2012

        Bryde's whale found dead near Auckland, New Zealand26
        To Mass Animal Death on Wednesday, February 01, 2012

        All 33 restranded whales shot dead, New Zealand144
        To Mass Animal Death on Thursday, January 26, 2012

        40 more whales dead threatens 36 at Farewell Spit, New Zealand *UPDATED*184
        To Mass Animal Death on Monday, January 23, 2012

        Four whales found dead on Papamoa Beach in Bay of Plenty, New Zealand56
        To Mass Animal Death on Saturday, January 21, 2012

        Pilot Whales stranding 7 dead, 18 refloated in New Zealand *VIDEO*69
        To Mass Animal Death on Saturday, January 07, 2012

        65 pilots whales in mass stranding die, South Island, New Zealand46
        To Mass Animal Death on Tuesday, November 15, 2011


        Report comment

        • Dead Humpback Whale left on Monkey Island, New Zealand31
          To Mass Animal Death on Monday, November 14, 2011

          Sperm whale washes up at Baylys beach, New Zealand28
          To Mass Animal Death on Monday, November 14, 2011

          Newborn long-finned pilot whale put down New Zealand – PHOTO48
          To Mass Animal Death on Monday, October 31, 2011

          Another dead whale located, Papamoa Beach, New Zealand24
          To Mass Animal Death on Friday, October 28, 2011

          Dead Sperm Whale's washed in, Coopers Beach, New Zealand64
          To Mass Animal Death on Saturday, October 15, 2011

          Gigantic Rare Whale, washes up dead on a Heaphy beach, New Zealand572
          To Mass Animal Death on Sunday, September 18, 2011

          15-20 ton Bryde's whale found dead in the Hauraki Gulf, New Zealand91
          To Mass Animal Death on Wednesday, September 14, 2011

          First Massive Blue Whale in 30 years washes up Dead, New Zealand *5 PICS*2405
          To Mass Animal Death on Monday, May 02, 2011


          Report comment

          • selfsovereign

            OMG
            Jaw hits floor…….


            Report comment

            • What-About-The-Kids

              Mine too. :-( This is heart-wrenching. And this is JUST animal die offs in New Zealand since 3/11???

              I don't know what else to say… :-(


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              • selfsovereign, What-About-The-Kids,

                These are the ones that my search engines could pick up, I am finding that maybe as many as a 3rd or more whales are dieing around the globe that are not reported or never make the news, many just sink to the bottom of the ocean never to be known to their fate !

                : |


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      • Sick bird poop. Wherever the excrement lands will become contaminated. If it lands on a piece of lettuce that does not get properly washed and it's ingested, then that will increase your odds, or a loved ones odds, of suffering.

        When that bird dies, it's bones and remains will mix back into the soil or water. That radioactive contamination will then remain hazardous to life for 10 times longer than the isotopes estimated decay rate. (half-life)

        So, if you eat a peach that has grown in the soil or water where the birds pooped or died, then guess what?


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    • Anthony Anthony

      I think Arnie is talking about degrees and levels of fallout exposure! It stands to reason scientifically speaking that the HI, West Coast, Alaska will be heavily effected by jet stream fallout. Some then travel over the rest of the continent. Over time I think the pollutants end up everywhere but I can see benefit to consider exiting the direct area before heavy contaminants arrive. The accumulation levels thereafter should be staggering – all through the jet steam.


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  • openeye openeye

    Good morning, fellow and sister sufferers,

    Helen and Arnie have the means to move south. Many of us do not.

    But it is vital for all of us to have access to the truth: if it true that we face an extinction event, and we are enabled to know that to be true, we will be motivated do some deep soul searching, parallel to an individual who has learned he has a terminal disease.

    I detest elitism, in this case the obstacles the power elites place in the way of the common man learning the truth and the refusal to take concerted action to save lives. It's monstrous.

    Check out this quote from the DHS-funded study, which concluded that if the public panics it will hurt the economy. Keeping that in mind as the elitist goal, ponder this quote:
    Anything we can do from a policy standpoint that can reduce excessive public concern about an event has huge economic benefits,” said [William Burns, a decision research scientist at California State San Marcos]. “We’re not trying to bamboozle the public. We want them to believe the truth based on expert, objective people.”Anything we can do from a policy standpoint that can reduce excessive public concern about an event has huge economic benefits,” said [William Burns, a decision research scientist at California State San Marcos]. “We’re not trying to bamboozle the public. We want them to believe the truth based on expert, objective people.”

    P.S. Controlled dissent is not truth telling; those who purposely participate in it are…


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  • openeye openeye

    prostitutes. I doubt Arnie is a conscious puppet, and I thank him for his concern for mankind. But I have been proven wrong before! I have become accustomed to losing heros, Amy Goodman and Noam Chomsky among them.

    Few have unsullied motives in this world of hurt we live in. But some humans try to find the truth even about themselves, and to continually purify their hearts.

    May God help us,

    openeye


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  • StillJill StillJill

    God helps those who can not help themselves!

    It's his spessEality! :-) (misspelled purposely, spell police!)

    Dearest openeye,….'we' are CAPTIVE ROYALTY my friend,…He'll not leave us forsaken, Yes?

    Let us nurture ourselves in His place, 'til He comes! :-)


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    • The_one

      And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
      [4] And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
      [5] And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
      [6] And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.


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  • openeye openeye

    Thanks much for the validation–how I need community at this desperate hour:

    Just out from Dr. Sircus:

    http://blog.imva.info/world-affairs/mankinds-desperate-hour


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    • Sickputer

      Usenet 101…cross-thread posting is also not one of my favs… *;

      I will not repost my reply from the other thread….

      Yep…old SP is slightly surly today…please forgive…I am usually not a scolding SOB. *;-)

      The time lapse is great BTW…I have seen it long ago though and actually it is not offtopic in this thread, but I would appreciate a sentence to explain a link anybody posts. Not too much to ask even if youa re on a smart phone (like me).


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    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

      …awesome link openeye…thanks!


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  • PhilipUpNorth philipupnorth

    We are quite close to a tipping point with regards to Fuku. Everyone in power now already knows that Fuku is a probable ELE. All that remains is for the public to get involved. Arnie knows that MSM will quote him on this. He has the credentials to speak on this topic. Big headlines. These words will have a real impact on pushing us past the tipping point, where public outcry demands no nukes. Where nations demand that Tep.gov move faster, or else step aside. Arnie knows that time is short, and so he is giving events a little shove. Many thanks, Arnie! :)


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    • VanneV anne

      I don't think the people in power know so much. Someone else (completely stupid and criminal) controls the reins. No one is reading anything. Those who are elected sold their souls long ago and just do what they are told. Radiation kills the brain cells and TV kills off the rest.


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  • jukfuku

    This is not a new comment from Gundersen. He first made it on Chris Martenson's radio show in June of last year- at that time he ironically told us to get on our Lear Jets and head to out second homes in Rio if Spent Fuel Pool 4 collapses. He has not forgotten that he has already said this, he is re-emphasing it. That should increase the level of our concern. He's not trying to create a panic, this whole disaster is a panic. You just haven't absorbed it yet. What's all this Gundersen bashing? He lives in this hemisphere too. So does Noam Chomsky. Why are you bashing him? If people had seriously considered what Noam had been saying decades ago, we might not have these corporatist fascist overlords who will surely doom us all. So panic is you want. It might get somebody's attention.


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  • Sickputer

    I do not begrudge Arnie one bit his desire or ability to flee to the safer climes. They may not be safe so long anyway. Kill off 95% of the Northern hemisphere and everywhere will be a Mad Max world with roving bands of cannibal and thugs. It will require more than just location to survive The Fallout Age.

    This topic also begs more discussion. Just who goes and who dies? Does second cousin Bertha with a bun in the oven get a ticket to Rio or Sydney? Does grandma and grandpa get left behind because they are in the nursing home? Much like the old Aleuts left granny on the ice floe for the polar bear because her teeth were all gone?

    Watch carefully how some of the mega rich behave in the next few months. Warren Buffett could take all his family and maybe everyone in his hometown of Omaha, pop. 410,000. They would probably appreciate the ride just to get away from their own Homer Simpson plant.

    How about nuclear plant nut Bill Gates? He is a two-faced person to watch how he behaves in this crisis. I have no doubt he will have his plane fueled and ready to go.

    The two Bushes and Cheney…watch them flee to the 100,000 acre spread in Paraquay bought with lecture fees and under the table gratuities.

    Movie stars? Too stupid to flee…they will probably go to Tokyo for sushi.

    The real ones to watch are the hundreds of ordinary multimillionaires who just all of a sudden decide to take an extended trip south. Bon voyage!


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  • Tumrgrwer Tumrgrwer

    Yep and when they leave they should not be allowed back in to our exclusive radiation zone. It's for the poor only, rich people go to the south…and stay.


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    • StillJill StillJill

      Tumrgrwer! Have I told you lately I love you? I do! This comment is so 180 degrees,….that it BLOODY WORKS!!!!

      Must have a long talk with my Father on this one,……..


      Report comment

      • Tumrgrwer Tumrgrwer

        Me too, love that is, everybody. Sorry it takes so long to get back, but I kinda say my piece and get back to whatever I do. Mostly smoke the heck out of…wild stuff. Trying my best to stay ahead of the tumors that might turn cancerous. I'm with everyone here, mostly…I lurk and go about reading the links and on and on, then I get mad about not being able to talk about fukushitty cause no one will listen. Then they talk about moving to South whatever. Take your money and run South, but remember, WHAT COMES AROUND, GOES AROUND. No one can run, but we can prepare! Jumping from the fire into the furnace makes no sence!


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  • teamplayer

    Great comment, Sickputer.

    Many commentors have been quick to urge the Japanese to leave their homeland, myself included, but what I think this article brings home is, when faced with the reality of that decision, just how difficult it would be. Leaving jobs, family, possibly elderly parents / grandparents, etc.; not to mention the expenses involved, is sobering. Another thing we need to keep in mind is that different countries have different policies on immigration. Having job skills that a country needs is often one of the criteria. For people of retirement age, well, you best have a substancial nestegg.


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    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

      there will be no time afforded for cherry-picking of immigrants and other such amenities. If this goes down and the public's apprised of its deadly consequences, they'll be raging world-wide panic. Once people understand that exposure to this radioactivity means they're basically walking dead, such an indiscriminate death sentence will result in a firestorm of craven violence that will sweep the entire planet; none of which was planned by or for, by the power-elite. What the world witnessed in the aftermath of Katrina and New Orleans, will seem desirable to what could happen if SFP-#4 goes. We had all better refrain from wishing such an apocalypse upon this world…


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  • glowfus

    doesn't the southern hemisphere belong to someone already? the immense arrogance of "well, we'll all just move south to someones property" stumps me. eithier 1) the southern hemisphere invites a billion people to suddenly move there, or, 2) it's an emergency and we invade them because we need to because we screwed up our own property.


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  • hbjon hbjon

    How long will it take for all the radioactive nuclides to work themselves back into the earth? 100 years? 1000 years? 10,00 years? They first need to attach themselves to heavy molecules that will chemically react in a way that causes them to lose their mobility and sink into the ground or water. Like, absorb into tissue, tissue dies, immune function washes dead tissue out of body, excrement gets buried in the ground, errosion piles sand on it like the great pyramids of Egypt. Except for the apparent fact that life (death) is seen assisting life by being food for the next generation. Ashes to ashes, dust to dust.


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    • arclight arclight

      hi hbjon

      good question..

      going by the less hit chernobyl areas i think maybe 25 years before you can eat food produced in the lesser contaminated lands.. mountain tops and all they supply would be largely off limits too humans too..

      wild forest produce would be severely effected as the cesium works its way into the soil at around 5 cm per year (approx?)

      the cancer yield will increase dramatically as the very large population of the northern hemisphere gives its SMALL percentage…

      150 years in and all the Cs 134 will have gone all the iodine/xenon and half the strontium and Cs 137 will remain

      areas with other more long lived isotopes will be abandoned forever…
      these areas will cause contamination problems for neighboring areas till the end of time!

      left with a smaller area to feed ourselves we will have to use moderatly contaminated lands, especially for the first 30 to 150 years..

      the southern hemisphere is not so safe… and should be only used for agriculture and its resident populations anyway..

      moving out of your home to a choice of hundreds of countries is NOT the same as moving hemisphere to a limited amount of countries.. it wont happen! or at least without turning the southern hemisphere into a blood bath… and the rich and famous are in for a big sociological shock if they try to move south.. and i believe a release of this size will do the rounds.. the winds will get faster like after daichi explosion..

      not likely to go up all at…


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      • RutherfordsGhost

        Thanks Arclight,
        We're not taking people, and you've got to travel a long way to get here – with very few aircraft that can make the trip in one or two hops. You're not turning my country into Easter Island.
        You should all be more concerned about cleaning up the mess which your countries have made, and protecting the long term environment in the Northern Hemisphere, than running away from a mess which you are all collectively responsible for.
        We went anti-nuclear, and paid the price. The USA killed two of our Prime Ministers, and carried out economic warfare against us for 30 years – impoverishing the country.
        If you want radiation free food and water, then you are going to have to pay for it.


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        • VanneV anne

          What country are you talking about, and who were the prime ministers?


          Report comment

          • RutherfordsGhost

            Like you really need to ask?


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            • arclight arclight

              we got a maori in the house? :)

              thats the kind of spirit we need here on enenews!!

              @ anne

              " Following consultations with Australia and after negotiations with New Zealand broke down, the United States reiterated that it was suspending its treaty obligations until United States Navy ships were re-admitted to New Zealand ports, citing that New Zealand was "a friend, but not an ally".[33] The crisis made front-page headlines for weeks in many American newspapers,[34] while many leading American senators were quoted as expressing a deep sense of betrayal.[35] However, David Lange did not withdraw New Zealand from ANZUS, although his government's policy led to the US's decision to suspend its treaty obligations to New Zealand. The legislation was a milestone in New Zealand's development as a nation and seen as an important act of sovereignty, self-determination and cultural identity…"

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand's_nuclear-free_zone


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              • arclight arclight

                :rutherfords ghost

                the lambs probaly manky and i got a higher reading on butter last summer (anchor) err just saying! :(

                and a new zealand maori girl broke my heart (still under repair :( )!!

                do you actually export anything nice!! ;)

                lol!


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  • WindorSolarPlease

    I listen when Pro Nuclear Mr. Arnie warns about Unit 4 and moving.

    I believe we have been inhaling radiation for quite some time, damage is already happening/happened.

    I do believe Mr Arnie, this could get worse, this disaster isn't good.

    Mr. Arnie says, move if things get worse. Only a few, will be able to afford to move, even though many probably already want to.

    Personally, I would have taken a long vacation from day one. I would not have waited for the count down, putting my health at risk.

    Other Countries will probably take in so many, they can't take everyone.

    Eventually this will travel all around the world. We need a miracle, even though we don't deserve it.


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    • Huh. Might make somebody start to wonder about why Bush the Junior bought all that land in Paraguay over the primary aquifer back when he was POTUS starting wars-for-oil and pushing nukes (as they all do).

      We can at least rest assured he and his lily-white .1% family will be fine. The rest of us are stuck with whatever comes, I guess.


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  • MaidenHeaven MaidenHeaven

    The main result of this warning is to allow those with the means to move immediately, which will not only limit what homes or land will be available but increase the prices to the point that the *average person will not be able to afford to live south of the equator. The elite will use the current infrastructure to access their estates. Once in place they will rape both the land & the economy while lobbying governments to reduce regulations they follow & taxes they pay. As a result like in Europe & North America, austerity measures will be put in place. Because the elite will no longer need the *old infrastructure & so they will no longer pay for the upkeep of them. They will have built their own hospitals, roads, schools ect in their gated communities.

    RE: how long it takes for radionuclide s to move through the environment..just another example. Radioactive tritium became a perfect marker for tracking ocean water §. Scientists sampling North Atlantic water found that tritium released into the atmosphere before the 1962 nuclear test ban treaty, mixed downward by 1973. By 1980, the same tritium had moved into deep areas off Florida. The water had taken about 20 years to travel 3000 miles (4800 km) through the sea at an average speed of less than half a mile a day, about half the speed of a snail.

    I think that moving will only allow a brief respite from the radiation. But with all the other poisons in the ground & air worldwide, there are no *clean environments.


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  • Cowtipper

    Idiot's are the real reason the nuke industry have had the chance to take things this far. And do you know who the idiot's are? It's them all around you. All those who don't know anything, who doesn't want to know, and those who think they can't do anything about. And especially those who get's pissed and calling you stuff when you try to tell them. They are the ones responsible for all this shit. THEM AD THEIR STUPIDITY FOR DECADES!!!!
    Us who have taken the time to really understand this, us who try to do something about it, we know where to go if it happens. But do we want to share the limited space down there with the idiot's? Don't think so.
    So to put it short and precise: SHUT UP ABOUT WHERE TO GO!!!!


    Report comment

  • entropy

    Thanks arnie, you answered a question I posted earlier. Thanks all enenews people, a great example how people should react in a crisis.


    Report comment

  • jbvtme

    face. we humans don't deserve this planet.


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  • aspendougy

    Within five years of startup of the Hanford Nuclear Site in the Eastern U.S. the cancer death rate went up by 58%. That was a plant working on normal, "SAFE" operation.

    Even prior to all these nuclear accidents, those who do autopsies say that two out of three people have some cancer. What we will see is lots more cancer, especially the young people in Japan. In one area relatively far away from the reactors, around 20% of the kids already have nodules.

    For the rest of us it's Russian roulette, if you don't happen to ingest you are fine, if you do, forget it.


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    • What-About-The-Kids

      Aspendougy, I agree, it is like Russian Roulette in that you just don't know if and when any ingested hot particle or external exposure could be the one to trigger a cancer or heart problems or other health problems. The good news is that medical science is only now just finding ways to track such exposure back to its original radiation source.

      See the study by German scientists that was published last May which discovered a genetic marker or "radiation fingerprint" for radiation exposure in children's thyroids who contracted thyroid cancer from exposure to Chernobyl:

      http://insciences.org/article.php?article_id=10136

      The scientists could definitively trace it to Chernobyl. This of course has HUGE implications, as the better scientists get at identifying the source of radiation which contributed to cancers in people, the more perpetrators who released the radiation into the environment will be called out on the carpet and brought to justice. It is just a matter of time…

      BTW: I think you meant to say that Hanford is in Eastern Washington, which is in Western U.S.


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  • RutherfordsGhost

    Not going to happen.
    We've had people try it already – and sent them back to Japan.
    NZ went anti-nuclear for our own reasons, were scorned, and paid a heavy price from the USA carrying out political and economic warfare upon us.
    You've made your mess, and now you can lay down to sleep in it. There isn't enough land, water nor resources – and unless you can swim, you're not getting in.
    Although the UK might want to hold onto the Falklands after all …


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    • NoNukes NoNukes

      Wow.

      Yes, honey, go straight into that gas chamber. Don't even try to get away.

      Lap up that plutonium. Or little baby, people will send you back to lap up the plutonium, anyway, and they will feel good.


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  • Nigwil

    Minor problem with moving south, of course, is that there's nowhere to go.

    Australia is a desert, and getting worse. Sydney will be so hot by 2070 that it will not have enough water to sustain itself, while the interior fluctuates between drought and flood.

    New Zealand will also be in the thrall of drought by then too, and unable to provide enough food for its 4 million, let along for 4 billion more!

    South America is South America, with its population already hitting the limits, and South Africa is not renowned for its carrying capacity either.

    That just leaves the Antarctic, which is busy melting away.

    There ain't no place left to run folks – better prepare to fight the good fight where you stand.


    Report comment

    • I'll fight where I stand, thanks. It's ours, all we have. Came here on purpose 20 years ago because it was time to 'survive'. Lovely 26 acres (more or less) surrounded by national forest and state game lands, two creeks, an acre of garden, more in orchard, vineyard and medicinal wildings. Best spring water anywhere, nothing upstream but the continental divide. Have Geiger-Muller, know how to use it. Know how to survive the worst, remediate, and even decontaminate when the time comes.

      I won't live long enough to develop cancer from this. Hell, once upon a time I never figured I'd see 30. The place goes to the grandchildren when we're gone. Specifically as T-H-E place where they and their families on down the line can survive, if need be. Plan to leave full instructions…

      The best I can do. Not the most I can do, so that's why I'm speaking out.


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      • JoyB,
        You did good ! Pat yourself on the back and enjoy your fruit !


        Report comment

        • Heh. Thanks Doc. One grandson (who we raised) turned 22 yesterday, younger turns 22 in two months, just had to take another loan out to finish school. Prob'ly never be able to pay it back. 6 more grands upcoming, youngest just a toddler. From our own, and three adopteds. They all love it here, almost as much as we do. The ducks granddaughter chose for Easter are teenagers now (talk about awkward!), will soon be able to handle the dogs. Then it's chickens, the kind that lay colored eggs…

          Got my spot in the Pet Cemetery all picked out for when the time comes, just a stone. My ashes go into the rose garden below the grapes, just as have my parents, my sister and brother, and our son. Acidic red clay, it needs ashes to aerate and enrich. I always plant their favorite roses, or in bro's case, columbines and a mountain laurel. Someday I'll get some plaques with the names and dates. Then the kids can do that for us. Just the way it should be, I guess.

          Eventually we'll go extinct, maybe sooner rather than later. No biggie. It's what you do with that time in between birth and death that counts. To my mind, anyway.


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          • What-About-The-Kids

            JoyB, I appreciate so much your calm, centered voice here. You are one wise woman, and your description of the beautiful, rich life you and your husband and family have created in that incredible homestead of yours (sounds so wonderful!) brought tears to my eyes.

            That you have been able to create such a profoundly loving environment and close, loving relationships which you all share in your family is obvious, and is so beautiful and truly what really matters in this world. Thank you for sharing your wisdom and experience with us.

            May your calm, centeredness and inner peace spread among us all here, Joy. (In my book, it's a much easier way to live one's life than getting sucked up into a doom and gloom, panicky-type energy, yes?) ;-)

            Taking some slow, calm, deep breaths now. Time to relax and spend time and share love with family. :-) Have a good restful sleep. G'nite.


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      • Tumrgrwer Tumrgrwer

        Yes Joyb pat yourself on the back. We lived up here on 10 acres when the kids were yound and I gotta tell ya, I miss it so. Miss those organic pears that were nearly 100 years old and the trees full of lady bugs, as if the entire tree was in motion. I wonder now how the shallow well might be effected by radiation or my friends spring down the hill thats been there…forever. Found many indian arrowheads and one 7 inch spear head while sitting at the spring moving rocks around. Yes I do miss it.


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    • apostrophes

      Quite so. I'm all for shelter-in-place, die-in-place. But folk must do it quietly so as not to disturb the neighbours. And must bury the bodies, not burn. Don't want those plutonium particles going round again.


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      • VanneV anne

        Stock up on lead coffins before the price sky rockets as if it will actually matter.


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      • Meh. I don't plan to die of gross radio-contamination. Don't expect to either. We didn't find this place until the 1990s, by then had quite the checklist of specifications. And having earned our meltdown creds way back in the 1970s as well as having been born in the '50s, we have always been well equipped to survive this sort of threat. If there can be survival, which is the only reason such a thing would count, n'est ce pas?

        As I said, we have location (chosen on purpose), tools, and knowledge. Not everybody's got that, and judging by history's timeline so far, not everybody's going to need it. Civilization (for what it's worth) can keep on going indefinitely with enough surrender-supports. Unless it poisons itself in a less than metaphoric way.

        We already live this way, have for the past 20 years. Enjoy it very much, thanks. Plan on enjoying it until the day we die. Of whatever. So while it won't change a thing about my life for the worst to happen at Fukushima, that gives me quite a lot of 'extra' freedom to confront it head-on. And call its bluff hard as I can. Something will either get done about it or not, not my call ultimately. If there's any sort of consciousness beyond death, I don't have to apologize for not doing all I could. Meanwhile, I'm living just how I want to live.


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        • I envy you Joy

          That is how I want to live. I love being outdoors and was raised around lots of animals.

          I currently live in a gigantic city but on the outskirts so I can go hiking in the beautiful desert mountains.

          There will be no surviving here though…

          Located 5 hours (drive) from the pacific coast with mountains to the east of us, we've been pummeled.

          Lost hair and nails in December. So did others (young females mostly) I know.

          Rampant stomach problems here now with no diagnoses of viral or bacterial infections.

          I think it must be contaminated food.

          No surviving in the desert near the west coast in a city of over a million…


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          • Have any western 'walls' you can hover to, or is it straight downhill to the sea? I know desert, have a particular fondness for high mesa… I've got a well-watered environment. That's useful if there's fallout.

            I've been installing over the years – plan in mind, but it's always "a work in progress" – PVC in concrete along my perennial and first annual terrace in the garden. To receive thinner PVC arches, to hold plastic and screen, a greenhouse setup. I have an acre, but it's mostly the space between 6 terraces down the mountain. I grow a lot of food in there, and could grow three times as much with the greenhouse setup.

            If the soil were contaminated I could raise some beds. Luckily, my soil has been 'normal' since last mid-summer (great drainage). If I were to garden intensively instead of corn here and pumpkins there and tomatoes over there and beans up by the strawberries… I could grow even more. The solar dryer I made a couple of years ago from salvage works great. Dried food lasts almost forever, but I use it all.

            That's just more fun to me than waiting for death. Which I've been READY to meet for decades. Time is so precious. Enjoy it.


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  • RutherfordsGhost

    Get 100,000 people into Fukushima as Liquidators and clean the mess up. Japan has done everything to promote this disaster – not mitigate it. Time to wake up people, you're all being lined up on purpose.


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  • Sharp2197 Sharp2197

    There is probably 6 Billion people in the northern hemisphere and 1 Billion people in the southern hemisphere. The reason is there is more land in the north.
    Where would everybody go??? That is of course assuming they can afford to move. Great advice Arnie, but 95% of the people could not make the move. There is not enough land in the southern hemisphere to grow crops for 7 Billion people.
    World population has grown at fantastic rates for the last 150 years. Soon we will see that trend reverse. World population will drop by half in the next 50 years. 3.5 billion down.

    On a side note, I love that commercial where the kid starts the Ozzy song, ba bah ba bah ai ai ai riding on the rail crazy train.


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