“Hemisphere facing generations of radiologic contamination” from Fukushima — TV: It’s a major humanitarian crisis — NYT: “Nobody really knows” if 100s of tons of plutonium & uranium fuel resolidified — Experts: It’s certain reactor cores ‘moved around’; “Flowed to different part of buildings”? (VIDEO)

Published: June 19th, 2014 at 1:25 am ET


Al Jazeera, June 17, 2014: Fukushima ‘ice wall’ looking more like a dirt Slurpee […] Skeptics of the plan to build a massive ice wall […] didn’t have to wait particularly long for their first “I told you so.” […] “We have yet to form the ice stopper because we can’t make the temperature low enough to freeze water,” a TEPCO spokesman said. […] What if freezing causes the ground to sink? What if the ice and the ensuing expansion and contraction interrupts or further damages drainage in the reactor buildings? […] TEPCO’s experiment around the margins does nothing to address the hot mess at the core (as it were) of the crisis, and is cold comfort to those people still displaced or a country and hemisphere facing generations of radiologic contamination.

Christopher Morris, Muon Radiography Program Leader, June 16, 2014: “It’s certain that the reactor cores melted and the material moved around. By using muons going through the cores, we can make a radiograph of the uranium material and find out how much is left inside the pressure vessel, how much has leaked out of the pressure vessel.”

Duncan McBranch, Los Alamos Lab’s Chief Technology Officer, June 18, 2014: “The material itself may have melted and flowed to a different part of the building. Invasive techniques such as video endoscopy or introduction of robots run the risk of releasing radiation.”

New York Times, June 17, 2014: […] there are three wrecked reactor cores, twisted masses of hundreds of tons of highly radioactive uranium, plutonium, cesium and strontium. […] most of the material in the plant’s reactors resolidified, in difficult shapes and in confined spaces, wrapped around and through the structural parts of the reactors and the buildings. […] that is what the engineers think. Nobody really knows, because nobody has yet examined […] “nobody knows what happened inside,” [McBranch] said. “Nobody wants to go in to find out.” […] concrete, steel and water will all be distinguishable from uranium, plutonium and other very heavy materials. […] Testing will begin later this year, officials say, and final images will be produced next year.

KRQE, June 18, 2014: LANL technology to examine Fukushima damage […] “This is a major humanitarian crisis,” said Matt Durham, a post-doctoral researcher at Los Alamos […] “They are much too radioactive to go in and look at things,” said Christopher Morris, the lead researcher on the project. […] LANL hopes the detectors will be used in about a year. >> Full broadcast here

Watch LANL’s new video here

Published: June 19th, 2014 at 1:25 am ET


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  2. Nuclear Engineer: Studies show multiple fuel cores ejected from Fukushima reactors… I thought so too, it was one of my big concerns — Radiation Expert: Hot particles of uranium and plutonium fuels detected nearly 300 miles away (VIDEO) August 25, 2014
  3. Nuclear Experts: Portion of Fukushima’s molten fuel believed to have “moved into earth” — Melted cores contacting groundwater may be cause of recent spike in radiation levels -CTV August 24, 2013
  4. Expert: Billions of pieces Fukushima nuclear fuel have spread pretty much everywhere — “It’s truly frightening… wherever there’s cesium, there’s plutonium” — Atomic bomb had one pound of uranium… Fukushima had hundreds of tons — TV: “Abundant quantities” of plutonium are being found (VIDEO) May 19, 2016
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325 comments to “Hemisphere facing generations of radiologic contamination” from Fukushima — TV: It’s a major humanitarian crisis — NYT: “Nobody really knows” if 100s of tons of plutonium & uranium fuel resolidified — Experts: It’s certain reactor cores ‘moved around’; “Flowed to different part of buildings”? (VIDEO)

  • JimLynch JimLynch

    "LANL technology to examine Fukushima damage […] “This is a major humanitarian crisis,” said Matt Durham, a post-doctoral researcher at Los Alamos National Lab. […] “They are much too radioactive to go in and look at things,” said Christopher Morris, the lead researcher on the project."

    I thought they had already been in to remove fuel rods(sarcasm).

    Obviously, the situation is almost ready to erupt again, since they are FINALLY beginning to state what everone here already has known for quite some time.

    I wonder sometimes when these people look at their children, and their paychecks what they value the most, and what heartless monsters they are for continuing to lie, lie, lie.

    It occurs to me that at some point there MUST be a tipping point for humanity as whether these apologists are outed as frauds and dealt with. I wonder if the seaside containment zone would hold them all…..would love to see them bobbing up and down in the zone swimming, bathing, mutating….would like to leave them there or cobbled up underground at WITT eating bananas and potatoe chips, licking their iphone chargers and reveling in the "harmless" radiation.

    It all makes me so durn sick at my stomach for what is coming not for our generation, but those that follow………..those that are not already extinct or nearly so that is

  • Ontological Ontological

    “Nobody really knows” if 100s of tons of plutonium & uranium fuel resolidified", is this 100s of tons the "possible small release" we were told was added to the bio system by another supposed "expert" last week??


      was thinking that to, Ontological. It's as though their choreographers have written-in only two steps to their dance: no discernible danger or we're looking into it. Why limit yourself (editorial writer) to speculating that the cores have escaped containment and are now enjoying an orgy down below?! If you're gonna undertake doomsday scenarios, then spice-up things with questions to air-borne plumes (aerosolized fuel rods)! Or, are we to wait until everyone's got a temporary visitor-pass to the children's oncology ward, before these guy's get the courage to breakout of their two-stepping routine…

  • skizexq skizexq

    "Dirt Slurpee"
    I love it!
    best descriptive phrase I heard today.

  • SadieDog

    June 17, 2014 at 2:29 pm · Reply
    The "ice wall" being discussed in this thread, and the underground "Frozen Wall" to surround Units 1-4, are two different things.

    As used in this thread, TEPCO has attempted to freeze highly contaminated water in underground tunnels beneath the buildings. The purpose for doing this is to keep the water stable and in place, so that it can be eventually removed for decon and disposal.

    The "Frozen Wall" is designed to form an underground barrier to stop groundwater from flowing through corium debris in the ground underneath reactor ruins 1-4. This underground Frozen Wall was to be built surrounding Units1-4.

    So, don't be confused by this thread.
    The effort to freeze water in the tunnels has failed.
    Don't get me wrong: The effort to build an underground Frozen Wall around Units 1-4 will also fail. And for many of the same reasons.

    But the TEPCO announcement of the failure of the underground Frozen Wall will have to be admitted by TEPCO at a later date.

    • SadieDog

      "Fukushima – June 18, 2014, TEPCO has started freezing the water at intersections of turbine buildings inside the trenches (tunnel) from April 28, 2014, which contain contaminated water at Fukushima Daiichi NPS. This operation is one of the first steps to remove contaminated water from the trenches which is a major mile stone for TEPCO's decommissioning at Fukushima Daiichi NPS.
      On June 16, TEPCO has announced some difficulties that were encountered with an effort to freeze standing water inside the tunnel which TEPCO has been implemented countermeasures since early June. However, this has nothing to do with the "ice wall (Land-side impermeable wall with frozen soil)" which is constructed by freezing the soil surrounding pipes that carry circulating refrigerant. Unfortunately, there are some miss understandings as relating to the ice wall that is being built around the perimeter of the four reactor units for the purpose of blocking groundwater."

  • skizexq skizexq

    most bizarre (related):

    some of the drivers lately here in Bellingham seem to be like the character transporting the nuke mtl in Repo Man (a great movie BTW) their
    brains reduced by radiation? They are SLOW!:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qljXevEW2W0'

    • earthsmith earthsmith

      Hi, skizexq…Repo man is an all time classic, thanks will be watching that one again.
      I have also noticed those swerving,darting drivers as well and they are staring dead ahead. Tough cycling these days!
      Remember Trauma Film Studios….they did Toxic Avenger. He was ahead of the curve. I met him once, he wanted to film in my buddies store Axis Piercing and tatoos in N.Y. In the early 90s. A true tinfoiler!
      Basket Case is another that comes to mind.

  • fireguyjeff fireguyjeff

    "…most of the material in the plant’s reactors resolidified,…"

    And ketchup is a vegetable.
    Fast food is a manufacturing job.
    A war zone is a theater.

    So all of the fuel that was supposed to not get too dense via control rods is now resolidified and not melting?

    I think the nuclear Rubicon has been crossed if Mr. LANL Post Doc sees Fuku as "a major humanitarian crisis".

    I realize now that I have had a latent yet not at all obvious assumption that the surrealness of the comments from the nuclear apologists had some inherent limit.

    It clearly does not.


      spot-on, fireguyjeff.

    • papacares papacares

      everyone needs to learn "newspeak"
      there are no nuclear catastrophicies merely a
      "Nuclear Release" rather than a nuclear meltdown it is now
      "an insignificant release of unknown harmless material" an explosion is merely a "small bang that was barely discernable" a highly radioactive cloud is "a harmless fog" a nuclear fire is a "dissipation of containment fuel" and on and on and on

  • Sol Man

    One of the researchers reported early after the beginning of this catastrophe, that the fuel (he specifically used the term "plutonium") had been turned into a gaseous state. That is one which it had never existed in previously. If this is so, then no one can say what amount may be left to turn back into a solid state.
    He had reported that this was the result of the 9,000 degree temperature that had been reached during the explosion. I will add the link after I locate it.

      • Sickputer

        Great old Enenews link SM…

        Key words: "criminal nation" +311

        "For children living near contaminated areas like Fukushima, we have to immediately set up a plan for their evacuation. […]

        Before Japan lost the war, we organized group evacuations. We managed the escape of children from dangerous areas […]

        This is something that must be done now. But the country does not do anything about it. For that I am calling this country a criminal nation. If we do not act, terrible things are looming for those children. I am worried."

        • We Not They Finally

          There was apparently a big lawsuit filed in Japan to TRY to evacuate the children, but it was literally thrown out of court — not even tried.

          This is "beyond criminal." It's deliberate murder of one's own genome, from the youngest on up. And all the international bodies just standing by are complicit too. As is the U.S. by saying/doing nothing and even pushing further nuclear energy.

          We live in the company of monsters. They just act like they are civilized. It's monstrous. I have nothing kind or exculpatory to say for any of them.

    • We Not They Finally

      I keep thinking back to Chris Busby, the great anti-nuke activist, and how he was entertaining if the "dilution" theory might have some merit. What turned him around into assessing the scenario as "truly terrifying" instead, was seeing photos of the dead marine life on the bed of the ocean AND realizing that aerosolized plutonium and uranium had filtered down into the sea and poisoned the plankton on up.

      So whatever Sol Man referred to as being in a "gaseous" state might include that. But hardly just covering Japan — blowing far and wide. As tragic as the inevitable loss of Japan is, there is no "Japan only" here.

  • Fuk Nuclear

    People won't believe anything until someone they love dies all of sudden, or fall ill. I worry for all life in our once beautiful ocean…. Makes me sick just thinking about how the Eco system will collapse, and people will still think its global warming. Well it's warming alright, or is it warning? I get confused sometimes, I need Tepco to tell me whats happening. /sarcasm

    • We Not They Finally

      Yes, there will be millions of personal tragedies, but we'll still be left with getting past me-me-me, however horrible the personal tragedies. People need to get WAY past I-die-and-it's-bad, you-die-and-it's-o.k.

      And the way global warming is being pushed, but nuclear news blocked, is just criminal. Finally it will come down to deformed babies. Global warning causes that too? Really?

      And just think how it started, with Al Gore's "An Inconvenient Truth." With its phony graph showing that every time the climate's temperature went up, there was most carbon dioxide in the air. Looked that one up and it's actually a big "duh." Warm air just contains more carbon dioxide. Meanwhile, there are thousands of dangerous unregulated chemicals that no one even touches. WAY more deadly than plant-growing carbon dioxide. Like all the unregulated dangerous chemicals used in fracking.

      And Gore himself turned out to be malignant. He's even made profoundly idiotic statements post-Fukushima like, "I assume that they will solve the problem of nuclear waste."

      Really, you over-rated jerk? Really?

      When does the lying end? Never? People really will not face a thing until "someone they love dies all of a sudden"? Though that may well be true. Tragically so.

  • Kia Kia

    Muons to the rescue!

    "IF this technology can help IN PART to solve these problems and PERHAPS help get the nuclear industry started back up in Japan, that's really gratifying." Christopher Morris, Subatomic Physics LANL video.

    Yes and if, maybe, in part, perhaps the Ents and My Little Ponies can come to the rescue too. That would really be gratifying.

    • Max1 Max1

      Didn't read your post till I had to shout off the same sentiment…
      … I wonder if he's sending his kids to clean this mess up, too?

      Prolly not… that sh!teatin' grin of his said as much… Don'tcha think?

    • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose


      It never fails to amaze me ..how science cons the people ..with news of startling breakthroughs ..with little or falsified results.
      Does anyone on the planet think they are going to release the real data?

      • GQR2

        Does anybody think the insides of the Reactors the escaped corium is in good enough solid condition to find and measure the muons ?

        I can't imagine how it would work in jumbled up wreckage with the sea and the groundwater sloshing through. Whatever results they get would be questionable at best.

        • earthsmith earthsmith

          I want Christopher Robin to kick Christopher Morris' BUTT! Then all the animal friends can show him just how safe rads are(not).

          The universe is in no hurry

          • wildandfree wildandfree

            Earthsmith, "the universe is in no hurry" great comment, what we really fail to grasp is that TEPCO and .gov are making great progress. The issue is that they measure their progress in "Geologic Time" and they regret (sarc) that the rest of us do not have such luxury.

            Significant earth cycles that build upon and exceed previous highs simply signify an excellerated end. ELE is no joke now, we are deep into a cycle for this planet and have crossed the many tipping points to life eradication IMHO. The terminal state of base line life forms in the Pacific specifically and the other larger bodies of water (lower food chain)* and Artic and Sub-Artic Methane release (greatly accelerating) it seems will form the basis for a highly excellerated Near Term Extinction Level Event. I wish that the others outside of the ENE "family" could/would see what we see. Much too busy to be bothered however. Is it much too late to matter now?
            * Due largely of course to Fuku, Industrial Polution, Nuke Waste, and other human activities.

      • MoonlightEmpire MoonlightEmpire

        Heart of the Rose (and everyone else):

        They already used the Muon detectors way back in the first year, I believe. There was an article here on ENE about it if anyone wants to look it up.

        The data was never released….

        haha, and instead, they just decided to wait a few years and mention Muon detection for the cores like it's something new.

        Around and around it goes…

        Don't be fooled: Nuclear destroys everything you love. Ask the ever-rising number of people who have come to learn the truth about our manmade, nuclear predicament…and committed suicide.

        A loud and clear note to ANY of you who have considered suicide due to nuclear or any other manmade contaminations: If this is true, then don't do it! If you hurt so deeply from the destruction wrought by those around you…then you are exactly the person who is most needed on this planet to help us all. Please stay strong…and with us.

        Boycott everything you can until nuclear is abolished.

  • Max1 Max1

    LANL spokesperson's parting statement in video 1:29 :

    "… and perhaps help get the nuclear energy industry started back up in Japan, that's really gratifying."

    I smell AGENDA from LANL… duh!

  • mt1000

    NY Times has turned 'off' their (limited) comment feature to this article. Good thing since they might get a load of 'feedback' about their coverage so far.


      good observation, mt1000. I've noticed the same strategy elsewhere; when they don't want the public arriving at consensus. They must still think they're live'n in the good old days, when they had complete control over the dialog. Look where that got us…

  • w

    How can we even believe the 'building of the ice wall' have began 'CONSTRUCTION'! From the time of the initial discussion of the idea by TEPCo to present day, which is less than a year, where will TEPCo n the Japanese Government secure the 'expertise, technology, labor force, n construction heavy equipment to have made a noticeable, concrete effort!

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    "Fukushima ‘ice wall’ looking more like a dirt Slurpee"

    Well said.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Drill more holes ..perforate on the dotted line…
    See what happens.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Dirt Slurpee.. the best non-scientific term ..so far.

  • nedlifromvermont

    Hey w! Good point: the illusionists are still running a Kabuki theater; very Japanese; very obfuscatory; smelly like Dick Cheney's lies.

    My question remains focused on GE. They (under-)designed the vessels and the containments; they insisted on putting this nuclear crap on every fault zone, on every vulnerable coastal bluff (lowered in elevation to reduce the pumping costs;) they built the culture to not argue with GE (we are the experts) and they overruled wise criticism from within (Dale Bridenbaugh) and without (NRC regulators who understood the weakness of GE's approach to design and marketing this permanently lethal crap …)

    Now they are blackmailing the Japanese into signing away even more of their rights to sue and be compensated for this corporate malfeasance before they will "go in and help clean up their Fukudoodoo.

    GE is broadcasting the little dark haired girl who touts her mommy's employer (GE) efforts at green technology (underwater fans that are powered by the moon) ad nauseum,

    It's pretty much non-stop on MSNBC and I can only think of the brainwashing techniques employed by the "A" level humanoids in Huxley's "Brave New World."

    C.S. Lewis' Narnia creation myth, as told in "The Magician's Nephew." has the world of Charn, crumbling, because the White
    Witch insisted in uttering "the deplorable word …"

    It's a perfect description of our current downfall: the white witch is GE and the deplorable word is "progress…

    • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

      Why are Humans choosing ..ignorance?
      Is 'normalcy bias ' so great they are spellbound?
      Is the fear TPTB has so great they would rather kill themselves and take others with them ..before allowing a change in their fragile world?

      Yes..it is.

      (Look at the WH ..look at Japan ..RUNNING ..doing the only thing they know.
      Scurrying like rats.)

      • davidh7426 davidh7426

        Because they're afraid Rose, they're afraid of change, of losing what they have and not knowing whether what comes next will be better.

        Every disaster movie that I've ever seen has the disaster, the destruction, the death and the loss of 'normal'.

        But not once have I ever seen a disaster movie that deals with the follow-up, the recovery, the hope that things can be better than before. They ALWAYS stop at the question, either vocalized, or implied "But what are we going to do now ??"


        Sorry, bad habit of mine. I really must stop whittering on 🙁


      a brilliant rant, nedli…thanks!

    • Cisco Cisco

      Dead on NFV…SSDD. The stories never change, just the names, the dates, and the excuses. It's the same playbook the oil and gas companies use. Think of BP…massive advertising campaign spent $93,000,000.00 between April 2010 and July 2010, and another $329,000,000 on tourism ads up until April of this year. That's what they admitted to the Congress. What's the real number?

      Ask you neighbor, they'll tell you the Gulf's fine. It works, that's what elects politicians…most times the candidate with the biggest ad budget wins. It's propaganda and it works. It's how you buy a good appearance even when you're a monster.

  • SadieDog

    NHK – Tepco alters plans for unused fuel from rector #4…

    • SadieDog

      "In the run-up to the transfer, TEPCO planned to make space in the common pool by removing fuel rods which had already been stored there. It decided to place them in casks.

      But the utility says delayed confirmation of the casks' safety has prevented it from preparing the rods in time for the planned transfer."

      • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

        Yes ..the rods are to be cooled to a certain temperature before casking…generally after being cooled 3-5 years..

        Sorry no link.

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        So, TEPCO is transferring fuel assemblies from SFP4 to SFP6 now.
        Should have removed fuel from SFP5&6 and CSFP for transport off site long ago.
        If something happens again to drive workers away from FDNPP, at least there would be less fuel in Unit5&6 and the CSFP to worry about.
        But they haven't even started decommissioning 5&6.
        And now they will be moving unused fuel from SFP4 to SFP6?
        TEPCO knew in the summer of 2011 as they developed their Decommissioning Plan that either the CSFP had to be emptied into dry cask storage, or else a new CSFP had to be built.
        Failed at both alternatives.
        So let's stick all of it in SFP6, eh, TEPCO? 😉

  • jackassrig

    Ice wall article at zerohedge.com. I'm completely disillusioned about the technical world. Can anyone design anything anymore or are we technically bankrupt. Imcompetence Ugh. I know I haven't taken my meds. I wish I had never heard of Fukushima.

  • hbjon hbjon

    Only small areas of fuel splatter with salty crusts can exist within the wreckage, because there needs to be a strong force pushing it together. When a blob forms, a crust of air cooled material forms on the outside.
    Melting fuel will take the path of least resistance, displacing all other materials and liquefying them. Even when a normal reactor is shut down, the residual heat will continue for years because of something called "SPONTANEOUS FISSION". Those atoms of fuel are so excited that they want to split even though someone pushed the reactors off button. When there is more of it together, there's more heat produced. (Brand new thought) It may have blown up so completely that there just wasn't a lot of it to melt down.(Active cores only of course)
    My daughter thinks the cores shot out of the reactors like bullets and landed in the ocean, where the IAEA put lead blankets on them and they're chilling comfortably on the bottom of the ocean.


      if the core, hbjon, were in a superheated condition, would it not have easily vaporized when containment finally failed? Just a thought…

      • hbjon hbjon

        In a superheated condition the coolant becomes the fuel. Something known as fusion. First deuterium, then tritium are produced within the confines of increasing pressure that ultimately causes the two atoms to combine into one nucleus. Perhaps it didn't vaporize because if the coolant prevents vaporization than a fusion reaction would happen before a fission criticality. It takes energy to do certain things here. First, energy breaks the hydrogen/oxygen bond. Second, energy frees the diatomic hydrogen molecule. Third, heat is transferred to the containment. Finally, heat is transferred to the outside air. Would be beneficial to know the results of that experiment. We're talking about the active fuel cores here, not the SFP's.

  • GQR2

    Its hard to believe in any serious inventory of these fuel rods and its sounding so sketchy one has to wonder if these rods are being resold on the black market or buried in a playground somewhere. Nobody really knows for sure. Kind of like the chemical weapons in Syria that have been being disposed of for over a yr and just keep popping up as almost done, almost done. There is no serious inventory no trustworthy parties anywhere. What is written in the papers,what comes out of Tepco and misinformed engineers cannot be trusted. Where are the fuel rods TepCo ?

  • Summary:

    We go the way of the carrier pigeon. The same mentality that caused their extinction will produce ours as well. Some may well argue that this is a good thing, given our cold-hearted and destructive ways:

    All gone: How erasing billions of birds shocked us
    Associated Press By SETH BORENSTEIN


    "WASHINGTON (AP) — It was the moment that humanity learned we had the awesome power to erase an entire species off the face of the Earth in the scientific equivalent of a blink of an eye: The passenger pigeon went from billions of birds to extinct before our very eyes.

    It was one bird's death after many. But a century ago, Martha, a red-eyed, grey and brown bird famous as the last surviving passenger pigeon, keeled over, marking an extinction that shook science and the public."

  • Nick

    Unit #1 went kapow….mostly sideways.

    Unit #2 went whooomopf…mostly downwards and is possibly the most "intact" of the awol cores, deep beneath the plant.

    Unit #3 went KaBOOM! skyward, it's innards are absolutely dispersed and some fell into the inner harbor and got a blanket of concrete (yet the stuff still fizzes).

    Unit #4 (which was stored in the fuel pool for reloading) went snap crackle and pop with a bit of oozing to boot.

    In a sense, it is a moot point to locate the awol cores since SO MUCH of them are dispersed throughout the biosphere.

    The focus on "fixing" does NOTHING to slow the slow death that permeates the Northern Hemisphere.

  • jackassrig

    Those idiots in the board room of GE must be laughing their asses off at the cow pat they are trying to peddle.

  • West Aussie West Aussie

    A business associate has just revealed to me that he is battling peritoneal cancer that has spread to the bowel. I cannot say for sure that this is a result of our catastrophe-prone nuclear weapons/power industry. But I make the case anyway because I do not like to see the look of self-reproach that seems to say without words, 'It's all my fault! I must have done something to cause this or be defective somehow!'
    I don't like that attitude. My attitude to almost everything is 'society is to blame'. That's right. Personal responsibility is pure BS when you're the last person to know what those responsibilities are. Especially when TPTB hold no reciprocal responsibilities to us.
    Sure there is a hard core of untreatable psychopaths out there but you'll find most of them never get to go to prison. They run them. Like they get to run the important government departments.
    The MSM must be world-record holders for being a late echo of the reality supplied by enenews.
    I piped up about imaging the cores using techniques using exotic forms of radiation and, lo and behold, there is the MSM talking about it.
    Could they be reading enenews with special attention to the comments?
    I hope they are.
    There are two types of power technologies/physics. One is nuclear. The other is electromagnetic. Both are capable of doing roughly similar things. One can split an atom the other can crack open the subatomic structure of space. One technology is dirty, filthy, toxic for millions of…

    • bo bo

      west aussie, do you have link to the story of imaging the core with exotic forms of radiation? I missed your post on that, how does it work ?

      Personal responsibility is pure BS ! – and I'm not being tongue in cheek humorous either. I seriously agree with you. The self-help books section is too big at bookstores ( if there are any bookstores left, that is 🙁 )

      • earthsmith earthsmith

        There is also space/time
        Can we somehow compress space to slow time?
        My brain is transmutating

        • davidh7426 davidh7426

          Doubtful Earthsmith…

          If you compressed space, anyone and anything within that space, would be compressed along with it, and so would experience time flowing at the same rate as the space around them.

          For your idea to work, we would have to 'step out' of space, before the compression, and so would no longer experience the same flow of time.

          As to whether the compressed space would experience a change in the 'flow' of time, and whether that 'flow' is slowed, or accelerated is unknown. I suspect that would depend upon the observers point of view.

          Bet you wished you hadn't asked now 😉

      • bo bo

        Oh sorry I realized, west aussie I had not read through the article on muons above. My bad. Trying to chew through that one now.

  • West Aussie West Aussie

    cont..years. Whereas the other is relatively safe, clean, and leaves no toxic residue. I'll leave it up to you to work out which is which and why one of them is suppressed.

    • nedlifromvermont

      @West Aussie: so sorry about your friend; probably from the weapons testing and a delayed effect.

      Check out the facts about lung cancer from smoking tobacco which has innocently bio-concentrated radioactive polonium and lead from the weapons testing.

      And then reflect on this stupidity: civilian nuclear power plants on the coast, everywhere out in the open are MILITARILY INDEFENSIBLE! full stop! Think some mildly intelligent general somewhere didn't think about this? Think again.

      GE's power and influence, as contractor to the Manhattan project etc. is too great for the Pentagon to counter; NNSA is a corporate division; It is as if Hitler's blind obsession to hold onto Stalingrad, when a break out and joining up with Mannstein's corps would still have been possible, which doomed the quarter million man Third Army, has been recreated in the GE boardroom in the decision "We must have this nuclear power business"

      such blinding ambition and obsession is almost incredible;

      until you study history history;

      JPMorgan got away with scuttling the Titanic to win an insurance claim; the electric division (GE) went, on the basis of this example of supreme power, to plan the extinction of life on our planet through the unnecessary development of the civilian nuclear reactor program;

      How much longer do we believe in the lies of this once proud company, which insists on a Hitler-like endgame of Global Kahlschlag; a scorched earth policy?

      peace all

  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    Certainly is a scorched earth policy! No question about it… 🙁

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    Reading one of the links posted above in this thread, where the scientist is talking about 5,000C corium, I began to ponder where the corium is right now. Other posts talk about the quantity of corium that has been vaporized, while still other posts discuss the fuel that was blown out of the reactors, and now lies on the land and on the ocean floor. This is an interesting thread.
    The LANL people believe the corium is still in the buildings somewhere. Their muon imaging will probably be pretty much limited to the buildings. I don't even know whether this technology can be used to image corium in the mudrock below the reactor buildings. I hope so, and that they will image underground corium. I am hoping to be able at the very least to see corium lava tubes, or at least the large holes in the bottoms of pedestals, through which molten corium melted out of containment vessels.
    So I am still pondering where the corium is right now…

  • mutante mutante

    Didn't TEPCO say that they did not know where the corium had gone.

  • 富岡_Blue_Heron 富岡_Blue_Heron

    "“We have yet to form the ice stopper because we can’t make the temperature low enough to freeze water,” a TEPCO spokesman said."

    Because we're waiting for Godot.

  • WindorSolarPlease

    I wish Nuclear Power was ever discovered, but it was, and now we have a crappy done deal for us all.

    At this point how about ending Nuclear Power. Bagging it all up and send it all in an unarmed ship far far away to another planet that no one/species could live on? I can dream can't I?
    Maybe it's time for us to find another planet?

    Quote: “Hemisphere facing generations of radiological contamination” from Fukushima
    I agree with this.

    I also agree there needs to be humanitarian help to those who need or want to get out of an area and medical help for anyone who needs it.

    Time to step up from those who made/make big bucks on Nuclear Power.
    Get a Conscience and End Nuclear Power.

    • WindorSolarPlease

      I wish Nuclear Power was "Never" discovered..I hope you knew what I meant.

      • We Not They Finally

        Nuclear power and "humanitarian" have never had a thing to do with each other. Its first use was war time (WWII,) then The Cold War, then in preparation for or fighting of all subsequent wars. Even the depleted uranium widely used in Iraq, which should have been illegal use f nuclear weapons because those people (and our own soldiers!) were "nuked," yet it skirted the law and made huge wrongful profits for the likes of Bush Sr. and the Carlyle Group.

        There never WAS any "Atoms for Peace." It was all a lie frm the start. Now it's a silent, invisible pervasive war beyond all national boundaries and across species.

        Yeah, I'm with you. I wanted nothing BUT humanitarian help going on and all the NPP's shut down. But it's always been in the hands of warmongerers.

        If ordinary people at least KNEW. But it's become a struggle just to inform small-scale. And how does one make warmongerers suddenly act humanitarian?? The lawsuit to at least evacuate Japanese children was thrown out of court.

        So discouraging.

  • West Aussie West Aussie

    Thanks nedifromvermont. He's a decent bloke and has a family as well. Makes me mad and sad at the same time.
    I have read when JP Morgan found out that Tesla was working on a power distribution technology that couldn't be effectively metered, (We have a watered-down version in WiFi technology), he set about destroying the technology and Tesla financially along with his reputation. To this day most people have no idea of who Tesla is. Any possibility that this technology will ever see the light of day is highly unlikely under the present circumstances.
    For me it makes perfect sense that these two different branches of technology were discernible when Morgan was around. So for him to instead fund the development of the thermonuclear paradigm rather than the electromagnetic one would seem an obvious way to stymie the potential of Tesla's legacy to the world.
    I also have read that Tesla had an assistant who was purported to be Prescott Bushes father…..

    • nedlifromvermont

      Hey west aussie! No, it was not JP Morgan himself who funded the nuclear program; he survived the financial turbulence following the "Titanic" sinking quite well, which happened near the end of his life. Morgan did not live a full year after "Titanic;" he died in Rome in 1913.

      He left his assets to his son. But the Morgan empire had deputies, among them C.A.Coffin at GE, who died in 1926. It is the group of men who led the Morgan banking empire in the forties and fifties who decided to go all in with the civilian reactor program, because they simply would not take a loss on uranium mines purchased in the Manhattan Project's early days … even when the dangers of radiation had become apparent.

      How simple and how much cheaper it would have been for the government to simply bond the funds to buy up these mines and limit the uranium business to medicine, space travel, military propulsion and weapons only.

      The decision to do electricity (which is largely wasted) with uranium fission is the fateful choice forced through stupid, greedy government processes which gave us the current unsolvable dilemma.

      Neither United States nor US business nor GE nor any of the elite have any credibility on anything, so long as they are wedded to the nuclear lie.

      It's not safe. It's not green. It's not necessary. It's not reliable. It is reliably dangerous. Only morons are proponents after Fukushima. The US and US businesses are run by idiots.

  • sworldpeas

    "hemisphere facing generations of radiologic contamination."


  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    So I am still pondering where the corium is right how.
    The corium was boiling at 5,000C during meltout.
    Some of it was blown out of Units1&3.
    Some of it was burned up, vaporized, and wafted away into the atmosphere.
    Some of the corium, after reaching groundwater and mudrock, burned at the crusted edges, releasing a deadly highly radioactive black soot. This has settled on the ground throughout central Japan as a "black substance".
    Some of the corium has continued to burn down and down, into the mudrock.
    That the corium is still fissioning, and very hot, we know because Tokyo sewage sludge has ongoing spikes in Iodine-131, a marker for ongoing criticalities.
    PattieB reported here that a worker at Fukushima told her the corium was 2 km down in the bedrock.
    If the corium stayed in a concentrated blob, and maintained sufficient mass to keep temperatures at 5,000C, will rock be much of a hindrance to its downward progress? No.
    If the corium spread out in the mudrock, perhaps following a less dense rock layer, then the downward motion would have ceased, and the corium would stay where it had ceased its downward flow.
    Even though ongoing criticalities kept temperatures way up, the motion of the corium through rock would have ceased.
    When I look at the Iodine-131 graph of Tokyo sludge, my feeling is that quite a lot of the corium remains near the surface, perhaps as little as 50'…

  • SadieDog

    NHK – Japan and PM Abe planning research center for Fukushima decommission …

    • SadieDog

      "Abe and science and technology minister Hakubun Shimomura on Thursday agreed to establish the international joint research center in April of next year. They agreed that the government needs to take the lead in the project."

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    To repeat: When I look at the Iodine-131 graph of Tokyo sludge, my feeling is that quite a lot of the corium remains near the surface, perhaps as little as 50' under ground level.

    If corium is in the mudrock under Reactors1-3, it must be contained!
    257 tonnes of nuclear fuel was inside Reactors1-3 on 3/11/2011.
    Corium leaches continuously into water.
    Over time, all of the corium will leach away.
    To Where?
    Into the air and water.
    Mutated plants and animals tend to be less successful then normal members of their species.
    When mutations become universal in earth's flora and fauna, life will die out.

    • We Not They Finally

      You say that because I-131 shows NEW, ONGOING fissioning?

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        JUNE 19, 2014.

        The HALF-LIFE of IODINE-131 is only 8 DAYS!
        (This is why we use the presence of significant quantities of Iodine-131 as an indicator of current fissioning.)

        The source of the Iodine is CURRENT NUCLEAR FISSION FROM FDNPP.

        The graph of TOKYO Iodine-131 in sewage sludge shows an INCREASE of fission from Fukushima in 2014.


        Hey, Admin. Why don't you publish this graph of Tokyo Iodine-131 in a thread today?

        People need to know…

        DON'T GO TO TOKYO.

        Am I being clear enough? 😉


        Look for yourself!

        Sorry for "yelling", but it is important that people understand that Fukushima is not over.
        Fukushima is getting worse and worse.
        Fukushima contamination "never" goes away. Oh, maybe in a hundred thousand or a million years, but for mere mortal human beings, this is "never".


    • Leach away? How does it leach? You mean dissolve?

      All radioactive metals dissolve in water?

      Does that mean if nothing is done, 300 plus tons of corium will dissolve into the Pacific and the atmosphere?

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        If nothing is done, 257 tonnes of molten nuclear fuel is going to end up in the environment.
        Leaching into the water, and fissioning into the atmosphere.
        "Leaching" means that atoms, and "hot particle" clumps of atoms, slough off the encrusted edges of the corium, turn into dust, and make their way THROUGHOUT THE ENVIRONMENT.
        Every bit of the fuel from Reactors1-3.
        This includes 690 PBq of cesium, just for starters.
        And enough Plutonium to kill every human being on Planet Earth.

        Dr. Goodheart:

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    How can the human race contain Fukushima nuclear corium?
    1. Locate and map the corium.
    2. Construct an underground interlocking sheet steel Impermeable Wall, to a depth of 100', surrounding Reactors1-4, diverting groundwater around the reactors, and into the ocean.
    3. Remove all fuel assemblies from Spent Fuel Pools 1-6 and Common SFP to dry cask storage.
    4. Pour a 10' thick reinforced concrete floor over the ground inside of the Impermeable Wall. Seal under a rubber roofing material.
    5. Fill corium lava tubes with concrete.
    6. Fill torus basements, torus, containment and reactor vessels with concrete.
    7. Fill SFP1-4 with concrete.
    8. Build a 100' deep reinforced concrete foundation outside of the Impermeable Wall.
    9. Build a reinforced concrete Sarcophagus over Reactors1-4. Seal under a rubber roofing material.
    10. Transfer contaminated water to tanker berges, and tow out to sea.
    11. Build an ALPS water decontamination system into a ship, and decontaminate the water in the barges.
    12. Treated water can be mixed with salt, refrigerated, and pumped down to the floor of the offshore Trench.
    13. Build a second outer harbor, sealed with locks.
    14. Cover the ocean floor within inner and outer harbor with a 10' thick reinforced concrete floor.
    If you want to do some action, send this list to your Congressman and Senators, and publish as a Letter To The Editor in your local newspaper. Circulate freely.

    • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

      Obviously, this is a planetary emergency, and will require a planetary response.
      The Fukushima Catastrophy is well beyond anything that a single corporation or nation can cope with.
      The world will simply have to step forward, and step in to undertake such an enormous project.
      Opposition and immobility within nonfunctioning governments must be swept away by public outcry for action.
      Failure is not an option.
      In four generations of continuing releases, a highly mutated and compromised human race may no longer be able to undertake a project of this scale.

      • We Not They Finally

        Tell the truth and whole economies crash. I still say YES tell the truth. But they are unlikely to do it for that reason alone.

        Of course, once enough fisheries shut down and real estate values plummet on the West Coast, it won't matter why they held back. Nor are they gaining any brownie points for morality in the interim.

        Then they'll say, look, there's no money to do this. But the truth is that there is no MENTALITY, much less MORALITY to do it. Life never came first.

      • mutante mutante

        PhillipUpNorth, great to here a methodical, rational idea to mitigate the disaster @ Fukushima Daiichi NPP!
        Maybe all hope is not lost 🙂

        • mutante mutante

          Sorry … Hear(read I guess)

          • nedlifromvermont

            @mutaante: PUN is one of our best fix-it strategists! He and 21stCentury could probably get the job done, with funding and partnering. Not sure the Yakuza would be welcoming, but it really must be done.

            It is our job to foster the spread of the knowledge of the situation, so the politics may someday soon follow.

            I weep for the innocents whose lives have been ruined.

            "……… we bring good things to life ……"

            back at you, GE.

            • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

              Easy: Defeat the Yakuza by hiring a bunch of yanks to do the job. When Red Adair was hired to put out all of the well fires started by Iraq during their pullout from Kuwait, he took over his own crews over to do the job.
              Same thing with Fukushima.
              Very few Japanese are needed to accomlish this job.
              Better to have none at all.
              Personally, I'd hire Russians and Yanks.

              • bo bo

                Red Adair sounds like a hero.
                ( thanks did not know him until now)
                But then who is the nuclear inferno equivalent to putting out Chernobyl or TMI? are they dead now?

              • 52Rockwell

                Or Boots and Coots

              • Bungalow Phil Bungalow Phil

                I examine the question of ongoing fuel fissioning and my first reaction is this is a slow motion nuclear detonation. I ponder the result of speeding up the unstoppable by adding more fuel to the fire. Bear with me now. If the chain reaction was intensified by none other than another chain reaction would the result be similar to a NV fission device? We can assume the results would the same. Question? Would it engage the super critical under ground? Question? Is there the will to examine and explore such a theory? Can the country of Japan survive without considering all options? I submit flashing the cores will be the only solution. The fallout will be tolerable and the country will have to prepare for a few weeks of fallout. Inevitably it will succumb to this crisis if no other option is viable. Time is not an ally here. Only nuclear can deal with nuclear. What am I saying? Detonate a device or devces, engage all spent fuel in chain reation and let it do what it does in nano seconds rather than millions of years. The political will must be found to solve this. It is worth consideration. Anyway I think out loud.

                • Bungalow Phil Bungalow Phil

                  Addendum: The vaporization of all nucleotides will render them inert. The million degree flash will consume all within its super critical, super heated mass. I submit that this is a radical theory but I believe it is valid.

                  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                    If you want to speed up the sinking of the Japanese Island then that is a pretty good plan..we may end up with no choice but to sink the whole thing as you say.

                    Gee, makes this who Nuclear thing line of thinking pretty stupid if this ends up being what must be done to save the/our own planet.

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      oops.. Gee, makes this "whole" Nuclear thing line of thinking pretty stupid if this ends up being what must be done to save the/our own planet.

                    • Bungalow Phil Bungalow Phil

                      Doubtful it will sink the main island. The physicist will calculate the yield necesssary to engage the corium and spent fuel. Earth movement is a gamble but what is the alternative? There is no other know device available to achieve the temperatures neccesary to vaporize the area. FDNPP and surrounding area will have to be sacrificed. They don't seem to have the capacity to succumb to the idea they are doomed if all options are not considered.

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      Well there you go and we have to depend on the morons that actually brought us on this Earth to this place in time. 🙂

                      We are all in very serious trouble.. 🙁 But the checks are huge!

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      …..obewanspeaks….there's going to be a war first, I feel, then the sinking.

                      On the sinking, I guess I go with Edgar Cayce who said Japan is going to drop into the sea. The few feet during 3/11 doesn't really count….was just a precursor movement to reveal it was possible.

                      I feel sorrow for Japan's terrible karma from horrendous past war deeds inflicted on other Asian peoples.

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      The earth's core is moving considerably more than usual, as we discussed.

                      It's all a matter of when.

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      Gee, I sure hope there is no war. I really think war should be outlawed in the year 2014. We have had enough war and with Nuclear Weapons potential there will be no winners and there really never is a winner in any war. The only winners are the ones who finance them there wars.

                      Anarchy is not desired either..

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      Obewanspeaks…it's nice to be able to hope there's no war. Myself, I don't believe in the military & war, nor in "onward Christian soldiers" (the Holy Family is an entirely different affair, of course). For 2014, tell that to ISIS, the Taliban, or the US Marines, the People'e Liberation Army, Canada's Vandoos, not to forget all those militias in Africa. Why I think there's going to be a war involving Japan, I can't tell you here, sorry! Anyways, you didn't ask why. Don't think with Japan it will be nuclear; they will be attacked, conventionally.

                      As for anarchy…systems and structures which are corrupt and needing reform are going to be upended, but likely more as a result of 'collapse,' as things really did hit gridlock a ways back. We just haven't realized that. No time or space for specifics here. America's in big trouble; dominance of the dollar going. Saudis, Iraq, Venezuela hold the fossil fuel aces. Canada tar sands are dirty. Russia and China have teamed up, and the rest of BRICs will be in there too. Etc. US might choose war as a way of getting out of its mess.

                      25,000,000 are in metro-Tokyo (almost the population of Canada). One big quake like in Kobe in 1995, and world economy will really shake. Japan could easily sink. Not all the way. 50 metres would do it.

                      None of this is to be wished for, but we are in apocalyptic times. Includes vast ice melt, accelerating like crazy due to methane release, 50X effect…

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      Lets hope the information vortex funnel speeds up so that all you mention might be somehow avoided. End times would be very bad for any of the future generations.. don't you think?

                      War with any other Nuclear Armed Nation will not be anything like we what we have seen recently in the Middle East.

                      Burn't Toast is not vey tasty is what I hear.. 🙂

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      oops..Burn't Toast is not "very" tasty is what I hear.. 🙂

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      …of CO2. With methane release from Arctic sea bed after ice & permafrost melt across Siberia & Canada north, an acceleration of this release results from vicious circle of melting glaciers & ice in Arctic, Greenland & Himalayas, & in S America + Antarctic, exposing darker water &/or ground &/or rock, absorbing more sun, while freed-up heat used in melting ice can then do its thing heating up rest of globe. That acceleration curve's getting steeper & steeper. Extreme weather & water shortages (after glacier melts) will do number on food production…a serious development we've only begun to see; & so on.

                      As I've said, near-term close-to-total extinction seems a highly plausible result of multiple problems coming to a head together…though feel there'll be numerous pockets of survivors, who of course will have to cope with these extreme conditions, incl. rising radiation levels (abandoned NPPs). In 2 generations, humans could have stronger resistance to nuclear onslaught shown by other life forms.

                      I'm old, but healthy, with a strong mind, & potential for a long life. Have talked about having found "the crack in the universe," and my having squirmed through, that which Ive found on the other side might grant me the time to complete what I'm here for. I hope you too will find in due course that hard to see chink within the proliferating miasma of current life, but don't be eating too much now or you won't be able to squeeze through.

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      And not too much butter on that tasty 'toast,' eh!

                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      We agree to disagree and I do not see things happening that way….

                      The Earth has been spinning around this Sun for a very long time and it will continue to do the same until we humans learn how to somehow move it.

                      Like our immune systems have various approaches to healing the body, the Earth has her own systems.

                      We need to change the/our direction of rampant over consumption and direct harmful pollution dumped into our ecosystem is our biggest enemy.

                      Nuclear has only been here 70 years and it should/needs to end and quickly.

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      Obewanspeaks…..it has now come time for me to say goodbye. It was interesting while it lasted, and perhaps an important experience. Thank you for your very decent appearance under my comments!

                      As regards the scenarios above, to be honest, I actually prefer yours. However, my situation is that I am a 'dreamer.' Like the Australian Aborigines and the North American indigenous peoples. Or a little like Edgar Cayce. I also have a prophetic sense of the future. Of the very 'special' dreams I've had, the point is that they have come true. There's another important one but have never fully discussed it with anyone. I don't make them up. They are presented to me, and sometimes a particular entity appears who speaks to me. The dreams appear for a reason, and I cannot ignore them. Others can go their own way. That's the quick and short of it.

                      So, goodbye, au revoir, sayonara.

                      Please take good care of yourself, and make sure to feed the cat; not sure how many lives he/she has left.

                  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                    Here you go and maybe we just need to give this 4 plate tectonic convergence region a little nudge and/or a Nuclear Bomb push as you say..then bam gone! All of it!

                    Who in their right minds would have built any Nuclear Power Plants on these Islands or in this active tectonic plate region?

                    Moronic money grubbers that's who. The entire basis of approval is that a Nuclear Power plant should never ever be built on a fault line. Nuclear Power Plant construction 101. 🙁

                    See any fault lines in the above link?

                    • Bungalow Phil Bungalow Phil

                      I agree the institution must be abolished. But let me be clear I don't advocate for the destruction of Japan, only the destruction of that infernal beast that is slowly but surely murdering all living and viable creatures. There is lot fuel there and it is going to be supercritical to calculate the vivesection of that mass(es). Would it (my idea)concievably relapse to the fact that the fuel mass is too large and it will end that island? Unsure of that but is there critical mass of MOX now? That is not supposed to be there anyway. Suppositions always seem to reveal yet another critical "missing bit of information" but provides for a turn of events unforseen.

                    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

                      Not many people would wish/advocate for the destruction of Japan. In any event, one would have reflected back to oneself all their karma for that sort of attitude.

                • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

                  "Detonate a device or devces, engage all spent fuel in chain reation and let it do what it does in nano seconds rather than millions of years. "
                  Bungalow Phil
                  If you are advocating dropping an atomic bomb on Fukushima, your premise is entirely wrong, Bungalow Phil.
                  Here's why:
                  Only a tiny portion of the uranium or plutonium in an atomic bomb is turned into energy (anhilated) in a nuclear detonation. All the rest of the uranium is ENTIRELY UNCHANGED, and will simply spread all over as fallout.

                  In the case of the Little Boy bomb that leveled Hiroshima, Japan, during WW2, only 860 milligrams of the uranium in the bomb was converted to energy.

                  The rest was released as radioactive fallout, which travelled all over the world.

                  If someone were to blow Fukushima up with hudrogen bombs, all in the world they would do is to scatter unchanged radioisotopes from the reactors far and wide throughout Planet Earth, hastening our doom.

                  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                    Hastening our doom would be bad…right? :

                    Don't want to do that then.

                    Shut all these Nuclear Reactors down world and do this now! 🙂

                    Hurry the Sun is now acting very strangely..

                  • Bungalow Phil Bungalow Phil

                    What is happening now? The Pacific ocean is dead by all accounts. Please read: MODERN thermonuclear devices http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermonuclear_weapon and then nuclear fallout http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_fallout. Then let me(us)know if your opinion is modified somewhat. I appreciate your candor and input.
                    With all of the testing done (2035) none has equaled the destruction we are witnessing now. The only solution is eradication. The spent fuel(corium)that which cannot be recovered and relocated WILL engage and IT will be dirty and yes there will be fallout and further people, plants, animals will be affected. Japan itself may even experience a large quake as a result. Do nothing and it goes on forever. Obviously, either scenario is a no-win situation that is the nature of nuclear power, nobody wins.

            • mutante mutante

              NedilifromVermont, Maybe some of the engineers @ TEPCO or elsewhere will take their lead !

    • WindorSolarPlease

      PhilipUpNorth this sounds right, but then I am not a pro in this area.
      Do you know of any reasons or dangers why they aren't doing this besides cost?
      There has to be others in the field who has suggested this.

      No matter what, damage is/has happened.
      Anything to even just slow this monster down sounds good to me.

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        WindorSolarPlease asks:
        "Do you know of any reasons or dangers why they aren't doing this besides cost?"

        The Japanese value conformity over fear of personal loss of life and property.
        The Japanese way gave us exactly what we've got.
        Leaving Fukushima in Japanese hands will NOT solve this problem.
        Culturally, the Japanese are clearly not up to the task, not now, and not over the next 40 years.
        The Japanese lack the vision to understand what must be done here, and lack the will to do it.
        Send in the yanks and the Russian Liquidators! 😉

        • PaciFistic PaciFistic

          PhilipUpNorth…..you know…bo might say you're a racist, as he did with me not so long ago!

          • bo bo

            I apologize Pacifistic for being human and biased. I am biased towards PhillipUpNorth. He is making one of the most constructive and important comments here and I am not about to slide the topic into a discussion of race politics.

            • PaciFistic PaciFistic

              ….how nicely arbitrary of you!

              Actually, you can do/think as you like; it's really a non-issue for me. As it is I have tons of admiration for the Japanese and have no reason to feel prejudice toward them. We can't make up high standards & expect an entire people to live up to them. People are what they are. Evolution is a slow process. Westerners are no better. Now, individuals, that's a different discussion. And observations are observations. We can't have one truth better than another truth.

              As for Fukushima, it does seem odd they can't get moving on it. For me it's not odd. Because I understand the operation of the force called fate, as I've been aware of it since a little kid. If I happened to know you as a flesh & blood person and not a 'cat' here, I could tell you how that force has operated in your life and how in certain instances you've been able to do little about it. We have choice; however fate dominates unless we are able accept it and cooperate with it.

              Ask a bipolar person whether he/she can really rise above his/her circumstance. Saying they have an illness counts for little here.

              Japan has heavy unredeemed karma from their (military's) extremely atrocious war acts against Asian peoples — the background of a lot of their present day difficulties, starting with Black Monday Oct 19, 1987. I know; I was there. Karma is not arbitrary; it's very exacting!

              Philip works hard on his ideas; kudos to him!

              Take care!

    • You have to dig up and contain/isolate the corium somehow first.

    • PaciFistic PaciFistic

      PhilipUpNorth….apart from the 'leaching' at least you have done some serious reflection, with possibly a number of good ideas…though can't say with any certainty how good, my not being a nuclear engineer.

      As for:

      "10. Transfer contaminated water to tanker berges, and tow out to sea,"

      I suppose that's sacrificial water?

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

      The coast under Fukushima is already slipping into the ocean. Thee is no way that area can sustain the weight. Not only was Fukushima built on the Ring of Fire and is has earthquakes and tsunamis, Fukushima cut away a protective cliff and is built over a luvial fan, i.e., an underground river. The reason they don't tell you where the corium is is because it is already many feet under the reactors and oozing out into the ocean and into the magma extending to volcanoes to the west, north and south. 100 feet simply wouldn't cut it. Also the Japanese population has been enervated by the radiation which is incinerated throughout the entire country and waste dumped into the ocean all around the country.

      Nuclear energy is bankrupting and decimating the population of every country where it exists. Stop the insanity of nuclear technology ASAP.

  • cosmic charlie cosmic charlie

    “Hemisphere facing generations of radiologic contamination”

    Why mince words? He should have said “Hemisphere facing genetic Armageddon”. Degradation of the genome of all living things. Deformed newborns and cancers everywhere. Endless suffering of living things……

  • moonshellblue moonshellblue

    I remember talking about using muons to locate the corium three years ago and they are now just reaching the realization? Gee my spouse also recalls discussing this option which is used to track magma. I think I even posted on Enenews a few months after 3/11. Talk about moving at a snail pace. Unreal

  • MoonlightEmpire MoonlightEmpire

    Don't be fooled: Muon detectors have already been used at Daiichi years ago.


    That's just one link about it. Sickputer has a comment on that thread saying that it had already been 6 months–at that time–since they placed the detectors and there was still no word on the results.

    I just want to be clear that this recent muon imaging talk is a farce. Why they are bringing it up again as though it's a new idea is something I'm not sure of…

    They probably got good images the first time and will never show them. Maybe they intend to release muon images in the future that are completely false or doctored as a means of quelling public uprising/concern.

    In the end, it doesn't really matter where Daiichi's cores are because as it stands right now, the entire inventory of the plant will escape via all imaginable vectors (like the nimble feet of spiders).

    If the rad contamination from Fuku–ALONE–were yellow…we'd have to stop calling this the "blue planet".

    And don't think it's just the northern hemisphere…it's the entire world that nuclear contaminates. Fleeing to the south might buy some time, but will end with the exact same fate if we don't abolish nuclear.

    Every plant, globally, should be in cold shutdown immediately.

    • We Not They Finally

      Then again, it's all a big catch-22. No one will shut the NPP's down if no truth is told. And no one will tell the truth without a manifest public will to shut the NPP's down.

      This would be a REALLY good time for people to start thinking on their own.

    • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

      October 18, 2012 was the date of the announcement of corium mapping via muon imaging, per the link posted by MoonlightEmpire above.
      "Testing will begin later this year, officials say, and final images will be produced next year. " This is just buying more time.
      Agreed, MoonlightEmpire: the data was captured and the corium was imaged years ago.
      This is nothing but a ploy to buy more time before public disclosure of what we on ENEnews knew and warned about from 2011 on:

      The corium has left the building, hasn't it? 😉

      One of my posts from that thread:

      October 18, 2012 at 12:19 pm · Reply
      "use cosmic rays to locate molten nuclear fuel WITHIN the crippled REACTORS" presumes that there is molten nuclear fuel within the crippled reactors to find. This is a complete myth, and only wastes time, as TEP.Gov.LosAlamos pretend to keep busy, and pretend to have a plan. Perhaps we are playing a game. "See, here is the core, right where we thought it would be. Too much radiation, so let's just fill the reactor with borated cement and walk away." Announce to the public that the plants are "decommissioned".

      In reality, not so much…

  • We Not They Finally

    "Testing will begin later this year, officials say, and final images will be produced next year"? So four years in, they will finally know something? Maybe? Or four years more after that? Or maybe never?

    Why do they print this cr-p at all? Who believes it? But at least they are printing something. As long as they keep printing, maybe at some point, some truth will seep through. Unless, of course, some readers who aren't complete morons finally start to piece together 2 + 2.

    • We Not They Finally

      It would also be a REALLY good time for everyone (from Obama and the DOE down) to do a cold shutdown on "safe, green, cheap and clean" about nuclear energy. Also a good time to be dissembling the CO2 bogeyman and look a bit more at the likes of plutonium.

  • ftlt

    The world is a nuclear oyster.

    FUFU is but an obvious symptom of what awaits all things nuclear.

    It will be interesting to see which insane and arrogant human produced mega disaster gets us in the end.

    Nuclear certainly is sitting in a good position on the rail to win the race.

  • dodge

    Criminals have know for a long time, "if they can't find the body, it's difficult to prove the crime." When many band together to hid the evidence, we label it a conspiracy. In this situation, we have no one directly harmed. We do however, have a whole host of mystery illness – many in wild-life, some in people. The important thing is we don't… repeat it again, WE DON'T know what is causing it. Mystery illness has no consequence – should ever it be found that Fuk… is responsible, they and the scientific/nuclear/government/money/news community would be held responsible. Imagine the grandparents world-wide reaction once they discover the reality of the damage this group has caused, and the bleak future for many of their grandchildren. Yes, folks, it's to early to bring in the dogs, let the body stay missing a bit longer.

  • Nick

    Global Climate Change.

    Three words that are supposed to strike fear into EVERY soul on earth.


    Then there is nuclear radioactive toxins, which just happen to be getting worse by the second, with every atom of Uranium mined, etc.

    Notice the SILENCE about nuclear anything.

    Now listen to the clarion of GCC.

    Go figure.

  • davidh7426 davidh7426

    It would appear that poor little Wales, land of the Leek and very long unpronounceable names, has had a teeny, tiny little accident at the Wylfa Nuclear Power Station…

    Nuclear Event in United Kingdom on Thursday, 19 June, 2014 at 10:07 (10:07 AM) UTC.


    and so is on the verge of joining that select, yet ever growing club of countries that have been royally 'F****d up' by Nuclear power.

    • nedlifromvermont

      No worries davidh! The old Wylfa station is a graphite-moderated, gas (CO2) cooled, magnox fueled reactor … one of the last of its kind and soon to be shut down (maybe) …

      at least the still operating unit is not a flimsy GE Mark One crap lemon, or else London and Dublin (and points in between like Liverpool and Oxford and Manchester would be preparing to evacuate to … exactly where again?

      The foolish nuclear pukes. Shut 'em down and ban the technology!

      • davidh7426 davidh7426

        "…soon to be shut down…"

        I'll believe it when I see it Nedli. Or more accurately, I'll see it, but I doubt I'll believe it, at least not totally.

        IF, these monstrosities are razed level to the ground, then I'll believe the 'shutdown' fairytale. Until then I'm going with sceptical distrust of anything they say.

    • freebywill

      " Reactor one was shut down on 6 January for maintenance work and the discovery of further problems has delayed re-starting the station twice. The latest repairs are to a damaged pipe which was spotted by workers on 13 June but there are hopes to restart the plant again in two weeks "

      19 June 2014 Last updated at 02:28 ET | Wylfa nuclear power station closed for five months | http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-north-west-wales-27917859

      Maybe something happened during the reapirs.

  • weeman

    Does it really matter what procedure you use to contain this accident, no matter what position you take it will be beset by unforseen dilemmas.
    Yes contain what has left the building will never be returned and only what is left of the corium blobs that remains in building will ever be able to be contained again. let us all hope that Murphy was on our side and the corium has not broke through foundations.
    Hoping for small mercies and good vibs for mankind and all life forms that reside on our little rock in the ocean of space and time.
    We are not significant on the scale of things anyway, we won't be missed and no other lifeform will ever know that we even exit or existed.
    Nothing last forever, not even the universe, everything has a time if it exists.

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