Japan Nuclear Professor: It’s feared Fukushima fuel pool to “collapse in” at any time; “Any scale of accident is possible” — Expert warns ice wall increases risk that reactor units will move or shift; Buildings ‘very precarious’ even without frozen barrier being constructed (AUDIO)

Published: June 10th, 2014 at 8:04 pm ET
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Radio Forum #72, May 24, 2014 — Translated by DISSENSUS JAPAN, June 10, 2014:

  • Jiro Ishimaru, host: About the current progress of decommissioning…
  • Hiroaki Koide, professor at Kyoto University Research Reactor Institute: [...] In November 2013, they started with Reactor #4 because it was the most accessible pool, and the most dangerous. The floor that housed the Used Fuel Pool in Reactor #4 was hugely damaged and it has been feared that the pool might collapse in any time. This is a very dangerous job. Any scale of accident is possible. But they have to do it. [...]
  • Translation of complete interview available here

WBUR — Here and Now, June 9, 2014:

  • Ken Buesseler, senior scientist at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution: Maybe there’s some side effects [to the ice wall] that might also creep into this game, that they really haven’t considered here… if you stop the flow of water into certain soil, you can get things like settling — Buildings can move, so these are very precarious situation anyways, so we don’t want to have shifting.
  • Full WBUR broadcast available here
Published: June 10th, 2014 at 8:04 pm ET
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241 comments

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241 comments to Japan Nuclear Professor: It’s feared Fukushima fuel pool to “collapse in” at any time; “Any scale of accident is possible” — Expert warns ice wall increases risk that reactor units will move or shift; Buildings ‘very precarious’ even without frozen barrier being constructed (AUDIO)

  • dunkilo

    let me know which way your going,dont want to run you over!


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      • Salemone Salemone

        I feel these things have already happened…they are just now telling us what could happen, what might happen. But it's already happened. There is no reason to tell us anything, anymore.


        Report comment

        • What? You don't want to hear any more sweet little lies?

          Are you ready to break up?

          Can we refer you to a good divorce lawyer?


          Report comment

        • I agree. Tepco's story line to the public is pretty predictable. Obvious too that any of the countries tied into profiteering from nuclear related businesses will help keep the storyline puff pieces going.

          I think there will be a value in keeping track of it as it all plays out though. Later when more people ask why didn't someone tell us, what exactly is going on?…we'll be able to fill in the blank spaces with all that we've researched, said and documented during these years of media blackout.


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          • Like Salemone, My take also is that it already happened. The effects certainly may get worse as it plays out but yeah, the monstrous event that was the beginning can't be un-done.


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            • We Not They Finally

              Called "the beginning of the end." Three days earlier, husband was sitting at kitchen table and kept saying, "Something terrible is about to happen. It's the beginning of the end." He had never done that before. As soon as the earthquake hit (not even news yet of tsunami and nuclear disaster,) we knew. We still had to work through some shocked denial, because the death of A WORLD was too big to absorb all at once. And we still want people to have happiness and fulfillment wherever they can find it. But yes, it's a done deal.


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            • HoTaters HoTaters

              "Normal is a setting on a dryer."

              Great, I saw that at your site. We're looking at far N.E. Washington, Oregon, or Idaho as places to move to, right now.

              Trying to figure out what might be safer than the West Coast for the next 20 years.

              If such a place exists.


              Report comment

              • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                Wouldn't go to any of those places/locations..density of radiation contamination would/should be higher in those areas.


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                • HoTaters HoTaters

                  obewan, why do you think the radiation contamination would be higher than on the West Coast, California? I realize it's not a good idea to be anywhere near Hanford or Idaho Flats, but would you please explain your reasoning?

                  Thanks, HT.


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                  • HoTaters HoTaters

                    Thought I'd mention we are considering semi-arid areas on the eastern slope, behind at least two mountain ranges. Less rainfall, more than 800 miles inland, so probably fewer buckyball and other nasties being carried inland from the coastal areas.


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                  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                    I have seen the results of the Jet stream flow patterns and they go right over the areas you outlined and along with Hanford you would be downwind in Idaho. There are many operating Nuclear Power Plants operating all over the world and some rouge nations are probably detonating/testing nuclear bombs like North Korea. Most generated fallout/release from any Nuclear event will eventually collect in the Jet Streams and then drop on the unaware population centers below. Rain and snow are now radioactive hot.. :(

                    Cancer and disease rates are high in these regions for a reason. :(


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                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      My grandson at age 3 went sledding in the Cascades east of Portland in the rain and snow in the fall of 2011. He now has stunted growth and is losing his hair and has had new severe allergic reactions. It certainly is looking like he was hit with the fallout from Fukushima. I can only take people and even my family to the brain trough, but I can not make anyone eat or drink the brain candy. :(


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                    • VanneV VanneV

                      I'm sorry about your grandson, Obewan.


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                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      Thanks VanneV and I hope he grows stronger and recovers. We all were hit with radiation contamination during the Nuclear testing era and lots of us are still ok, so there is hope he too will be ok with time.


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                    • monster

                      I wish him well, the smile on their faces are priceless when their out playing having fun. It's very upsetting to see the little ones have to pay the price for it. Take care my friend.


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                    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

                      Thanks monster and exactly why we must change the course of our future. When I was his age I had no fear of drinking rain or eating snow or even dirt. The environmental damage we have done in such a short time period here on planet Earth.. is surely a crime.


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              • HoTaters….each state has it's drawbacks. Before I got a geiger counter, I'd look at Spokane (daughter lived there, me too for a few yrs) and see it on the radmap always in the 400 or so CPM. Holy crap! Hosp's, military base, med treatments, college labs. It all contributes. I'm relieved to know now my personal area averages about 34? Haven't known what it can spike yet but had a C-137 sky a couple times earlier.

                OR seems to be free of the obvious spots if away from the coast….who knows?

                Id's got nastys at Idaho Falls, 400CPM… WTH is there…IDK.


                Report comment

                • There's simply not enough private sites with history that are hooked up to a radmap…you need to scout around with a geiger counter in hand.

                  Normal…yeah, lol. And as you probably saw, I'm not putting much time into my clay work anymore. Trying to garden & keep up with spreading the radiation info takes all my time. Plus physical limits happening more the past 3 yrs. Some I blame on Fuki's first vomit. Ergh!


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                • HoTaters HoTaters

                  Teri, I'm concerned about the stations on NETC that show readings in the teens. Some of the more well-versed people here have reported Geiger Counters with low sensitivity will only pick up about 10% of what the more sensitive instruments pick up.

                  For example, we have two stations here in Sacramento which regularly have CPM counts (on NETC) between 18 and 25. The actual CPM count (when the third station is up and running) is usually closer to 105 to 120 CPM.

                  So I'm wondering why your particular area would have a reading in the 30's. Is that based on your own measurements, and what are you using to get the counts?

                  Thanks, HT


                  Report comment

                  • Hi HT First of all, I'm not a geiger geek at all…just got them and haven't even been able to download the detailed specific how-tos on my GMC320+ yet but it had excellent reviews for it's tube type sensitivity. (GMC diplays CPM counts and microSv/h at the same time in it's window)

                    I also bought a nice Mazur9000 for later, more sensitive, with the extra choices of Rem, Seivert (milli, micro setting, etc) and both devices do almost the same exact readings on those.
                    The PRM with it's much wider pancake tube type collects more particles each minute so it's CPM is higher, seems to mostly show almost double? I'll be learning more about it all.

                    NETC map makes use of the GMC models' lower CPM counts, I'm presuming, so I go by that one for comparing to their radmaps. I've started learning all the basic conversion stuff but not finalized yet on which setting I want to leave the PRM on, to do timed measurements, record it's data.

                    My average all day today ranged 13 to 28 CPMs on the GMC300+ I haven't messed with it's timed data record yet. I've got a lot to learn. :) I don't want to screw them up by punching this button and that. I'm excited to have them and steadily increasing the little I do know so far from cruising various forums and links. I welcome advice!


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                    • OH I forgot to say…my mountains are loaded with old defunct mines, silver, gold, lead, some are uranium ore with tailings and the border patrol guy purportedly said the uranium can screw up the real finite setting details they need when using their equipment on people crossing the border. Gads. Interesting…

                      One of my goals is to reach thru or over our water reservoirs fences and dry the water or scum sample to get a reading with the PRM9000. Maybe I don't want to know.


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              • Southbound Southbound

                The entire Northern hemisphere is much worse off than the Southern. Some areas, such as the Caribbean Islands and other more isolated areas, are better off than others, but the only way to truly remove yourself from the vast majority of pollutants is to move to the Southern hemisphere.

                Check out this amazing model of atmospheric pollutants over the past century. Please share this, too. It's quite insightful.

                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9bqzX7pBlA


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          • whatamessa

            I shudder when I think of the hysteria,aggression, confusion,mass panic etc.etc.when people realise what is taking place here on planet Earth.Will be very ugly I am sure.


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  • rogerthat

    http://www.abqjournal.com/413553/abqnewsseeker/doe-explores-new-theory-for-wipp-radiation-leak.html

    ''…One of the six drums — the one with the cracked lid — is at WIPP, according to the NMED. The Environment Department late Tuesday said DOE has confirmed that the remaining five are being held at Waste Control Specialists in Andrews, Texas.''

    - and then there was one. nothing to see here, folks, move along


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  • Angela_R

    I looked around for a song, this singer was not a favorite, but listen, it says what some might want to say:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vif3DjNm5Ec


    Report comment

  • Sickputer

    No need to panic JB. Yes things are dire. But hey…hit the PowerBall tomorrow and you can establish your own little hidey-hole in the Tongas with a massive yacht and enough family supplies for 300 years. :-)

    Some naked apes will survive…at least as long the atmosphere is not totally destroyed. Which is a possibility.

    I seriously doubt the floor of the spent fuel pond at Unit 4 is as bad as they say. They were actually been able to reinforce it because there was not as serious a meltdown at 4 as the other three units. Workers didn't die in minutes working at Unit 4. Weeks maybe.

    At Units 1-3 (especially 2) the radiation emissions are so dangerous that Tepco has hesitated to emulate the Russian kamikaze squads at Chernobyl.

    Cowardly behavior? Perhaps. But not the workers, the vast majority have behaved bravely.

    I paint the yellow coward brush on the nucelorats at Tepco and the Diet. They can't make up their minds to request or order suicide workers en masse to stop the emissions. Tokyo burns while the Diet fiddles.

    Why? Because they know that coverage of the event and the resulting deaths by millions of workers will be the death of any nuclear expansion worldwide and the beginning of a massive financial crisis in Japan.

    They are being encouraged by the US, France, Russia, Great Britain, India, China, and other nuclear nations to let the buildings burn out. Which they will. In the course of time, Japan will be nuclear toast


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    • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

      But Sickputer…what about Theo Theofanous,… and Jaczko, and all the others…what about the video? Is there any doubt spent fuel pool 4 lost a great deal if not all water at some point? That they couldnt even fly over in helicopters, that zirconium once ignited continues to burn under water? Even if by miraculous stroke of luck they were able to restore water, and put out the fires, huge quantities of heavy beams and stuff fell into the pool, and we were told the slightest miss handling would lead to massive releases and evacuation. OK, Im willing to believe…its a miracle. Those of faith, can I hear hallelujah?


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      • Sickputer

        Oh I think they have many spent fuel rod assemblies left in Unit 4.

        Still a threat and yes it was on fire numerous times, but I doubt the fuel at 4 all burned up as suggested by some observers. The story of how Unit 4 was reinforced from June of 2011 to February of 2012 is a story we have yet to have a full narrative.

        The horrendous gushing aerial and water-borne radiation beneath and above the ruins of Units 1-3 makes me think the scare stories about Unit 4 are just a Tepco side story to detract from the global killers at Units 1-3.

        They spent/spend $1 million a day trying to stabilize Daiichi.

        That number should have been $5 billion a day to have any chance of saving Japan.

        Too late now…I don't know if there is enough human resources in the civilized world to contain the nuclear releases at Fukushima.


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        • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

          Ok, not as bad as I thought then…


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          • Sickputer

            And maybe I am totally wrong also. Guessing about actions and scenarios is about all we can do because of the Japanese iron hand over the media. We see what they want us to see. When things got really bad, the web cameras shut down or appeared "altered".

            What about the CSFP? The huge Common Spent Fuel Pond is the only ground level storage pool and we know little of how it fared during and since 311.

            Tepco says they are putting rod assemblies from 4 in the CSFP. So what is the longterm strategy to get those killer rods farther away from the worsening situation at Fukushima?

            The world wonders…


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            • monster

              It doesn't make much sense does it? Why store the fuel rods from unit 4 in the common fuel pool? Especially since there's a real chance of the site being abandoned due to increasing exposure levels. Crumbling buildings, vent stacks with miracles holding them up, and on and on… Then again no one really knows what's been removed and where it has gone.


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              • Radio Radio

                Monster, the common pool is the closest source of stable contained cooling water they have at hand that is on the ground. The fuel is too hot to dry cask and store and it needs to remain in water for another 5 years or so before dry casking can even be considered. They have to move the rods one at a time in a boron lead-lined canister sling gizmo which is a very, very slow exacting procedure, so the closer the more stable pool, the less travel time in that sling, which is the next most risky time save for another serious earthquake. And, when i say "Serious," i mean an earthquake that is either large enough or close enough to shake the building struts or set the water in the top pool sloshing, which would shift the pools weight back and forth violently. I recall TEPCo rating the repairs to withstand a 6.4, but, just about everyone else in the world thought a 6.0 would be too much for the pool to take.


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                • monster

                  Yes I agree with the being close part. Could another pool have been constructed closer? What about putting possibly damaged rods in a near capacity pool? Seems like a big problem that could get a lot bigger. Another example of doing it the cheapest way possible with little thought of the next problem their actions caused.


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            • We Not They Finally

              Yeah, SP, we have always heard next to nothing about the Common Spent Fuel Pool, but that may have the MOST rods in it.

              Remember, even the WIPP monstrosity was set up to alleviate common spent fuel pools from the most dangerous nuclear sites in America.

              People tend to forget that the seventy years of lies have built up to mountains of common spent fuel pools


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          • AGreenRoad – TEPCO/Fukushima Lies Exposed Around Building #4, SFP, Core. Equipment Pool, Melt Out; via @AGreenRoad
            http://agreenroad.blogspot.com/2013/12/agreenroad-tepcofukushima-lies-exposed.html


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            • Radio Radio

              Dr. D, i think there is no doubt the SFP 4 had two water loss events that resulted in some amount of fuel burning. How much? I don't even think TEPCo knows that answer to keep it from us. It certainly got hot enough to crack the cladding on much of the fuel rods, at the very least, which would have created a lot of smoke. But, there was soooo much fuel in that pool that had it burned and melted and flowed out, surely everyone would have been dead within about 10 mins no matter how suited up they were. It wouldn't be like standing in the heart of a nuclear reactor, but, refissioning would have become unstoppable, so it would be like standing at a reactor with the door open. No way for anything to survive that. So, i'm thinking that we can know some things are true or not, maybe not down to the detail, but, generally so, simply because not everyone dies immediately when they arrive for work.


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              • Radio Radio

                There was a fellow posting here a while back who messed with videos from live feeds of the TEPCo cameras – distorted them quite a lot graphically, added color where it would not normally be, elongated time frames, etc, and also often added music. I took him as a video artist trying to make people take notice until i realized he was claiming that his videos were actual footage instead of artistic renditions. Sadly, the distortions he put out had people arriving at all sorts of conclusions though he was careful never to make any detailed claim himself about what was being viewed and tended to talk in riddles in broken German/English. One of those conclusions or interpretations, and that was all we had to go on – interpretations back then – was the demise of SFP 4. It swept through enenews, though had less purchase on many other sites. But, at least what came of it was that SFP 4, and very


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                • Radio Radio

                  con't…very likely SFP 3 were in fact heavily damaged and needed immediate attention in case they fell, spilling their contents onto the tarmac. They can't get near SFP 3 and Sickputer knows just about all there is to know on that reactor and pool because he followed it like a hawk. But SFP 4 had some hope of being repaired long enough to get the fuel out. What became of the video artist, i don't know, and i truly think his goal was to draw attention to a crisis in a creative way, which he did, so maybe job done for him. But, the idea still persists from that debate that sfp 4 collapsed, spilling all it's contents onto the Fukushima tarmac or burned up and vaporized into the atmosphere within a few days.


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                • Sickputer

                  Our Harii warrior Nuckelchen is a bit of a video computer genius and much can be surmised by his work. Yes, his work may seem morbid and misinterpreted by many. Very useful though.

                  Others emulated Nuck, but none match his skills. Take this Unit 4 611 example for instance:

                  Unaltered recording of the one hour 20X speed June 11, 2011 event: The Day the Buildings Disappeared: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BaAHaPycZtE

                  Special filter view of the last 40 minutes of June 11, 2011: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8vwF6c8_1Q

                  SP: Filters are useful for nuclear fire/vapor/hydrovolcanic nuclear steam events. Music is just an addition to get us in the proper Berserker mindset to endure the indignity of global health assault by the military industrial complex.

                  As for moving rods from 4 safely offsite….that is a technology challenge that can be solved by trillions of dollars which they refuse to commit to the battle to save the Northern Hemisphere ecosphere. There is plenty of land in a 100 mile semicircle west of Good Fortune island they can use as a permanent waste site far from the tsunami zone.

                  That semicircle is unlivable, but 1 million poor souls remain to spill their guts out from nuclear poisoning. In 5 to 10 years the dead zone bioaccumulation will encompass the 40 million people in the Tokyo metroplex. The Tokyo Flight of intellectuals will begin in earnest long before the 2020 Hunger Games. 99% of the inhabitants will remain…no flight options.


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                  • Sp, interesting thought about the island.

                    That's the fellow – Nuckelchen! I thought he drew a lot of attention to an important area and gave a lot of credence to people's concerns about all the steam events, where the the work cranes were and what they were or were not doing on such and such a day when something unusual was going on. I asked him to make sure viewers understood when he edited a video so that they weren't thinking they were watching a replay of unaltered video and he was real good about that. I don't think he expected such a following. Other video artists were not so gracious. Folks were thinking a time lapse of 3 hours of fog and steam was a ten minute rupture event. When all we have is each other and some grainy video and a few leaked reports from whistleblowers, such clarifications are important to me when TEPCo et al are concealing, obfuscating, and denying. When we accuse them of altering video, it's only fair that we aren't either.


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              • Clear pictures of fuel melting out of the building cannot be dismissed so easily.

                Did you read the whole article and look at the pictures?


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                • Dr. D, first , let me say how much i admire your work and advocacy and your attention to detail and NOT distorting images then posting them as actual photos. And, your video assessment is superb. Some of the best that i have seen on the net. Sorting through this stuff is hard enough given two things – 1) TEPCo conceals much of the truth and, 2) Few nuclear scientists actually have a grasp of what has actually happened because they are trained to rely on measurements and not trust their eyes, and there are very few measurements.

                  So, we are left, us simply folk, to look and wonder and make our best assessment, which i think is often better than the experts.

                  I don't think that we are disagreeing at all. You are talking about the equipment pool and i am talking about the main cooling pond and in your video you make it clear that the equipment pool, and very likely the reactor itself, had fuel in it. I think you on to something very important.


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                  • con't… and the video shows that SFP 4 survived for the most part, as you said, they were able to save it. But, few people know about the equipment pool. Maybe some more of the illegal US mox fuel was in there? Maybe just one bundle of regular rods. Heck, maybe even the reactor was being used for extra storage or they were in the process of adding fuel. You raise important questions and sadly, we may not get those answers beyond your own assessment of what was going on.

                    My own leaning was that IF SFP4 melted with all that fuel left exposed to the air, it would still be cooking and no one could approach for miles. Immediate death would be the proof.

                    The equipment pool with fuel inside may have been cool enough to just kill the first responders who would have shoveled the debris over such a pile, or the fuel completely volatized into the air.

                    I think you nailed it, Dr. Goodheart!


                    Report comment

                    • So, i think that ADMIN should repost your video and start a discussion around this because we are all talking about the main pool and NOT the more important items relevant to those early days – the glowing reactor, the melted golden something beneath where the equipment pool would be, and the equipment pool itself. Not only would that clarify Unit 4 for us, but, it would also get those questions back into the chatter – what WAS being concealed in both the reactor and the equipment pool. So, i'm going to make that recommendation and start it off with this question – could the nuclear detonation in Unit 3 have ejected fuel sideways through the connecting tunnel and into Unit 4 and THAT is the heat signature in the videos?


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          • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

            whats wrong with this story;

            capacity of common spent fuel pool 6840 fuel assemblies
            Stored fuel at common spent fuel pool 6,375 fuel assemblies
            remaining capacity 465 fuel assemblies

            spent fuel pool four stored fuel assemblies 1533 (managing capacity 1042) …(decay heat in spent fuel pool 4; 1.58 megawatt)

            number of fuel assemblies in excess of design capacity 491 in SFP4

            number of fuel assemblies from fuel pool four that exceed the capacity of the common spent fuel pool 1068

            Where are they going to put 1068 fuel assemblies?


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            • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

              Spent fuel rod transfers are always under the most secure and controlled setting due to the potential nuclear catastrophe that would happen if just one spent rod is mishandled.

              The racks inside SFP4 were damaged by the explosion in the early days of the accident.

              Zirconium cladding which encased the rods burned when water levels dropped, but to what extent the rods have been damaged is not known, however, zirconium is autocatalytic once ignited and continues to burn in water.

              Saltwater cooling has caused corrosion of the pool walls, and probably the fuel rods and racks.

              The cranes that normally lift the fuel were destroyed.

              Computer-guided removal will not be possible; everything will have to be done manually. (this was the statement, although alleged photos show a bran new removal system in a pristine environment.)

              TEPCO cannot attempt this process without humans, which will manage this enormous task while being bombarded with radiation during the extraction and casking. Spent fuel pools in 1 and 3 are considered destroyed which should contribute to massive radioactive contamination of unit 4. Helicopters could not fly over unit 4.

              The process of removing each rod will have to be repeated over 1,300 times without incident.

              Moving damaged nuclear fuel under such complex conditions could result in a criticality if the rods come into close proximity to one another, which would then set off a chain reaction that cannot be stopped.


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              • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

                How do you lift fuel assemblies that have destroyed racks, non existent zirconium cladding and a super high radiation environment? We did see people working on unit 4. Perhaps they were on a suicide mission. If the fuel in SFP4 melted down, what would the purpose of the massive structure be? Is it possible that the pool did not contain the stated inventory? (clandestine plutonium extraction?)


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            • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

              number of fuel assemblies from SFP4 that exceed the capacity of the common spent fuel pool= 1068

              Where are they going to put 1068 fuel assemblies? Do I recall they are going to cram them in beyond design capacity? Is it possible the common fuel pool or SFP4 did not contain the listed inventory?

              If an accident at SFP4 would cause evacuation and devastation of the hemisphere, whey isnt this already the case with SFP1, and SFP3?


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              • CSD, all gravely good points. I think there was talk about dry casking some of the stuff in the community pond a wee bit ahead of schedule as well as cram as many in as you recall correctly. But, given the count you just posted, i doubt that they can dry cask enough to make room for all the fuel rods, should they all be intact and pristine in the sfp. Perhaps they assume many will NOT be intact and will have to be left in the sfp, so there'll be room in the community pond after all. If they were smart, they'd be building another community pond. In fact, i thought that they should have built a cooling pond all the way around and below sfp 4 for the rods to either be placed there or to possibly catch any that fell if a collapse occurred or one was dropped during extraction. They could have made it one large pool with sections – fill up one section, move on to the next, leave room for falling rods and fuel assemblies. It wouldn't be perfect and would add on costs, but, it would be a far cry better than the cheaper "no room for mistakes" approach they are insisting on taking.


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                • CodeShutdown CodeShutdown

                  Radio, et al; I guess I wasnt very clear. People keep going on like there is a SFP4 unloading procedure going on. All of the above was meant to point out how preposterous…or miraculous that is. Anyone promoting the idea of SFP4 fuel removal must honestly confront these and other facts

                  1- huge explosion in unit 4!!
                  2-massive debries falls in to SFP
                  3-Tepco admits to loss of water
                  4-Salt water compounds problem and must really gunk things up with continually dehydrated salt water in early days.
                  5-there is a fire in SFP4…this means most if not all zirconium cladding is gone. Removal is not possible
                  6-procedure is extremely delicate even if everything is perfect. What are the chances of failure?
                  7-there is no room in the common spent fuel pool
                  8-people at the highest level admit that SFP4 has/was melted/destroyed/burned etc

                  wed march 16 TEPCO announces that the fuel rod storage pool of unit 4 may have begun boiling. All disasters are under reported, so this has weight.

                  The loss of fuel pool cooling water at unit 4 is classified as a level 3 incident. Multiple meltdowns are considered at the time level 4 or 5…so a pretty serious anouncement.

                  Arnie makes a video describing zirconium fires and how they keep burning under water.

                  Later, as NoPrevarication points out in a post below, Hatrick Penry goes into detail about FOIA documents.
                  http://hatrickpenryunbound.com/


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                  • Jebus

                    IMHO, there is no question that what was in #4 eq. pool burned through multiple walls.

                    There is no question that #3 blew sky high.

                    There is no question that there are multiple corium groundwater contamination vectors.

                    There is no question that 1189 days have gone by with continous multi-ton flows into the Ocean. 24/7

                    There is no question that this is not your daddy's meltdown…

                    Airborne Radiation Spread

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5eZvCOL_Ho

                    "The horse took the barn door with it."

                    The reality is the foodchain…


                    Report comment

        • VanneV VanneV

          +1000000000. Also, the story about Unit #4 fuel removal and the ice wall makes it look like they can solve the problems at Fukushima Daiichi, when the reality is that it, along with methane release due to dumping nuclear waste north of Siberia, means there is little time left before an ELE becomes apparent worldwide.

          They just want to buy time to sell the next generation of nuclear reactors. Anything to maintain power and skim off more money for themselves. Didn't they ever hear that you can't take it with you? Rationalization and denial are defects in human thinking. And as people are contaminated by nuclear radioisotopes, the more brain defects.

          Don't forget the relation to methane and nuclear power plants which Arto Lauri hypothesized as one of the causes of the Fukushima nuclear disaster. The German were smart to close down nuclear power plants. Some other countries refuse nuclear energy.


          Report comment

      • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication

        @CodeShutdown:

        Spent Fuel Pool #4 boiled dry right away (See: "Something Wicked This Way Comes," at HatrickPenry Unbound." Documented. The common spent fuel pool was still there as of a week or so ago. Not certain about that now. See Bobby 1 blog re that. It is (or was) the worst of the worst. HatrickPenry has written about all of this.

        I have noticed that this site avoids mentioning that that pool went long ago, and keeps posting articles about what might happen. Readership has dropped to (usually) under 1,500 when an article appears. I think the site has been acquired by someone else who does not post relevant information. I'm leaving because of that. If you read Bobby 1 blog, you know things are happening that are not reported here.

        Also, when ANYTHING is posted, the trolls are out in incredible force on this site (note hundreds of comments on disinformation articles). The general discussion thread is about all that is worth reading anymore, so I'll come back from time to time for that.


        Report comment

    • Sickputer, i agree, though i'm not sure SFP 4 was meant to be a distraction, as it is dire and and in need of repair but also they could approach it. It was an engineering solution that they could carry out and show off far more than a nuclear fix, perhaps.


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      • Shaker1

        "As for moving rods from 4 safely offsite….that is a technology challenge that can be solved by trillions of dollars which they refuse to commit to the battle to save the Northern Hemisphere ecosphere. There is plenty of land in a 100 mile semicircle west of Good Fortune island they can use as a permanent waste site far from the tsunami zone."

        Radio, I'm also not sure that SFP4 is a total distraction. For the last few days I've been looking back into information (and thanks, bo, for Japanese links of which I was aware) regarding that pool and how that might change my personal ideas of the situation regarding it.

        But I also wholeheartedly agree with the quote from Sickputer and I've said as much throughout. The material in the pools, and especially the CSFP, is as dangerous and exponentially greater than the melts themselves, and it's something that can be accomplished. The melt-outs are a fact, and shuffling stuff around at this point, while surely not all they can do, is but one act in the show. I'm very disappointed that more effort hasn't been made to increase the infrastructure to accomodate spent fuel, not only there but at the 50-odd other sites that are surely brimming. They will print money to give away, or spend it on airplanes to argue over some rocks, but not print money for that infrastructure? Why isn't that (the infrastructure) considered any more economically helpful than something like war, which is just producing things to destroy?


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        • Shaker1, compartmentalization might be the death of us all. My former nuclear engineer neighbor, he did the electronics, knows the stuff is dangerous but it wasn't HIS department's concern. They just worked on wires and circuits and such, not the fuel. That was so and so's task, not his. I firmly believe that few in official positions have even asked if there are adequate cooling pools.


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  • Jebus

    And on and on it goes…

    http://hisz.rsoe.hu/alertmap/site/index.php?pageid=event_desc&edis_id=ED-20140610-44092-USA

    When is it gonna stop?

    When does dilution, become the pollution?

    When is too much for the esential circle of life?

    That essential circle of life, out of sight and mind.

    When is too much radionuclides released, too much?


    Report comment

  • kintaman kintaman

    Just curious. Are there any folks here who left/evacuated Japan because of 3.11 (Fukushima nuclear disaster)? If not, does anyone here personally know anyone who did?


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  • Ontological Ontological

    Corium collapses could occur, local Eq's may perhaps indicate many have already.


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  • Jebus

    There may be over 7 billion of "us", but,

    "we", humans, do not get to inherit this planet alone…

    http://hisz.rsoe.hu/alertmap/site/index.php?pageid=event_desc&edis_id=NC-20140610-44084-KOR

    It's not gonna happen.

    When we break it, it's game over. End of Story…


    Report comment

  • rogerthat

    https://www.hcn.org/issues/46.10/the-leak-heard-round-the-nuclear-industry?src=feat
    The leak heard ‘round the nuclear industry
    A radioactive leak in New Mexico will make solutions to our waste problem even more elusive.
    News: Jun 09, 2014
    By Judith Lewis Mernit
    ''Until this Feb. 5, when fire erupted from a truck 2,100 feet below ground at the Waste Isolation Pilot Plant in southeastern New Mexico, the country's only permanent nuclear waste repository had a perfect 15-year-long safety record. It's hard to overstate how much this mattered: The deep salt-bed mine, called always by its acronym, only handles debris from nuclear bomb-making. Yet nuclear power proponents have long drawn optimism from WIPP's success. If a repository could succeed for nuclear-defense waste – a category less hot than spent reactor fuel – could we then find a place to inter the accumulating detritus of nuclear reactors? If WIPP could demonstrate safe geologic disposal, might other communities with the appropriate geology also welcome nuclear waste into their backyards?
    Nuclear power could then make its comeback as a climate-friendly alternative to coal. That long hoped-for renaissance stalled out as more spent fuel rods crowded into inadequate pools at reactor sites – pools, as we saw at Fukushima Daiichi in 2011, that could burst into flames. WIPP offered hope, evidence, a living laboratory: Let 1,000 reactors bloom…''

    - the vision splendid. you have been warned.


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    • jec jec

      A Bit off, on the contents..the items DUMPED in WIPP were fuel cells/rods..and mixtures even hotter. The US Department of Defense just re-classifed them on paper to make it possible to dump into a low level!!! waste dump. WIPP, as told to the public, was NEVER meant to hold this hot material…Of course, in the eyes of the government, what are a few exposures to radiation, if its just for the "better good"..of the nuclear industry..


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    • rogerthat, when i read the sentence " nuclear waste repository had a perfect 15-year-long safety record," i thought to myself, a drop in the bucket of the thousands of years it needs operate and wondered is it really possible that people are this obtuse about the dangers of nuclear radiation? And, yes, they are, quite sadly.

      But, the main issue, i'm a thinking, is really that this is MANMADE radiation, which industries and governments need to be thought of as safe. I thought to myself, let's say the sun moved just a wee bit closer to approximate the amount of added radiation Fukushima will deliver into the environment, and i realized that every health organization around the world would be having people remain indoors 23 3/4 hours out of every 24.


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  • WesternKyMan

    Don't worry folks…. if the ground subsides because of the ice wall, Tepco already has a plan in place to keep the ground from sinking by using bananas and potato chips as filler so the ground will remain stable.


    Report comment

    • And duct tape… just in case the banana peels are too slippery and won't hold.


      Report comment

    • jec jec

      Don't forget the 'organic' kitty litter..better than duct tape!!


      Report comment

      • melting mermaid melting mermaid

        What about the sleeping next to your mate for forty days. Now I'm gonna have to buy some lead pajamas and warn my neighbors about the dangers of banana bread and kitty litter. If I'd have known the effects of organic kitty litter on pyrophoric substances I wouldn't have gotten a kitty. And now I don't know if I want to get married, what's the point in eating healthy and giving up smoking if your being irradiated by your lover every night I ask you? Why worry about industrial pollution and government cover ups, when your sleeping with the enemy and some highly combustible kryton 85 might float over your kitty litter and blow your whole family up at anytime if you don't get shot first because its like the wild west out here on acid and the only thing scarier than gun weilding Americans is the militarized police force. If you don't include Fukushima, wipp, the wigner affect, global warming, the nmic, full spectrum control by psychotic people, mind control, weather warfare, methane super flux, oxygen depletion, oh and radiation caused zombie apocalypse. Well, I have laundry to do, y'all have a nice day.


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  • rogerthat

    http://dailyfusion.net/2014/06/spent-nuclear-fuel-evolution-29165/

    - new EU study on spent fuel. …''After discharge from the core of a nuclear reactor, spent nuclear fuel rods are cooled for several years in water pools at the reactor site. Once the heat generated by radioactive decay processes has become sufficiently low, the spent fuel is moved to dry or wet interim storage, where it is stored before being moved to a final disposal in a geological repository or to a reprocessing plant. Typically, interim storage facilities are licensed to store spent fuel for a few decades (e.g. 40 years in Germany).
    Due to the expanding timeline for the definition and implementation of the disposal in geological repository, in many countries the duration of the interim storage will have to be extended to longer periods, possibly encompassing a time scale of the order of a century. A sound scientific basis of data and knowledge is therefore required to assess the safety of spent fuel during extended storage, and in all retrieval, transportation and repackaging operations thereafter. In particular, it is important to determine and characterize all mechanisms that may affect the mechanical integrity of the fuel and its first containment barrier, the cladding…''

    - where to put it, the never-ending question


    Report comment

    • That works for spent fuel..

      How long do you have to wait for a 100 TON blob of corium to cool?


      Report comment

      • Radio Radio

        Good point. The cooled fuel at least can be stored in such a way for a period of time that should prevent most recriticalities from occurring, even if it stays radioactive for thousands of years, which is something, not much but something, but, that corium blob? What do you have on how the Chernobyl blob is doing, Dr. D? Weren't they recently recovering that?


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        • They are just watching the cooled corium blob at Chernobyl, as it slowly decays and gets softer, spalling off dust into the air, which then goes who knows where..

          That corium cooled rapidly due to dumping of tons of boron, lead, and etc, on top of the nuclear fire and then being mixed with sand that came from around the reactor. The 'batter' of all of these things congealed and cooled the corium as it melted through several floors of basement under the reactor.

          How did the corium at Fukushima behave? So far, it is a complete and utter cover up. No one will not go there, even when it is in open sight and on film, as in the #4 corium melt out from the building. See story link above.

          Plus, very few are willing to believe ANY melt out actually happened, even here on Enenews. That is very curious indeed. As a result, the cave of denial and cover up is very dark, and contains billions of people.

          This still does not change the consequences, or magically make radiation go away.


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          • There is currently no technology for 'recovery'. If it did exist, it would be VERY expensive. No one has the money for it.

            Thus, it is a sit and watch it policy at Chernobyl.

            Multiple melted out coriums? a cover it up and bury them, then deny anything happened policy at Fukushima.


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    • jec jec

      Dont forget VEPCO, the USA State of Virgina Nuclear Plant contractor, is hoping to extend the use of THEIR nuclear reactors to EIGHTY YEARS. Wonder if the reprocessing of all the used fuel in in THAT figure? Or will the company use the 80 years for profit taking, and wait to add funds to the SuperFund for decommissioning until year 79? What about decommissioning all the dry cask storage they have on site?


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  • dosdos dosdos

    Note to TEPCO.

    Lady luck usually gives up on those who go to great lengths to procrastinate, especially for profit.


    Report comment

  • charlie3

    If the place collapses perhaps the world will be forced to pay attention to this "cold shutdown".


    Report comment

    • Maybe it will be a cold shutdown after they get the ice wall in place, and freeze three 100 ton blobs of corium underground..

      Wonder how that will work for them?

      How many gigawatts will that take?


      Report comment

      • GQR2

        the only thing cold about any shut down at Fukushima is the cold hearted way they lie. The buildings already killed one person,in a collapse how is all the heavy equipment on the Hillside,the mush-side slanting down to the plants even going to bare the 'idea'of an ice wall.

        And who on this blue planet can stop them,this absurd project and audit it for engineering,for financing,for…. don't spew your coffee for safety? oh wait,thought for a moment there was still same sanity left on the planet. silly me. :(


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      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        You and I have used the estimate of 5,000C corium at melt-out, Dr. Goodheart.
        There is no neutron moderation from water, no cooling water in circulation around fuel pellets, no controlled geometry of fuel assemblies.
        Just a blob of molten atomic fuel.
        The criticalities are continuous.
        (Actually increasing over time, as Tokyo sewage sludge clearly shows.)
        If they are still anywhere nearby, the 3 coria remain extremely hot.
        If they are far below, water-filled corium lava tubes will still carry boiling groundwater back to the surface.
        Stop groundwater flow with an underground wall, and the temperature of the groundwater will surely rise.
        My guess is that a frozen wall cannot be established, due to the high temperature of corium and groundwater. ;)


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        • Angela_R

          Phillip, I find it very hard to get my head around the estimate of a temperature of 5000 deg C. Surely if that temperature had been reached there would be no blobs, every thing would have vapourized? The steel containment and the concrete would not exist either. The buildings are still standing…though badly damaged

          Some time ago when viewing the web cam, it looked to me as though the sea was boiling, I suspected that the mist was steam, or that i was actually 'sighting' rays; but 5000 deg C!? What is the temperature now, does anyone know…

          What atmospheric temperature could a worker withstand; how high can it go before equipment buckles and melts?


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          • Steel will vaporize at around 3000C
            Concrete, making vast assumption that it is silicone dioxide, will "boil" aka vaporize at 2230C

            http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=17487

            http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0022311585902909?np=y

            Vaporization-condensation processes can generate radioactive aerosols in the event of a core dryout and meltdown accident at a nuclear power station. The time sequence of fission produce vaporization and aerosol formation in relation to processes that can transport them out of the reactor containment is important for assessing their potential biohazard. Thermodynamics of vaporization of fission products and other materials are evaluated for the extreme environmental conditions projected by computer models if a molten core penetrates the reactor vessel and melts into the concrete base. A free energy minimization treatment was used to estimate partial pressures of gases in this many-component, multiphase system. The amounts of fission products and condensable materials vaporized were calculated for a test case involving basalt-aggregate concrete.


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  • 52Rockwell

    Im trying to not be so negative,but I have a feeling Wipp will get me fore Fukishima does. Those dirty Bobs at Andrews Tx could blow this Summer.Nasty Plutonium all over the Southwest.


    Report comment

    • Radio Radio

      52Rockwell, finally a good friend of mine moved back up north from that area but i still have some friends and family too close by. Fukushima, at least initially for the next 300 years, will effect Japan the most, but, our many nuclear problems here, all slow motion leaks or smaller explosions, all add up and with the cost cutting and farming the responsibility out to corporations who cut corners, the mothball extensions on closed nuclear facilities…yikes. Yet, being so close to Hanford AND getting the Fukushima ocean current and jet stream, i do think twice about eating those double joined fruits and vegetables i'm seeing a lot of since Fukushima. But, again, Hanford started emitting air releases about the same time, so who knows. I'm in Oregon near the river, but, there is lots of farming between here and Hanford and i buy local.


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  • 52Rockwell

    Dirty Bobs:) Dirty Bombs:)
    But Dirty Bobs work.


    Report comment

  • clamshellernh clamshellernh

    Alabama beaches closed due to shark influx — RT In motion
    http://rt.com/in-motion/165072-us-alabama-shark-beaches/
    Everything is suspect

    Sent from my F-iPad


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  • My tez at 09.06.2014 No, if anyone can stop the "Physics" from the next disaster? . I do not have the strength to tell you how you should do it … with 2-meter tunnel adjacent to one another and having a hole at the top, through which a whole this stuff will affect them, and can be removed .. This method of freezing is crazy dangerous because it can destabilize the ground beneath the reactors .. Every physicist should know that water freezes into ice, its volume increases by 10% .. why iceberg floats .. ai thanks on the road doing spring breakthroughs .. and here such a "breakthrough" they want to do the reactors, which may lead them, the 40-meter deep freeze, to improve the soil by 10%, which is 4 meters .. what happens to them, it is not difficult to foresee * as it has imagination, and not just academic titles … If someone does not know what it is ice here, please : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water .. Besides, this water accumulates on the ice must continue to have some outlet, because it is not a "black hole" … Help!

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-23940214

    Andrew

    http://forums.autosport.com/topic/74960-new-engine/page-28


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  • Cisco Cisco

    At what multiple…3X, 4X, 10X, etc. does the increase in radiation levels become meaningful?

    " Radiation levels in Albacore tuna have tripled post-Fukushima, according to Oregon State University (OSU) researchers. The scientists came to that conclusion after conducting a study on fish caught off the coast of Oregon.

    According to Delvin Neville, a graduate research assistant at OSU, these trace levels are too small to be a realistic concern. "A year of eating albacore with these cesium traces is about the same dose of radiation as you get from spending 23 seconds in a stuffy basement from radon gas, or sleeping next to your spouse for 40 nights from the natural potassium-40 in their body," said Mr. Neville. "

    http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_06_11/Post-Fukushima-radiation-levels-near-US-shores-continue-to-increase-5967/


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    • GQR2

      and it begs the question, meaningful to who? They obviously need better techniques is what i'm thinking. Got a few ridiculous comparisons to add to the list of how undangerous 3 melting down reactors are.
      sleeping next to your spouse<<<— what if you have no legal binding contract,and its common law? or a 40 day fling?
      A year of eating albacore Tuna (they are the ones funding him bet you) the same as standing in a stuffy basement for 20mins.
      HOW DO THESE PEOPLE KEEP THEIR JOBS so stupid! (because their job is to lie. lie. lie.
      what if the basement has a window? How stuffy does it have to be?
      Delvin Neville graduate research assistant is a dope. And NOAA saying "the worst is yet to come" good lord what are they waiting for. What is it going to take,who on the coast has to keel over dead. How many sick before they get real. – the medical system is already overwhelmed,nobody talks about that much.


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    • moonshellblue moonshellblue

      Naturally occurring potassium 40 is nothing like unnatural cesium134 137 strontium 90 etc this is a blatant lie used by the pro nukes but I'm sure it is a comfort to a portion of the general population. Very sad IMHO


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      • Angela_R

        Perhaps it would be better if we said, there is no natural occurring Potassium 40, there is only Potassium which has three isotopes, none of which exist naturally, independent of the other. The isotope known as K40 is only 0.012% of potassium, the two other isotopes, the 99.988% of potassium, make up the remainder. The nuclear process separates these isotopes, concentrating independent particles that never occur in nature.


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  • Nick

    It is my guess that enough radioactive material has entered the biosphere to do significant harm to vast areas of the globe.

    Everything going forward is going to be precarious, not just tomorrow, next week, but for the rest of time.

    Watch nuclear industrial stocks very closely.

    Uranium continues to be mined.

    Bombs continue to be built (the kind that aren't dirty…those are goofs).

    Water continues to be boiled and soiled by fission piles all over the planet.

    Hospitals continue to irradiate and X-ray patients.

    NASA still processes Plutonium for space probes.

    In a sense, FD-NPP and WIPP have not really changed humans' mindset very much.

    I bet 1% of humans actually understand the dire straights we are all in.


    Report comment

    • melting mermaid melting mermaid

      I'm in full on " on the beach" mode. Sucking the marrow out of life as it were. I just started reading A Year to Live. I shut my business. I don't expect to live much longer. I'm having irresponsible amounts of fun. I spend all my time with my family or alone or with y'all at enenews. I feel that every moment is precious. Its a strange calm. Before the storm I suppose. Everything is so beautiful here where I live my heart swells up like that kid in American Beauty and I am just so grateful for everything. I get angry and enraged, which y'all know because I let it all out here. Because I think yall understand. I know I'm rambling, but what would you do if you knew you only had a year to live? Quit your job, divorce your wife, travel. Try to be the hero and stop this train wreck? Jump off? Be angry or seek enlightenment? I don't know, part of me wants to start a crusade and part of me wants to enjoy what's left of my very blessed life. No one gets out of here alive after all. But then shouldn't we rage rage against the dying of the light. My brain is to fried from radionucleides and gmos and flouridated water and the 90s to figure it out.


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      • Cisco Cisco

        A secular definition…"day of reckoning"
        An unpleasant or disastrous destiny day of reckoning – an unpleasant or disastrous destiny; doom, doomsday, end of the world destiny, fate – an event (or a course of events) that will inevitably happen in the future.

        Thw days are numbered for all of us, but it will not come all at once. However, the time line will be shortened when Fuku catches fire, and it will.


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      • MM, it's a very frkin fluctuating feeling! Each day, sometimes each hour, pushes us through so many moods. Hang in there…you're in good company.

        My 10 yr old has a vague concept of bucket lists from movies, etc, although I'm sure his mom doesn't tell him the Fuki thing, more like let's go see some family. He was thrilled to go to Lego Land after the Cali fires came so close to it. Plus he got to see his dog having fun at the special dog beach. The kids are on my mind 24/7. Chokes me up.


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  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    Sounds pretty normal..have a great time while trying to change the world and always embrace the gift of life that you have been given. Enjoy the ride! :)


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  • Q: I wonder if they are going to do an "Environmental Impact Study" before building an 'ice wall'?
    A: There's no longer any reason for one. :(

    Q: Why is Ken Buesseler, an oceanographer, commenting on an 'ice wall' engineering problem?
    A: I don't know.

    IMO – His efforts and evaluations might be better spent TESTING sea life for cesium, strontium, plutonium and other radioactive contaminants and REPORTING those RESULTS in a TIMELY, easy to understand manner.


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  • ralban

    Great self sufficient home for sale in Flagstaff, AZ. No radiation or gangs. We can grow everything to survive. We just want to go spend our time with our daughter and grandson. Call 928-699-2127


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  • weeman

    If the buildings are in peril of falling down due to land subsiding, then you must make the footprint of the buildings larger, by using floating concrete and make the building more buoyant and reinforce the buildings and install concrete pilings deep into the ground?
    If their is a will their is a way, never give up.


    Report comment

    • Shaker1

      I agree, weeman. And, besides, what in hell else have they to do?

      Personally, my take after looking at what was published about the geology at the site gives me to think that the buildings were somewhat floating to begin with. Nothing down to what could be considered bedrock, right? I haven't read the transcript (I will), but I would hope the man has some qualifications other than being a 'nuclear physicist'.

      At one time I worked for physicist who employed other of his ilk. PHDs galore, and immensely intelligent, imaginative individuals who I thought much of for more than the intellectual accomplishments, but for their recognition and acceptance of humanity. (Something that I find common in those who I consider intelligent.) Anyway, the work was the mechanical manifestations of their discipline. You know, these guys certainly had the tools and understanding of principles required to be mechanical engineers, yet were woefully short of the 'sense' of such things. For instance, their first drawings for machined parts was dimensioned in fractions. When I pointed out that I worked in decimals, they began to work in decimals. But with the first decimal drawings, they asked what to do with such large decimals, as they simply converted the fractions. We then had a discussion of how truly small .0001 is. Not all those respected and considered intelligent have that 'sense' to which I refer. Understand that I'm not belittling anyone, just referencing what I consider…


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      • weeman

        I agree to a extent the buildings must have had some buoyancy by the air displacement in basements, that must be a contributing factor in the subsiding of the buildings, since they are filled with contaminated water now.
        The accomplishments of rectifying this accident will be measured in small gains, such as .0001 at a time, the road is long and filled with hazards, but we must succeed?


        Report comment

        • Shaker1

          Well, I might owe Mr. Kiode some measure of an apology, that he accepts my apology, and that I will strive to to read before I speak. Now, I only read the transcript, not listen, but in written form, he doesn't mention an ice wall. He speaks to concerns that we (and it would seem all of us here) share.
          But as for Buesseler, that might be another story, for another time.

          I'd like to see some foundation survey. You know, a boat with a hole in it floats, as long as one keeps bailing. I'm no expert, but it seems that what one would aim for is a) minimize the amount of water that comes into contact directly with any radioactive debris, b) in that minimization give some breathing room to a challenged water filtration system that may allow less to leak to the sea and some measure of recyling that doesn't reach the sea.

          I think, with some effort, that the hydrology might be somewhat controlled, as a boat with a hole also rises and falls with the surface of the waves. How much control is another question, but I believe that relies also upon the effort made. How they're going to power an ice wall is another, but such decisions and infrastructure to do that should have begun. Anyone hear of any?

          And, yes, weeman, I agree, even if at .0001 at a time. I know for a fact that I can feel a .0002 imperfection, that I can see .001, that my moustache hair is approximately .003 and they're quite prominent.


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  • Seeker

    Thank you, everyone, for your contributions here.

    Two questions:
    1. On May 26 Shimatsu said there will be a huge problem with tritium spread, and that it will reach the U.S. in 18 months. It cannot be removed from water by R.O. Once it reaches 30% of what we drink it is lethal. Anyone have any more info on this?
    2. Has anyone seen references to sending spent fuel into space? Would it be safer on satellites?

    Many thanks.


    Report comment

    • Daisy207

      Sorry to burst your bubble – but tritium started raining out here three years ago from this event. Once its in the hydrologic cycle it evaporates from the ocean along with regular water and just rains out wherever it wants to. Any one whose water supply is from a surface water source like a reservoir is already getting dosed. Reservoirs that are replenished by snow melt will get their share as well as it goes into distribution. You can't treat it out and you can't smell it. Just try and find a lab that can run the test – I'll bet you won't be able to find one or the government has simply told those that could run it not to process samples.


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    • weeman

      One of the worst nuclear accidents that occurred in the 1960,s was when a nuclear powered satellite was launched from the equator and it blew up and dispersed massive amounts of radioactive isotopes into the atmosphere, especially Africa.
      Maybe if it was launched into space with a accelerator and sent into deep space, into areas of no matter and don't even think of firing it into the sun, the solar winds could send it right back or worse?


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  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    The spent fuel issue is still not being adequately addressed at FDNPP.
    There has been no new common SFP built at the site.
    There has been no dry cask storage facility built at the site.
    SFP5&6 have not be en emptied.
    The contents of the CSFP were not emptied before 1,000+ fuel assemblies from SFP4 were added.
    The response of TEP.gov to the Fukushima Catastrophy continues to be orders of magnitude less than the situation demands.

    Not to mention the problem of three missing nuclear cores, which hasn't been addressed AT ALL!

    By the way, where did those missing cores get to, TEPCO? ;)


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  • Amidst a barrage of media reports of deteriorating conditions at Daiichi, the US Government formally encourages pregnant women and children to consume more fish:

    O’Connor, Anahad (2014, June 10). Health Officials Call for More Fish in Diets of Children and Pregnant Women. The New York Times, http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/06/10/updated-advice-on-eating-fish-during-pregnancy/?_php=true&_type=blogs&emc=edit_th_20140611&nl=todaysheadlines&nlid=32962000&_r=0

    UNBELIEVABLE!

    Tuna have already been found contaminated from Fukushima fallout. Kelp in the US was contaminated by March and April rain in 2011.

    The government refuses to conduct widespread testing for radionuclides despite spiking contamination in sea water off Daiichi in late 2013.

    Sources and analysis here:
    http://majiasblog.blogspot.com/2014/06/unbelievable-us-government-promotes.html

    Despite uncertainty about contamination, the US government is promoting consumption of fish for pregnant women and children.

    Oh my gosh, the banality of evil.


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    • Ontological Ontological

      All the Mercury in fish they already knew about, so yes deliberate FED action to poison children. Money is all these idiots know or want.


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    • Jebus

      Disgusting. They tell them that tilapia is safe. It's fish meal.

      The same playbook as the Japanese. The same agenda.

      Share the pain. Spread it throughout the human population.

      Average it out to obscurity. Cover everyone, no one stands out.

      No clusters. No good data. Nothing to show. No one can know.

      Meanwhile the populations quality of life plummets.

      The broken babies dissapear. The grief goes unanswered.

      The cancer is your fault. Your childs lukemia is unexplained.

      Collectively humans will accept this. Even when it is their child.

      It's disgusting, how far we've travelled, away from the garden…


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  • Dick Shenary

    Perhaps the federal government knows just how adulterated our meat supply currently is and they just assume that the radiation tainted fish would be better than having meat. Welcome to the world of the incredible shrinking diet.


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    • Scary thought.

      I would think meat contamination by radionuclides would be less than fish because bio-magnification is faster in the ocean. Moreover, Fukushima contamination has been greater in the ocean, than on land.

      That said, its possible arsenic and lead contamination are greater in land animals. A biochemist I know is studying these elements in the rattlers (he doesn't kill the snake – he can get enough samples just by looking for road-kill).

      Who knows what else is in our meat since no data are made available to the public, who largely lack access to laboratory testing.

      We know meat is full of hormones and antibiotics unless you eat organic (and who knows what's happening in the organic meat market).

      Bio-magnification is reduced by eating lower on the food chain.


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  • Dick Shenary

    Eating as low as possible on the food change is fast becoming a survival strategy. Vegetarians in the future will likely live longer and have a greater evolutionary advantage. (Less DNA damage) I suspect this has always been the case. Sorry berger and fish and chip lovers but playing atomic roulette carries a price to be paid.


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  • Dick Shenary

    Make that "food chain" instead of food change although food change is happening also.


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  • sworldpeas sworldpeas

    imho it is inevitable that they will run out of time before one of these pools takes a dump. They need 600,000 liquidators working on ALL the pools. The slow pace and lack of people will insure that these pools will dump their load, it's only a matter of time.

    in the meantime we can still haiku…

    Plutonium Charms
    They're magically shillicious
    FREE charger inside


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  • Sol Man

    They, and their agents, are ghouls.


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  • Seeker

    I listened to Shimatsu May 26 again. At about 35 minutes in he starts talking about a recent new dumping of huge amounts of tritium (from a build up of it at Fukushima) into the ocean. He says it tends to form "fog" but a fog that is white like smoke. He says the ocean plume of tritium will reach the U.S. in abut 18 months, and people on the coast should look for this kind of fog and report it. Once tritium and deterium (sp?) reach 30 % of drinking water (it CANNOT be filtered out), it is lethal.

    @Daisy Please do not say I have been in a bubble. How would you even know that? How would you know what help I have been trying to offer since 3-11? In these final times we need to be kind to each other.


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  • nuknomore nuknomore

    It would seem those of us on the west coast of America and living in the northern hemisphere are the ones at greatest risk..
    The jet stream will just keep sending it our way.
    Yet, nothing is being said in main stream media..
    I get on here every day to find out if the fuel pool is still standing.
    That this threat looms. And there is so much silence.
    Is just creepy.


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    • hbjon hbjon

      Do you want them to use your money printing machines to monetize the debt caused by such a humongous disaster? I didn't think so. I say dig a trench along the entire west coast of America for the radon and other heavy gases to sink into, collect them into bottles, and ship them back to Japan.


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  • 500 dirty bombs on the WIPP, shake one up, heat it up, and 499 dirty bombs on the WIPP……


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  • tsfw tsfw

    I wish they'd shut up about this stupid ice wall they knew wouldn't work from the beginning. They were never, and are never building an ice wall. It's false hope for the masses.


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  • mutante mutante

    Would it be possible to:
    1. Dig/build a gigantic, deep cask with all of the necessary linings, which would be large enough to hold all of the remnants of reactors 1-3 & the sfp of reactor 4 that is nearby the reactors' site.
    2. Create a mammoth hydraulic digger claw that could scoop up massive chunks of reactors in one scoop.
    Return claw Arm over gigantic deep cask & put remnants in this mausoleum.
    3. Continue process until whole site is put into this mausoleum.
    4. Appropriately cover it.

    I am neither a scientist, nor an engineer. So if this idea sounds ridiculous, I apologize.


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    • We would go insane if we didn't also picture solutions, no matter how ridiculous they might sound….it's all we have left to keep from being sucked into 100% depression mode.


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      • WesternKyMan

        I honestly have to believe at this time that the point of no return has been crossed. If the Japanese government had thrown everything they could at this right after it happened…then maybe they could have mitigated it somewhat, at a cost of human lives who worked on the project.

        But they didn't.

        The years roll by and I am still watching some sort of perverted version of whack-a-mole that Tepco is playing. Wait til they construct the ice wall (if they ever do) and see what problems pop out of freezing the ground in such a large area.

        I no longer see or can fathom a way to either fix it or even entomb it.

        As far as Fukushima goes, the fat lady started sing a long time ago.


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        • unincredulous unincredulous

          Best thing they can do at Fukushima is to open a bottle of botox, a really really big bottle and just slather it all over everything. Sunken reactors, etc. won't even be noticed.Preserve appearances at least until the 2020 Olympics.


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    • mutante mutante

      I know it sounds pretty naive. I don't have enough of a knowledge base to go beyond very
      simplistic ideas when it comes to this type of problem solving. Thank you ,LastChants Teri. I just pictured
      a massive claw ripping up that sorry mess & returning it on an armature/ track to a huge properly-designed pit, unlike WIPP.
      Just drawing with ideas popping in out of head.


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      • unincredulous unincredulous

        Makes me picture this cookoo clock. Mad nuclear scientists trotting out on a track, spreading death and destructive radioactive nasties, lying on the hour, getting a handful of cash and then disappearing back into the clock, while the birds on top of the clock slowly sicken and die.


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        • mutante mutante

          That is one of the funniest things that I have heard in quite some time.!! I mean I can see it!
          It is a very accurate analogy to this sad situation. I can't help laughing because I have a bit of
          dark humor. At times you need to laugh inorder to not just lay down & never get back up again :-)


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    • nuknomore nuknomore

      I thought of this too Mutante.
      It doesn't seem so far fetched when you look at the massive things that are done today. Islands being built, Bridges, roads built in underwater tunnels, huge sky scrapers, underground facilities etc.
      Why not dig DEEP and try to surround this with cement and create a huge container?
      Divert the underground stream.
      Pump the cement in with pipes..
      It makes more sense than an ice wall ! :(
      I can't imagine how a ice wall could do anything but create a huge swimming pool of sloshy ground!


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      • mutante mutante

        Great to hear, nuknomore. I am glad that someone else had the same vision. The ice wall seems too complex & maintenance riddled.
        Just scoop up that giant Pyle of radioactive crap & put it in a giant whole that is so well constructed that it will never leech out into environment. Maybe rough handling of that shit might cause criticality, I don't know. But it needs to be put in giant iron-clad( for lack of better words) non-leeching pit.


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  • Angela_R

    "The US Secretary of State John Kerry, launched a new global effort
    on Wednesday to save oceans "under siege' from over-fishing, plastic pollution and climate change."

    "Increasingly the ocean is threatened," Kerry told a small group of reporters at the State Department. "The world's oceans, as vast as they are, as much as they elicit a sense of awe for size and power, they are under siege."

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jun/11/john-kerry-ocean-conservation-summit

    and when will they face up to what is happening in the atmosphere? I guess like here they will divert; it will be attributed to carbon dioxide and cosmic radiation.


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  • QUESTION: They wouldn't nuke us all would they?
    ANSWER: Yes. Quite emphatically – Yes! (And, they are, right now).

    Nuclear bomb nearly detonated after falling on North Carolina – declassified report
    Published time: June 11, 2014 15:33
    Edited time: June 12, 2014 09:41
    http://rt.com/usa/165364-nuclear-bomb-near-detonated-carolina/

    "In a scenario that could’ve been extremely devastating, the United States narrowly averted a nuclear disaster in 1961 when an atomic bomb nearly detonated after falling out of a B-52 bomber that broke up in the sky.

    According to the Washington Post, the incident took place on January 21, 1961 – less than 20 years after nuclear bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki – and is explained further in a recently declassified report published by the National Security Archives.

    When the US Air Force aircraft went into a tailspin and broke up, the two bombs fell towards Goldsboro, North Carolina. The parachute for one of the weapons failed to deploy, and the plane crash had actually pushed the bomb into “armed” mode by the time it hit the ground. Luckily for North Carolina, the plane’s destruction also damaged the switch necessary to trigger detonation."


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  • Nick

    Humans.

    Are we now in an era when, since the world is toxified by decaying atoms to such an extent, that nuclear weapons are OKAY to use?

    Are we going to witness nuclear terror?

    Is this the apex of creation?

    I suggest all weapons and nuclear electric stocks be devalued to about .0000000001 cent.

    The entire nuclear cycle is worth that much.

    I know boys have to have their toys, but we have got to evolve away from this horrid technology.

    Atoms for Peace, my ass.


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    • GQR2

      good to see it has over a hundred thousand shares too sad for words,Maybe this is the day, that something breaks truly viral for FukuShhh! Got the Solar Shocks on the way maybe that will make people more receptive? naw, not likely but its a wild hope. We needed mass awareness yesterday. But any old time now would due. Come on Mass Awareness!

      Here lizard lizard.

      It's Gozilla!


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    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

      tsfw, Great Video and must be shared with all. These people all need to be arrested and tried for crimes against humanity and the video plainly shows that this Nuclear Industry is a nightmare and all of it (Nuclear Power Worldwide) must be banned immediately!

      We (The World Citizens) have Morons in charge! :(


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  • hbjon hbjon

    Over three years and this can still be considered the beginning of the beginning. When all the human activity ceases to exist in Japan, we will begin the end of the beginning. Sorry for any lack of attempted humor here. I can remember when attempts at humor were forbidden.


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    • SadieDog

      "In a statement, the utility hailed the deployment of the robot as “a major milestone” ahead of full-scale decontamination and the eventual removal of damaged nuclear fuel from the reactor."


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      • mutante mutante

        It's good that they have a working robot, but I think that you need the Space Giants,Space Boy,
        Ultra-man, the transformers, and mr. Gadget in order to begin a legitimate effort @ cleaning up
        something that is perpetually spilling.


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    • SadieDog

      "A senior US official is hailing a basic energy plan recently adopted by the Japanese government. The plan calls nuclear power a key energy source.

      US Deputy Secretary of Energy Daniel Poneman gave an interview to NHK in Tokyo on Thursday.

      Poneman commented on the plan approved by the Cabinet in April. It describes nuclear power as an important, base-load source.

      Poneman says Washington agrees with Tokyo, and regards nuclear power as valuable in efforts to cut carbon dioxide emissions.

      He expressed hope of further promoting technical collaboration between the US and Japanese governments, as well as private companies. He noted both countries have a high number of nuclear plants.

      Japan and the US have strong ties in the nuclear power industry. Private nuclear-related firms from the two countries operate in what can be seen as consortiums. They are leading work to build nuclear plants around the globe.

      Tokyo and Washington encourage the use of nuclear power for peaceful purposes."


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