NBC: US officials “hid concerns… as Fukushima melted’ — CIA told nuclear regulator that blast was hydrogen, experts then noted “no evidence to support” this theory

Published: March 11th, 2014 at 11:11 am ET


NBC News, Mar. 10, 2014: ‘U.S. Nuclear Agency Hid Concerns, Hailed Safety Record as Fukushima Melted

  • The NRC spokespeople sometimes had trouble following the public debate, because for days their computers were blocked by security rules from accessing Twitter and YouTube.
  • [David McIntyre, Mar. 12, 2011:] Just saw an incoherent discussion on cnn by Bill Nye the science guy who apparently knows zilcho about reactors and an idiot weatherman who said Hydrogen explosion? Pfft. I’m not buying it.
  • His boss sent back the following reply, correcting the staffer and explaining plans to ask the Obama administration to help blunt critical news coverage.
  • [Eliot Brenner, Mar. 12, 2011:] There is a good chance it was a hydrogen explosion that took the roof off that building, though we are not saying that publicly. […] I have just reached out to CNN and asked them to call (former NRC Chairman Nils) Diaz, and reached out to push the white house yet again to start talking on background or getting out in front of some of this crap.

Nuclear Regulatory Commission (pdf): Unit 1 explosion […] CIA suggested hydrogen explosion, no evidence to support.

See also: [intlink id=”fukushima-boss-after-311-no-3-reactor-just-blew-probably-a-steam-explosion-see-steam-explosion-not-hydrogen-reactor-blew-up-not-reactor-building” type=”post”]{{empty}}[/intlink]

Published: March 11th, 2014 at 11:11 am ET


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166 comments to NBC: US officials “hid concerns… as Fukushima melted’ — CIA told nuclear regulator that blast was hydrogen, experts then noted “no evidence to support” this theory

  • Socrates

    "(G)etting out in front of some of this crap…"

    "Crap" is the truth.

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    Information about actual developments at Fukushima were considered as "crap" by NRC regulators, who thought only in terms of mounting a public relations effort to blunt the ongoing discussion of the Unit1 explosion. Still the NRC position, BTW.

    NRC: Can't you understand that nuclear energy died the moment Unit3 blew sky high? 😉

  • corium pudding corium pudding

    Okay, just throwing this out there. Freeze the damn place. And I don't mean "underground ice wall." Turn the reactors into a kitchen freezer. Dump in water. Let it turn into ice. Ice = water. Water shields radiation. Less radiation means workers can do more meaningful work more safely. Things then get better. Better is good.

    • weeman

      You cannot freeze radiological agents, they produce there own heat, even if you could achieve absolute zero it would not stop the chain reaction, at the quantium level it does not follow the normal laws of nature.
      More educated people on site maybe able to explain fully?

      • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

        Classical vs. Quantum Mechanics
        “Classical mechanics consists of the work done in the areas of chemistry and physics prior to the 20th century. This includes the organization of the periodic table, thermodynamics, the wave theory of light, and Newtonian mechanics. Quantum mechanics was born out of the inability of classical mechanics to reconcile theory with experiment. …
        ” Classical mechanics accurately describes most systems that can be easily observed. Objects that are a ‘normal’ size (larger than a molecule and smaller than a planet), at a "normal" temperature (anywhere close to roomtemp), going a normal speed (0 m/s- anything significantly less than the speed of light) fit the models set forth in classical mechanics. It is only when the system being observed begins to violate these parameters that quantum factors come into play. An important aspect of the quantum mechanical models is the fact that as the conditions approach ‘normal’ the quantum mechanical model approaches the classical model….”

        • AirSepTech AirSepTech

          You can't freeze decay, but you can freeze water, radioactive water. As in radioactive snow.

          My question is 'how radioactive?' As in bq/l at -320f.

          I am short in nuke engineering, long in cryogenics.

          • We Not They Finally

            Isn't some part of this not just radioactively hot, but thermally hot? And it's POURING into the ocean. And we can't freeze the ocean. Plus water does NOT shield radiation (corium pudding above). Radioactive water is HIGHLY destructive. Starts with the plankton and works its way on up through the food chain.

            Is this just another (with all the best intentions in the world, "Just do this," or "Just do that"? Not a scientist here, no, but even laypeople cannot grasp any viable framework for this.

          • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

            The 3, 4, or 5 coria are already so deep in the ground that there is no way to freeze anything that deep. Corium also travels horizontally as well. So already spread out too far to find a wall. They there is the radioactivity of the corium. No one and no robot can get close enough to work there.

            Also the refrigeration will use vast amounts of fossil fuels which Japan doesn't have.

          • weeman

            Water is a moderator so I presume ice is to?
            Thermal hot why do you think I was looking for the temp of water in harbor and the wells they have installed, never seen a temp from bore hole, I would not expect to see extreme temps but elevated temp and if you know the volume, a lot could be deducted?

      • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

        “…The theory that proton–proton reactions were the basic principle by which the Sun and other stars burn was advocated by Arthur Stanley Eddington in the 1920s. At the time, the temperature of the Sun was considered too low to overcome the Coulomb barrier. After the development of quantum mechanics, it was discovered that tunneling of the wavefunctions of the protons through the repulsive barrier allows for fusion at a lower temperature than the classical prediction….”

      • fireguyjeff fireguyjeff

        The answer to your question is sort of elusive.
        There is no black and white answer.

        Older debris at the site could easily be suspended in ice.
        The radioactive particulates would not freeze at the
        atomic level, they could still be kept suspended in ice.
        Not a big deal.

        Same goes for the warm stuff.
        Just need more energy input to the refrigeration gear to offset
        the heating.

        The newer material would likely require an absurd amount of
        energy expended on refrigeration in order to maintain ice

        "Cooling" the corium is not worth my time to try to explain in terms of the absurdness of the idea.

        What many here who have presented the idea of freezing everything
        at Fuku simply do not comprehend is freshman physics and/or 1st year thermodynamics. Even if we could build the capability to freeze most or all of the nasty stuff at Fuku, the financial cost for the energy input to operate such a system would be enormous.

        Never mind the many decades of keeping it running nearly 24/7.

        What I noticed from those who want to freeze Fuku is that the poor
        efficiency of refrigeration systems has not been considered.
        The cooling system (condenser) for the refrig cycle would be very large and expensive too.

        I have avoided the freezing topic here because it is too close to
        the idea of perpetual motion machines.
        Sort of like trying to negotiate a conversation with some one with Tourette syndrome.

        • name999 name999

          Wall Street Journal. 3.8.14 by M. IATA
          "The company (TEPCO) together with the government is trying to block groundwater from flowing under the plant by using a still unproven subterranean
          ice shield."

          The article goes on to describe a 3 phase clean up plan in which …
          "The final phase the reactors will be torn down and the land will be cleaned."

          Suggests ice shield is being used now.

          Right, the land will be cleaned…yeah, sure.

          • name999 name999

            wrote this post on the run, the author of the article in

    • Socrates

      "Just" is a work that precedes a statement that usually offers an oversimplification of an issue. What would happen if the reactor cores and the spent fuel pools were dumped into the ocean? I thought of that initially. Lacking any expertise, I would offer the following reasons not to do that it it can be avoided.

      I'll bet that the salt water would corrode the metals and the radionuclides would go into solution. The atmosphere would pick up radionuclides in evaporation. You would then have inhalation and skin absorbsion, deposition to ground, crop deposition and uptake. There would be shoreline exposure, aquatic food ingestion, irrigation…

      Nanoparticles form with Buckballs that are transported by currents.

      We live in a closed system.

      • corium pudding corium pudding

        Dumping into ocean at least gives you a chance to pick up the crap (water = radiation shield). It's going there anyway, just more slowly.

        • Socrates

          Castles made of sand slip into the sea… eventually.

          – Jimi Hendrix


          @corium pudding: if I'm reading you right, you're suggesting that the coriums be drawn out to sea and subsequently contained. I think you've hit upon a solution! To date, every-other suggestion does nothing to eliminate the long-term impact on the environment. Yours does! If ever a Nobel Prize was deserved, you just earned it. The whole idea is counter-intuitive but intuition tells me, it'd work. During the first few weeks after 311, I suggested using enclosed trenches to access the (then accessible) coriums from the easterly side of the facilities. That time's long passed. However, it's likely the coriums have reached temperature equilibrium with their surrounding environment and are no longer moving downwards. If this _is_ the case, then there's a good chance they could be 'safely' accessed from the western (ocean) side. There are a lot of logistics (locating, equipment and process control) that would require ironing-out. But working within a surrounding body of water would be far more practical.

          My hat's off to you!!! I hope 'they' are paying attention…

          • corium pudding corium pudding

            Actually, I got the idea from here:


            (Sorry it's not a proper link, but I'm not sure how you do links on this site.)

            Go to the last paragraph. It was mentioned by Christopher Busby.

            • corium pudding corium pudding

              Links happen automatically when you cut and paste the URL. Cool.


              great article, corium pudding. However, he only touches lightly on what we're discussing. Final paragraph suggests 'bombing' the coriums (excavated slide) into the sea, to cool them down for "picking up" and disposal. I get the idea but think the use of explosives must be approached with much consideration for what unwanted geological impact they would have. I'm thinking low-level use of explosive to create guide paths that would then direct the coreums into waiting containers. The containers would be designed to be cooled by surrounding water. The major issue is with the surrounding geological conditions. The area is highly unstable and wouldn't be the best place for long-term storage of these containers. Much would require initial study. Then again, there's always a possibility that the containers could be made small enough to accept 'pieces' of the coriums and then moved while submerged by barges to more geologically stable regions. Lots of logistics…

              • Shaker1

                My unqualified mind takes some issues with this. I'll give you my thoughts…

                It may be rather moot at this point, but I had a problem with the explosion idea in any form but controlled demolition precisely because of the dispersal problem. Let it fall in on itself, but one takes the chance, in particular with the inventory of the SFPs, of creating forms that may invite more than the minor criticalities we might seen in the 'blobs' and their scattering, especially initially, open air, not just holes and tunnels. There is some measure of inventory within control, and it should stay that way. There is also the proximity of the common SFP with its great inventory.

                My idea of the water has never been to do anything but limit mobility of any large mass of molten material, never to control fissioning of the material, but to keep it in place. I believe that the Soviets got their 'blob' under some control from the accretion of the materials that they dumped on it, sand, lead, whatever. It increases the mass and surface area available to forming a skin that hampers flow, and they did not throw water at it allowing some stability in the heat within the blob, rather than allowing it to expand and contract with cycles of hot and cold. Heat isn't the problem; water in contact with the mass is a problem.

                Running past word count, so I'll continue…

                • Shaker1

                  Again, unqualified, but some idea should have been advanced of letting the corium turn into essentially a radioactive geode. Allow it to accrete material. It's just volume, not more radioactivity…

                  • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                    problem, Shaker1, when discussing the coriums, is in the endless pollution they 'infuse' into the surrounding/passing water. While I had pointed out the hazards in using explosives near the SFPs several months ago, when-and-if the coreums are located, charges could be used within the ocean to excavate a set of trenches that lead towards the renegade coreums. Of course, I reiterate the call for study of the surrounding geological formations and requisite logistics. The surrounding body of water (ocean) is already being heavily exposed to Fuku-effluents. If the coreums can be exposed and guided towards waiting casks, the interim period of increased exposure would be far more acceptable than allowing them to remain. Of course, such attempts at 'recovery' would be contingent on their resting (coreums) proximity to the plant-complex. If they're too close to ground-level structures, then your objections would remain in effect…

                    • Shaker1

                      I think it's too late now for too much of anything like I described. And I meant to type more, but a friend stopped by, and I just submitted what I did as continuance. Honestly, I really think that despite all the research into these types of accidents, they may have come up with a phrase to describe worst-case, went 'oh, my god!' and said 'we can't let this happen', but no more. As I said, heat isn't the problem, but the water, allowing material that disassociates itsef a carrier.

                      Again, unqualified, but I've had drops of molten metal fall on my skin, and what it does is create a hole with hard sides until it cools enough. (Never pleasant, and if one wants it to heal right, that dead 'hole' has to go. But it seems to me that if it remained a molten mass, it would create its own 'container' as it melted down, and as long as the fused sides kept some intergrity, any water ingress could have more easily collected as steam, rather than as flow. I can just imagine how soggy it is in Unit 1's 'tent'. Design of containment itself isn't based on an idea such as this. I'll admit it's just talk.

                      Tepco, at the beginning, and it's understandable, had a scenario that began with preserving assets that quickly defaulted to 'oh, my god!' without management or precedent for any guide. What a mess! But it still sticks in my craw that those turbine buildings and stuff are still there, that they deal with all this extraneous stuff and property that could be put to…

                    • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                      several of us, Shaker1, discussed what we called 'coreum induced fumerals' in the later part of 2011. The discussion centered around speculation to how a particular coreum might interact with the surrounding geology. Due to a paucity of information, we limited the speculation to what we thought would happen when the coreum(s) found its way into naturally occurring (subterranean) fumerals. We mostly concluded that the proximity of these fumerals to adjacent water bodies (ocean fed aquifers) would eventually slow or outright limit their travel. Some speculated the coreum(s) could be thousands of meters below sea level. Obviously, none of 'us' knows for sure. Regardless of the guiding influences, if they've paused or stopped (simmering) at a large enough heat sink source, there is a chance that they can be 'lassoed'. Doubtless, a crash program would be in order if they've paused in their travels…

                  • weeman

                    Even Einstein was unqualified and Steven Hawkins is in a infinite loop.

                • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

                  Bombing will only make a terrible catastrophe even worse. And Japan is already sinking into the ocean and there are numerous active volcanoes close by. And why ensure even more radionuclides become airborne and floating and wind borne to the rest of the northern hemisphere?

                  • AFTERSHOCK AFTERSHOCK

                    read closer VanneV and you may discover a far more nuanced approached is being suggested, than mere "bombing". I've also stated, any-such approach must be guided by a thorough understanding of the area's geology and adjacent ocean bed. It's eventually going to get down to deciding what can be done, if anything can be. In what took only a very short time, the entire Pacific is now at risk of becoming a dead sea. It's either cap-off the area (which will do nothing to prevent underground contamination of the water), seal-off the surrounding terrain (which still does nothing to end the pollution of what water will be used to cool the coreums), or, undertake the process of 'safely' accessing and (possibly) relocating the coreums. I'm all about what can be done safely and not what can't be done. Future generations (that may survive this nightmare) will ask, "So…just what was done?!" Ignoring the possibility of a comprehensive response to this nightmare, is no longer an option…

          • We Not They Finally

            Aftershock and corium pudding: You're saying just A) locate and isolate the coriums (well, no, you didn't say that — did you just skip that part?); B) lure the monster out to sea and it will shed its fangs and teeth because C) it's in water; and D) explosives will surely "guide" the monster into "containers"; and I don't even want to look at E, F and G.

            Just PLEASE, Aftershock, hold off on your suggestion to award the Nobel Prize to corium pudding! Please!!

          • 21stCentury 21stCentury

            ~~~Build a Bigger Breakwater~~~

            Open-air Reactor… (underwater – Cerenkov pool)
            After a bigger breakwater is built, then is when it makes sense to operate Fukushima as one large spent fuel pool inside several concentric rings of impoundment & containment with reconcentration filtration.

            Use nano-graphene electrodialysis filtration to reconcentrate and extract the dissolved radioisotopes during desalination.

            Air-management with capacitive deionization with static-electricity charged graphene-aerogel supercapacitor filtration.


              like your can-do attitude, 21stCentury. Upon cursory review, your idea does have merit. There are issues of longevity (how long it'd remain operational) and durability (resistance to natural and/or manmade challenges, i.e., hurricanes and errant shipping tankers). Still, you're one of the few that's offering any kind of a viable solution. Hat's off to you…

        • We Not They Finally

          "Water = radiation shield"? Where DO you get your information?

          This is painful. However well-meaning you may be, this is painful.

          • AirSepTech AirSepTech

            This has gotten out of context to the original statement.

            Water is a shield to radiation, Understand the designs of SFP's.

      • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

        Surely/certainly a closed system concerning Manmade Nuclear Radiation Contamination.. 🙁

    • weeman

      Water is unique in that freezes from the top down all other liquids freeze from the bottom up?

    • rogerthat

      ha ha yes freeze, build new nuclear power plant to supply enough electricity.

    • Dr. Anne Lee Tomlinson Maziar VanneV

      Water isn't a radiation shield. And it doesn't "dilute" the radiation either.

      Water moderates the nuclear fission so that more neutrons join the chain reaction, not less. Why do you think they put concrete below the corium at Chernobyl? To prevent another nuclear detonation.

      “…To control such a nuclear chain reaction, neutron poisons and neutron moderators can change the portion of neutrons that will go on to cause more fission.[1] Nuclear reactors generally have automatic and manual systems to shut the fission reaction down if monitoring detects unsafe conditions.[2]
      “Commonly-used moderators include regular (light) water (in 74.8% of the world's reactors),…”

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    Looking on CNN.com for their Fukushima Third Anniversary article,
    And found one on cancer instead.

    Here is how it begins:
    "In 16 years, cancer will become the leading cause of death in the United States, surpassing heart disease, according to a new report from the American Society of Clinical Oncology. The number of new cancer cases is expected to increase nearly 45% by 2030, from 1.6 million cases to 2.3 million cases annually."

    Was Fukushima radiation included in these projections? Probably not.
    Will these projections turn out to be low? Probably so.
    Should I leave a link?
    Probably should, but won't.
    CNN dot com, Health, 3/11/2014.

    Move to the country. Build a greenhouse. Aquaponics or hydroponics. Grow your own and make your own. Study herbal healing. Stay away from nuke plants. No plastics. 🙂

    Now, where is that Fukushima article? 😉

    • I did that, moved to the country
      Started building the green house yesterday.

      Got great water resources at the headwaters of a major river, and an elevated sloped lot for the house, good drainage, no flooding.

      But those pesky nuke plants…I guess I will have to shut them all down.


      • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

        In the country and doing the same.. 🙂

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        stock, you are very wise to move to the country and build on a slope for good drainage. Flooding is widespread with climate change. When my old lady retires, we will be heading away from the cities.

        Handpump in addition to electric water pump.
        Wood heat.
        Thromb wall on south facing side can heat your home 100% on cold but sunny winter days.
        "Plug and play solar."
        Buy a smaller house than you think you'll need.
        Buy a greenhouse kit, split it in two. Mount each half on a south-facing wall, or build an insulated north-facing wall. (Doubles growing area.)
        Steps for plants rise toward back wall of greenhouse.

        Good luck, stock. Please update us on your progress. 🙂

        • Socrates

          My "old lady" likes ballet, art and opera although she is retiring next year. she detests rural life. I always knew opera would kill me one way or the other. That keeps me from living off of the grid. We are getting some beehives on the property. I do organic gardening. Limited space for a greenhouse or hydroponics. I can outsource those functions for now.

          I wish I had a well. Used to have one at the headwaters of Soquel Creek in Santa Cruz in the mountains but could never manage to develop the property. Being away from children and grandchildren is too hard. Rainbow steelhead run and spawn there. My water witch and wildcatter douser died of prostate cancer from living in Marin and San Jose, he said.

          My fate is to shelter in place 3 miles from Torrey Pines State Park. That was my dream until Fukushima and SONGS.

          • I'm the "old lady" in my household. I like ballet (once danced for the Tulsa Civic, when Mocelyn Larkin and Roman Jasinsky were in charge), art (several artists in the fam) and opera too. Get all I need with a 40-minute drive to town, which is the 'hippie artist supercenter of Amerika' with more artists than you can shake a stick at, everywhere, all the time. Many of them come to my extremely rural homestead regularly for breathing space, as do our many artist friends from all over the country.

            …and when I say "extremely rural," I mean as far as humans can possibly go into the deep forest wilderness and be allowed to legally live. §;o)

            • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

              Joy, My goal is to be outside my home in the evening, listen carefully, and not hear any traffic noise. 🙂

            • Socrates


              I didn't know you were ballet dancer. My wife danced in Munich, trained by a Russian. Louis 14 started the whole thing. Men in tights…

              Sat through Wagner's Ring Cycle. That opera has much to say about Wall Street and Fukushima.

              A four-star hotel is camping to my wife.

          • Yeah, I get those rainbow steelhead in Lake Michigan, very tasty, big or small, almost exactly like a Salmon, DNA wise. Great cooked, smoked, grilled, fried, dehydrated.

        • I don't have the backup pump yet, but will by end of summer.

          I have bought the full on top quality Outback PV with backup batteries, need to install. Waiting for real Spring.

          House is the right size, whilst everyone else is building new McMansions…hard to heat, hard to clean, silly ego pumping insanity.

          House is south facing…didnt know how smart that was when I bought it! Will put in a sun room/greenhouse on the south side, and as you enter even in winter, will be greeted by lush plants.

          I am also installing a "light box" in the home office, 32 flourescent lamps for growing herbs in winter, and prestarting the garden in pre-spring (now). It will also be really bright, to kick back the Seasonal Affective Disorder, and nothing wasted, the waste heat will be useful.

          Friend came over yesterday to help prep the salmon boat (yes I will be testing them for rads) and said, hey, where did that wood stack go….sheesh, we got really good at fireplace heating of house with heat exchanger. Got wood heat down pat, and used only 1/4 of my "stack", the rest is stored in a large fenced backyard area that is protected by 2 German Shepherds.
          Seperate 500gal LPG tank also…off the grid for heat, water, sewer, and soon electric.

          Softener and RO system on the well, for super pure water.

          Fun stuff, and in an upside down world, it sure feels right. Walk the walk if you really believe it.

      • sayonara kitty sayonara kitty

        @ stock… married? lol

    • jcfougere jcfougere

      Exactly Phil,

      Just ordered $200 worth of heirloom seed, building a greenhouse(and top-bar bee-hives) and moving rural in 3 weeks. Getting off the West Coast, heading inland.

      • Excellent, walk the walk!

        • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

          Joy, Socrates, stock: My goal is to be outside my home in the evening, listen carefully, and not hear any traffic noise. 🙂

          PS: My old lady is OK with the move from the city, but insists on being "in town". I will try to stretch that definition a good bit before settling on a purchase.

          • Got a house for sale 2 doors down, same water resources, around 2 or 3 acres, house and outbuilding, south facing greenhouse/sunroom already built. 7 to 12 minutes of driving gets you any shopping that you could want. 30 minutes of driving gets you to world class symphony, museums, art, zoos. 40 minutes gets you to a major airport.

            30 minutes gets you to world class fishing. They want $350k, been up for 5 months, probably take $320 my guess.

            • Socrates

              Sounds great!

              The West Coast is going to. (Is being) hit. Living three miles inland is not far enough away.The food is going to have cesium 137 deposition.

              Bought Biophysics for Dummies to read up on radiation formulas. First, avoid t&e exposures, second learn how to chelate it out. Cannot get most of it out of your lungs.

              Thanks nuclear! You ruined North America!

          • zogerke zogerke

            Jealous of you all. Kids in family in high school, very attached to program, just a few years left for them to finish. And my work in safety is taking off, working to build an education center, filling a needed niche here in this city, real work is a blessing. Would love to get off the grid but my work is in the middle of a city. And how long can i last here, and when does it become paramount to move, with CPM readings at 42 on a low day? Hmmmmmmm.

          • You can do a lot on just a few acres. Which is all I've got of cleared land, the rest in thick southern Appalachian mixed hardwood and conifer forest. Terraced, as the ~26 acres (more or less, which is how they map seriously graded land) is nowhere near flat except right on the creeks – both sides of the ridge – and even that's definitely aimed downhill. Working on sluicing from the high end to the spring house to power a wheel, pump the spring water to a 500-gallon cistern above the cabin so we can get gravity feed and do away with that energy hogging 220 sump pump now pumping 250' uphill at pressure. Pipe the overflow to the new duck pond as a bit of waterfall. Am planting pumpkins in the drain field below the outlet…

            Have apple, peach, pear and cherry trees (cherries in bloom now!), muscadine, concord and zinfandel grapes, a beautiful herb and rose bricked garden above half an acre of vegetable terraces. Will add a hoop greenhouse and porch scree/green room right after we finish paying off the mortgage later this year and buy those plug-n-play solar panels. Duke doubled our electric bill this year to pay for their bad nuke adventures (plus profit), $260 a month for a 28-foot square chestnut cabin. We heat with wood. Screw 'em!

            • Gasser Gasser

              All that you folks talked about I did 30 years back leaving behind city life with the feeling of I'm not of their world and created my own organic world, unfortunately what I left behind exploded! raining particulate matter down/in/through my world, which has now made it invisibly deadly, I now reel with quantum leap though's to envision a new escape world to create, after all, reality goes at the speed and quality of freewill choices.

              I've logically/factually recognize we've quickly poisoned ourselves/planet to the point of no~return<~~> Now @ 73 my next world is the exit world, seeing no solution’s, I've made way to dirt nap forever on my times choosing…mean while I'm letting it all hang out in my street and dirt bikes world…you riders out there know, that's the best world.

              • So sorry to hear that, Gasser. You were ahead of all of us! We chose this location very purposefully. Closest nukes upwind of us are Oak Ridge and Savanna River, both more than 200 miles. Continental divide between us and them, we're less than 5 miles as the crow flies so much contamination coming east skips over us before coming down again.

                Used to be a cove, cut off back in the 1930s when Norfolk Southern replaced its "8th Wonder of the World" trestles with megatonnage of rock after a big wash off the Blacks (Mt. Mitchell) washed 'em out. 200-300 feet tall, 50 yards thick at the bottom end. Not the steepest grade over the eastern divide, but one of only two and still in commercial use. Having spent years in Oklahoma long ago, I liked the idea that if a twister wants us, it'd have to drop down literally right on top of us on purpose. Because it would never make it over the wall on its own. And while we have been 'jumped' a couple of times over the years, even if we were to get a drop-down there's a fully earth-sheltered bathroom to hide in downstairs… §;o)

            • JoyB, there is some tricky but simple device that uses water flow, in a river, to pump water to a higher location. My buddy who runs an orphanage in Philipines is familiar with it and I will email him on detail and name of device. It exists, perfect for you.

              PS 1 KWH per panel per day is pretty good estimate.

              • Thanks, stock. Been here for 22 years now, so you can bet your bippy I've researched a wide variety of possible solutions. Considered a ram pump for the water supply – have enough fall from high end inlet to the spring house (where the lines are) for that, but a ram is only going to pump the same water that's powering it. The creek is spring fed, but the railroad grade wall it flows under is questionable. They spray poison fairly regularly, some of that must follow gravity, even 200 feet down.

                Our spring comes out amongst the roots of a giant tulip poplar uphill (our side) of the creek, it's been reliable for 30 years. Have it tested by the extension guy every few years, it's still the best water anywhere (a bit mineral, sometimes find hematite 'fairy tears' when it needs clearing). The creek drains Heartbreak Ridge, south slope of Mt. Mitchell – it can get wild after high country rains.

                So sluicing from the creek just this side of the railroad wall to a wheel out of harm's way next to the spring house should work fine, and we get to keep the fairy-spring water. We can engineer the sluice to overshoot the wheel when the creek's high so the wheel stays safe. Doesn't have to have big flow or pressure, just has to fill the uphill cistern slow and steady. When I get an uphill cistern, of course. §;o)

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    The children of Japan's Fukushima battle an invisible enemy


    "Though the strict safety limits for outdoor activity set after multiple meltdowns at the Fukushima Dai-ichi nuclear plant in 2011 have now been eased, parental worries and ingrained habit mean many children still stay inside."

    Japan parents near Fukushima nuclear disaster still too scared to let kids play outside


    It seems some want the children to get out and play in the radioactive dust..
    They want them to run through radioactive contaminated fields ..breathing contaminated air.
    Who does this?
    Is this you… Lady Judge?

    • weegokiburi weegokiburi

      With you all the way on this.
      Been on about the poisonous disinformation that ETHOS have been spreading in Fuku.

      • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

        @ weegokiburi..thanks much.

        How dare they.
        How dare they try and intervene on what a parent is willing/will do to protect their children.

        These children need to be evacuated.
        What's this?..leaving these people to these choices.

        Only the most vilely corrupt..would send the children out to play..all knowing both sides..whether admitted or not ..decontamination cannot be done.. (as surely as the rains falls).

        Let them..get back.
        Let them.. shut up.

        How dare they.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    PS.. To anyone with this type of advice.
    Take your children ..move there..
    Take them for a picnic in the playground.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Then again..it won't happen..
    So why don't you ..SHUT UP!

  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    .. 🙂 Go get em Heart!

  • clamshellernh clamshellernh

    Chomsky: From Hiroshima to Fukushima, Vietnam to Fallujah, State Power Ignores Its Massive Harm | Democracy Now!

    This is one of my hometown heroes that I have seen speak numerous times
    One of the good guys from MIT Noam Chomsky ..

  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    Still looking, CNN, for your article on Fukushima Third Anniversary.
    Google search for "cnn, Fukushima anniversary" for past 24 hours yields nothing at all from cnn.
    CNN, are you asleep at the switch again? 😉

  • mairs mairs

    There was someone commenting somewhere else, soon after the meltdowns. She said she was an American teacher in Japan. Her message was "from the children" of Fukushima. The children were telling Americans to stop bothering them and stop overreacting, that nothing was wrong except that foreigners were bothering them. Leave them alone, everything is fine.

    The bizarreness of the pro-nuke trolls made my teeth hurt.

    • Johnny Blade Johnny Blade

      The American schoolteacher who lives in a Tokyo suburb closer to Fuku-Ichi commented on a picture a mutual friend posted to Facebook this AM of the Fukushima/3-11/TEPCO demonstration outside the Japanese consulate in Chicago that I re-posted here said the sentiment in Japan was that the higher-ups should all be jailed for what they did!! I thought it was a step in the right direction and perhaps the public there is finally of the majority opinion against nuclear and the nuke-pukes since they're really grasping for straws and pathetically desperate if they've sunken to the level of shitbirds who'd use the child-victims to send their own message to the masses!! Maybe it'd be more credible if they had the children reading the script hold up the findings of their thyroid exams too??!! 🙁 GGRRRR!!!

  • TheBigPicture TheBigPicture


    Because it was impossible to evacuate United States and Japan.

  • Nick

    So why do we care about dirty bombs?

    Why bother to shield xray technicians in hospitals?

    If Fukushima is OKAY….then all radiation must not be that big of a deal.

    Cesium the day!

  • Nick

    Years from now it will be discovered that politicians are genetically unable to tell the truth.

    Governments the world over will have less tax dollars as the great dying begins.

    Welcome to our new world all.

    • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

      Japan, soonest of all.
      Japan, most of all.

      The world's economies will learn that birth defects add little to productivity, and add much to public costs.

  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    Of course! 🙂 Let them all burn full tilt, then we humans will all look like this.. 🙂

    • newsblackoutUSA newsblackoutUSA

      obe, I have had the server reset twice, and my comment removed about the NSA.

      If the government actually wanted to protect the populace with PRISM, Echelon, and NSA…then the technology would have revealed the 3 core meltdown right away and warnings would have went out to the world.

      The last three years have been a time for certain people to divest themselves of commodities, and make as much money as possible before the information started leaking out about Fukushima and the failure of Nuclear Technology.

      There are eyes in the sky 24/7 and every conversation/keystroke/email is documented. There is no excuse they can use that they did not know what was happening.

      Just like they could tell everyone where the missing airliner is, by viewing one of their many spy satellites. However, that won't happen because all they want is to control and dominate.

      Let them eat Yellow cake. 🙂

      • Homolumina Homolumina

        Power and Control is what the not initiated alpha male is after; they organize in strictly hierarchical structures with a dogmatic belief system; they are goal driven unempathetic, competitive, territorial and aggressive; they are death oriented, destructive and exploitative; as long as they are not initiated – which includes going through a transformational near death experience – NOTHING will ever change since the destructive structures will established over and over because that is what a not initiated alpha male is on the inside, and that they bring out. It is at the root of all the problems we have – including death technologies and the strategy of doing whatever it takes to maintain power and control. It drives me crazy that this is not understood and applied. We will never ever eradicate all the destructive, death oriented social and political systems as long as the ones who put it in place are on purpose stuck in their not initiated, immature and destructive self … Anybody who wants to know the details please let me know, I am happy to share: devmai1204@gmail.com If we want to live in a sane world males need to be initiated again. All what I state here is reflected in the male body and does NOT represent my personal opinion.

        • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

          Are you going too line all the males up in one huge line and then one by one initiate them?

          • Time Is Short Time Is Short

            All the people that run this shit show have been initiated, and initiated well. It's just not an initiation we're invited to.

            A significant lack of awareness.

      • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

        Yes, they/we/them and all other biological life not responsible for this Nuclear Technology failed course and direction..will eat yellow cake before all is said and done.

        I shudder to think what the Nuclear Cabal future may bring to us all! 🙁 Very Soon! 🙁

        Shut them all down! Now! 🙂

  • Nick

    There were 2 posts….now just one. I also had some NSA CIA criticism on other thread..which is now gone.

    Was it a shadow post?????

    Oh no…..The NSA and CIA will now hunt me down with a drone.

    I must be an enemy of the State for I dare say that they lie and are a waste of our tax dollars!

    • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

      Some weird stuff going on.. no doubt. 🙁

      • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

        The SHTF with the CIA spying on congress today. Dianne Feinstein called them out on the Senate floor today. Will be on the evening news.

        Defund the NSA! 😉

        New NSA budget: $0.00
        Destroy all the files.

        Ed Snowden is a national hero, and should be invited to return to the US any time he wants, IMHO.


          Feinstein's long been on the frontline to turn America into a police state. Her kind has zero credibility…

        • unincredulous unincredulous

          Jesse Ventura pointed out that he was questioned by the CIA about how he became a governor. He also pointed out that their charter prohibits them from operating within the USA. Now they are spying on congress? Defund them. Now.

        • 21stCentury 21stCentury


          Since the dawn of Civilization, WAR & Conflict has plagued humanity…
          Look deep beneath the surface of History and beyond the false-flags of political polarizations…
          beyond Communism, beyond Capitalism, beyond Fascism..
          ..all this treachery is spawned by A$$HOLES !!

          CIA is just a small part of the full spectrum of A$$HOLES..
          ..the Pentagoonies
          ..the alphabet agencies
          ..the Mafia
          ..the Mossad
          ..the Mercenaries Inc. [Blackwater/Xi/Academi; CACI,Titan,etc]
          ..the Banksters & Gangsters
          ..the Nukers & Pukers & BigOil too,
          ..the privateers; SAIC, and a thousand other corporate spook companies
          …it goes on & on worldwide

          Cult of Idiot A$$HOLES

          Both JFK & Eisenhower were deeply concerned with the rise of Secret Societies

          deception lying spying extortion torture blackmail warfare…
          …etc etc ad nauseum

          Humanity is a failed species until it sheds it's rotten core.

          Our culture is not guided by the Constitution anymore, it is guided by a stack of MAD-magazines..
          The Parody has become the Lighthouse
          The Whitehouse has become a Nuthouse = 😛

          Boobtube Nation commits suicide by plutonium

          • newsblackoutUSA newsblackoutUSA

            21st Century- You just explained 3000 +/- of human "civilization" the only thing that changes is the amount of people effected by the weapons of war against the serfs. In the 20th century we gained nukes, and now in the 21st century nukes are murdering et al.

            Your above post should be carved on a stone wall so that it may remain a testament of the downfall of biologic lifeforms.

            We better get to manufacturing the 2045 avatars, because that looks like the best option to store the history of humanity after the last biologic life forms die off.

            Happy 3/11 (sarcasm) 🙂

    • zogerke zogerke

      newsblackout can you compose elsewhere and if a comment gets lost re enter it?

      • newsblackoutUSA newsblackoutUSA

        zogerke…I had an incident today where my whole comment went missing and the server reset on me three times before the comment went in. I also was reading a comment Nick had made, and the server reset and then it was gone. Weird day…

        • zogerke zogerke

          Sorry you lost comments.
          We all need to be forewarned and prepared….most the time i just write here and have not planned first. maybe for some posts that will change…… some stuff i save to repost.

          Frustrating to have to reenter the posts numerous times.

          keep copies. carbon paper! (NOT!- dating myself.)

  • Nick

    I bet others have noticed log-in weirdness today, getting profile page instead of thread….

    Expect scrutiny.

    I say, let 'em.

    There has never been any hanky panky on enenews.

    Just the truth and nothing but the truth so help us all.

  • Myme

    Question – Why NRC wanted to hide the presence of Japanese engineers in their Maryland operations center?

  • Myme

    U.S. government, CIA, NRC still helping Japan develop nuclear weapons behind the back of all of us? Is this relationship still ongoing?



  • Myme

    In any case, kudos to the investigative reporting by Bill Dedman and others at NBC.

    • NoPrevarication NoPrevarication


      It is a small beginning and much was left out. A good article–as far as it went.

  • Southbound Southbound

    Just checking in to say Hi on this Tuesday, the 11th of March, 2014. I hate to use the word "anniversary" since this is not a happy day to remember, but it is 3 years now since that faithful day we all know too well.

    I hope everyone here is doing well, and lets all hope for some good news this year.

    Keep on keeping on.

  • Time Is Short Time Is Short

    On this third anniversary of the worst man-made disaster in the history of this planet, I would like to offer my deepest regrets to the hundreds of thousands of dead children since 3/11, and the billions more to die.

    Over billions of years of evolution/existence, or even a few thousand years if you are inclined to that thought process, either way, Man has destroyed all of it in less than 100 years.

    Awful. Just awful.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    A refutation from the NRC..
    Comes just at a moment when the NRC..IS LEAST LIKELY TO BE BELIEVED.

    Fukushima Contamination in U.S. Waters Refuted by NRC
    March 11, 2014


    As in..why the hell..would a person ..believe you..hun?

    Allison Macfarlane


    "She is married to Hugh Gusterson, a professor of anthropology and author of works on nuclear culture, with whom she has two children.["

    Hugh Gusterson

    "He taught at MIT from 1992-2006 before moving to George Mason University. One of the founders of the anthropology of science,[citation needed] his early work was on the culture of nuclear weapons scientists and antinuclear activists".

    How interesting…

    • rogerthat

      Heart, great stuff:

      Claims that radiation from a wrecked Japanese nuclear plant is contaminating U.S. waters are “simply not correct,” Nuclear Regulatory Commission Chairman Allison Macfarlane said on the disaster’s third anniversary.
      Radioactive water hasn’t reached the coast and any Pacific Ocean samples with residue from the 2011 accident have levels at least 100 times lower than U.S. drinking-water standards, Macfarlane said today.
      Radioactive water hasn’t reached the coast and any Pacific Ocean samples with residue from the 2011 accident have levels at least 100 times lower than U.S. drinking-water standards, Macfarlane said today at a commission conference near NRC headquarters in the Washington suburb of Rockville, Maryland.
      “It is imperative that we as regulators find and seek out that credible information,” she said.

      • rogerthat

        … While Macfarlane has previously ruled out contamination, the NRC continues to confront claims, often tied to Internet postings, that radiation from the March 2011 triple meltdown at Fukushima Dai-Ichi is at dangerously high levels in the water. Macfarlane also knocked down the claims in a blog post today.

        “Here the Pacific’s vast volume has greatly dispersed any contamination before it can reach our West Coast,” she wrote. “Scientists have not seen any Fukushima contamination that raises a concern about the U.S. food supply, water supply or public health.”

        Ha ha. ''Safe'' limits have now been set so high that there is no longer any unsafe level. All radiation is safe, all the time, it's safe all the way up until you are dead and then you won't be able to complain, aint life a joke.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    A little psyop..going on?

  • Nick

    Today we remember how 3/11/11 changed the world, forever.

    It really isn't just about the 18,000 people that perished in the horrific tsunami, but the awful truths about our world that some have tried VERY hard to obfuscate.

    It isn't really about nuclear energy's nightmare scenario belching from Fukushima.

    What it is is a wake up call for us all to realize how far down a rabbit hole we have gone with respects to all things nuclear, especially weapons.

    We can rail all we want about nuclear power plants, but it is the defense side that is the beast.

    We will not be able to slay this beast.

    But we can learn to starve it.


    Much like a loved one who passes away on a holiday, the people of Japan who lost loved ones during the horrific tsunami 3 years ago have to remember it every time the Fukushima nuclear disaster continues to be brought up. Fukushima is a problem that will continue to be talked about, because that is all we can do… talk about it!


  • Nick

    March 11, 2014 at 12:47 pm · Reply
    Years from now it will be discovered that politicians are genetically unable to tell the truth.


    Man that was fast Nick….

  • TheBigPicture TheBigPicture

    People don't want nuclear, and this list will be growing.

    (( Countries phasing out nuclear ))









  • Capt. Nemo Capt. Nemo

    Assuming the DILUTION does not do the job the human density of concern will rise to the point where truth will be extruded from this mass of lies.

    I think we are starting to see a little of this now. Perhaps within the year there will be gushes of information that is fairly accurate.

    I think in general the heavily corrupted governments and corporations are starting to sense demise in the air.

    Fukushima is just one of an almost endless list of destructive operations that gov and corp have erected in the last one hundred years. And now the veil of secrecy is being rended.

  • Capt. Nemo Capt. Nemo

    Lies are the truth diluted.

    Assuming the DILUTION does not do the job the human density of concern will rise to the point where truth will be extruded from this mass of lies.

    I think we are starting to see a little of this now. Perhaps within the year there will be gushes of information that is fairly accurate.

    I think in general the heavily corrupted governments and corporations are starting to sense demise in the air.

    Fukushima is just one of an almost endless list of destructive operations that gov and corp have erected in the last one hundred years. And now the veil of secrecy is being rended.

  • unincredulous unincredulous

    The contamination is outside of the "containment." The contamination is outside of the "containment." The contamination is outside of the "containment."
    Containment no longer computes. Containment is invalid. Nuclear power companies can not contain the radiation. Radiation is DANGEROUS.
    The containment program will self-destruct at random intervals. The containment program is a failure. Terminate program. Terminate nuclear power construct. Logic. Logic. Logic.

  • Nick

    Radiation outside containment is no good.

    What part of that equation do you not understand?

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Speaker Speaks Out Against Nuclear Power

    A leading lawmaker used the bully pulpit at the ceremony to call for an end to nuclear power, a rare instance of apparent public dissent by a top ruling party official against the policy of Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

    “It seems as if we have reaped the benefits of electricity…while letting the people of Fukushima bear the cost,” said Bunmei Ibuki, the speaker of Japan’s lower house of parliament. Mr. Ibuki made his remarks at the National Theater during Tuesday’s memorial to mark the third year since a giant earthquake off the country’s northeast coast triggered a mammoth tsunami that killed nearly 16,000 people, left over 2,500 missing and caused one of the world’s worst nuclear disasters."

    "Facing a floral memorial for the disaster’s victims, his back to the audience, Mr. Ibuki lamented how Japan’s admiration of science and technology “gave rise to a sense of arrogance, that humans can control nature.” He ended his brief remarks advocating an energy policy “with a view toward a nuclear phaseout in the future.”


  • chevvvy chev

    Not all phycopaths are pro-nukers, but all pro-nukers are phycopaths

    ……….. 🙂

  • id8

    An undebatable response to folks who argue the problem was an earthquake and Tsunami.
    Just north of Fuku Daichi, the Onagawa NPP came through it all okay.
    1. Onagawa was closer to epicenter than Fukushima Daiichi 123km vs 183km
    2. tsunami measured at Onagawa was higher than at Fukushima Daiichi 14.3 meters vs 13.1 meters
    3. The earthquake seismic intensity at the two nuclear power plants were negligibly different

    Onagawa "…experienced very high levels of ground motion—the strongest shaking that any nuclear plant has ever experienced from an earthquake,” but it “shut down safely” and was “remarkably undamaged.”

    The full paper linked at the bottom of the story is a great read.
    The author credits one man for creating the safety culture at
    Tohoku Electric Power Company that saved them.
    Thank you, Yanosuke Hirai.

    If only Tepco had one like you. The problem is, there are many more of these beasts. And an Arnie or Yanosuke is not to be found. So it is up to us.
    Make noise about safety, details, inform people of the facts in a sober and clear manner.

    Inconvenient facts. If someone says the NRC would not allow this or that?
    NRC established regulations in 1980 after a dangerous fire at the Browns Ferry plant in Alabama.
    47 US reactors don’t meet the NRC’s fire protection regulations. Including Browns ferry.

    27 reactors don’t meet its seismic risk guidelines adopted in the mid-90s.

  • jump-ball jump-ball

    3 years without bringing 1 soul to nuclear truth, not 1 of my children, relatives, friends, neighbors or associates, has led me to try NUCLEAR PERFORMANCE ART, which is getting everyone's attention.

    Using my new low-reading GMC-200 GC attached to my iPhone4 with GeigerBot, I have been showing people that radiation IS IN FACT VISIBLE, first the local 20 CPM desert cities CA background reading, then the rapid increase in clicks and blinks to 290 CPM in response to a Thorium disk check source, then the rise to a noisy 650 CPM on top of my Metlox Poppy Trail pink serving plate, then the video of the i4 display jumping from 20 BKG to 870 CPM in 30 seconds as I move under the "AC vent" in my cardiologist's waiting room, and then the radiation clicks and blinks off of my uranium dioxide salted 'Vaseline glass', glowing green under a black light.

    That clear glass, glowing-green-in-the-dark under the UV light, with the 200 GC clicking and blinking red, breaks through all their resistance and denial, and they start to open up, asking "Why did you buy this cool stuff", and so far I have gingerly responded that Fukushima has caused some changes in west coast background radiation and in rain and snow, and if any permanent increase occurs I want to know so I can take precautions.

    Several asked "What precautions would you take?", and I said there would be lots to do, and we could talk about it whenever you want.

    My foot is in the door, even if my shoes are still…

    • jump-ball jump-ball

      …shoes are still outside (counter said I had 2 chars left…)

      • zogerke zogerke

        jump ball all that is EXCELLENT.

        • jump-ball jump-ball

          TY – looking forward to showing the stuff and maybe 'converting' some more lost souls. We'll see what the cardiologist thinks next Tuesday when I give her the CPM readings and a copy of the waiting room video…

  • Mozer

    I know. Straight from the pdf.

    Wondering where the first part of document is, though.

  • paschn

    "CIA told nuclear regulator that blast was hydrogen…". Since the false flag attack of 9/11 I've become acutely aware of terms such as "traitor", "fifth column" or here's a real applicable one, "dual citizen". Have any of you read a book, "Economic Hit Man"? The CIA, like all FED alphabet agencies, has one major goal; to protect the status quo and to carry out legal or illegal orders from their superiors which will help secure for them a lucrative "career" and insure promotions as rapidly as possible with absolutely no regard for life-liberty or the pursuit of.., for their fellow citizens. one look at their performances before/during and after "events" such as OKC, Ruby Ridge, WACO, WTC the first etc. etc. Specifically, the CIA's function is to open foreign markets to private corporations holding "title" to U.S. G.O.'s REGARDLESS of what the indigenous government/people want, (700 combat ready military bases in 130 countries, [an ingenious way to make "the slaves" pay for their own enslavement using "our boys" to fight for mom, apple pie and G.E.]), to, through and for the IMF, World Bank, Bank of international Settlements et al, ALL tentacles of the Central Banking Cabal which the West has done more for spreading globally than any other entity on Earth. To consider anything spewed from the mouth of trash such as they is a supremely perfect example of mind-numbing gullibility in action. When you consider stupidity like that, it's no wonder those…

  • HoTaters HoTaters

    So reassuring it is to know the CIA can give marching orders to the NRC. Gives me the warm fuzzies.

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    I was just remembering who was all about the 'hydrogen' thing…
    How interesting…

  • pinksailmatt pinksailmatt

    A zirconium cladding fire in the presence of steam would generate hydrogen gas. The generation and transport of hydrogen gas in air was modeled in the Sandia calculations as was the explosion of a hydrogen-air mixture in the closed building space above the spent fuel pool The explosion of hydrogen could enhance the release of radioactive material. The explosion would mechanically pulverize and loft fuel out of the pool. This contaminated the plant and surrounding site with pieces of spent fuel.