Published: November 5th, 2011 at 12:40 pm ET
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Nov. 5 — Even after robots were used to sweep away debris on Nov. 2, “They measured 210 mSv/h and 620 mSv/h on the first floor of reactor 3,” reports Fukushima Diary citing Asahi.
Published: November 5th, 2011 at 12:40 pm ET
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sending...
Sorry to be off-topic.. I just want to post a quick comment about ENENEWS’ publishing.
I think the website is great and I consult it everyday. I’m so thankful to have a place that offers a different view than what we can read on common medias.. I just regret that only bad news are posted. As a result, I still need to cross with others sources.. and I’m never sure which source to trust finally. :-/
I know the website is militant and wants to defend a point of view, but I would really appreciate to read both bad and good news.. I think it’s important to keep an objective view on this so serious issue. Moreover, I would prefer to read a reassuring news here with a good critic rather than learning about it on TV..
For example, a few days ago Tepco stated that the Xenon leak was not so serious finally… but we never read such news on ENENEWS. And I think it’s a pity, because I don’t really know what to think about such statement.
Please let me know if my remark is posted in the wrong place..
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Hi maax, but where are the good news to post? I’m afraid the situation is even much worse than shown here – without a doubt Tepco is holding back information, and so does the government…
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The situation is probably worse than TEPCO admits to, but I think you have to admit that there is an editorial bias at work here. Perfectly understandable, and it’s nothing that other sites refrain from. Even The Huffington Post slants headiness to encourage page hits.
But, there is an almost complete lack of any “good” news, or of technologies that may help the situation. Everything is “doom and gloom”.
A few days ago, I submitted a story about technology developed at Queensland University of Technology that may make storing radioactive waste safer through the use of nanotech, and nothing came of it:
http://www.qut.edu.au/about/news/news?news-id=37568
Oh, well, there’s always Physics Forums, if you can stomach the nuclear cheerleaders.
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Brown’s Gas flame. Brown’s Gas flame. Brown’s Gas flame. Brown’s Gas flame. Brown’s Gas flame. Brown’s Gas flame.
…..Brown’s Gas flame.
How the heck often does it have to be said?
You want a miracle, that’s it.
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Apparently, it’s all about nursemaiding the waste for eternity, sucking the life out of taxpayers, and not actually solving the damn problem.
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Yeah, Tepco is a great place to check for happy news. Then come to this site for a reality check.
R1 D/W: only 215Sv/hr.
http://atmc.jp/plant/rad/?n=1
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Maax, you are not off-topic. Sounds like you are questioning wondering who to believe. When Tepco says that a xenon leak was not so serious that is not good news as Tepco was denying a melt down even as people like Arnie Gunderson were saying it might be a melt down and USA was dictating a larger evacuation area for its nationals then what Japan dictated. Months later Tepco admits a meltdown and whispers a melt through. Official line, we dont know how far down the blobs of uncontrolled radio-active matter has travelled into the ground but there is nothing to worry about. Who knows what else Tepco is measuring. Any small amount of Xenon means some sort of nuclear reaction recently.
Your comment “I would prefer to read a reassuring news here ” Yes I would also like to read something reassuring but unfortunately the Zombies built a nuclear power complex in a known volcano and tsunami zone and we have now three melted out reactors with covering buildings blown out and a fourth reactor with an elevated storage tank filled with water and hot spent fuel rods precariously balanced within the wreckage waiting for another volcano. Not to mention number three was recently refueled with MOX fuel, finely ground up plutonium. You won’t get anything reassuring that isn’t spin. Good Luck, Maax
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Dear maax, hoping to give a little bit of focus here:
re “I just regret that only bad news are posted”:
- the problem is that the escape of large volumes of highly radioactive material at Fukushima Dai-ichi, and the inability to control the ongoing nuclear reaction processes, are indeed bad news, coming as they do from what is now agreed to have been the worst, by far, nuclear accident in human history.
Good news would, for me, include a care programme for Japanese residents including both high intensity medical surveys and therapy and orderly evacuations, all of course supported by careful planning and frank and fully explained communication from the government and other authorities.
Evidence of honest and courageous leadership would also be good news.
I look forward to the above but am not holding my breath.
re “I still need to cross with others sources”:
- we all do this, but as enenews always supplies sources and references there is no trust issue with the material here; there are other blogs which publish the same news but with different areas of focus and viewpoint. In the absence of fully reliable official sources the best thing we can offer is a self help group such as the enenews commenters, some of whom do a good deal of digging into hard to find scientific and engineering records and papers. The enenews comments are in that respect extremely useful.
re “I’m never sure which source to trust finally”:
- that’s easy, you can trust Tepco and the Japanese Government some weeks or months after the event, or you can do what we do and keep up with the dribs that dribble out while at the same time undertaking diligent research to put some flesh on the bones of things like becquerels and millisieverts.
… continued …
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… continued …
re “I know the website is militant and wants to defend a point of view”:
- I disagree with you on this, most strongly. This website offers news feeds and a forum for readers to comment. Mostly (!) we are interested in the truth, or trying to find it. If you want militant then you could go for ex-skf, pissin’ on the roses, or fukushima diary, all of which wear their commitment guilelessly.
The contributors here, however, are alert to the attempts of representatives of the nuclear power industry to soft soap the whole fukushima calamity and you might find that a comment which seeks to divert attention away from the very real dangers now facing humanity finds a sharp response. Be aware that there is a lot of money and power tied up in nuclear engineering and there are documented efforts to sway opinion in the direction of “nothing to see here, move along please”.
I trust that this might have helped.
Misitu.
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Thank you Misitu for your detailed answer. I posted some comments bellow.
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Cheers, just caught up with yours. Thanks. Hope I might have helped.
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All well said. Thanks!
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I thought the occupy japan thing was not ‘bad’
… militant? hmmm
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As I said in reply to maax, this site is a news collector and is not in itself militant, though the contributors exhibit a collective view in favour of responsibility and truth.
Thanks admin for keeping things running.
M
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Great job, Misitu.
Excellently explained.
I balked at Maax’s use of the word militant, and then possibly glazed over most of the rest when I noticed downstream Mark’s typical on-target comment about Maax’s quest for reassuring news, and after confirming those were Maax’s words, I began to understand that Maax’s queries were not off-topic but rather clever distortion.
By the way, I thought for sure that Enenews reported on Tepco admitting Xenon gas was detected, and what is odd is that I can’t understand where Maax gets the balls to say that Enenews should have reported it’s not serious because Tepco says so! Wow.
My understanding is that the presence of Xenon was the indicator that Uranium went re-critical, no?
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>I just regret that only bad news are posted.
Well, actally once in my many hundreds of posts I said the new heat exchanger at Number 4 seemed to have reduced the fires of the spent fuel rods.
Then massive cesium buildup in the water filters at Unit 4 kind of negated some of the heat “victory.”
As BnB sez…just when has there been good news to report? Should we applaud the tent overlay at Unit 1 because they completed it even facing severe criticism?
Should we applaud and report that no more roofs have blown skyward?
The news is beyond dire in Japan and if people who read the pablum sh#t at Foxnews want to read the bad news 24 hours a day then they should check out the very few places like enenews that provides the unfiltered coverage. There is a certain lack of objectivity here…mainly because many of us feel it’s not just ground zero in Japan that is deadly.
Changing gears a bit (and yes this is still bad news)…Proving invisible isotopes blown in the wind or carried in the ocean from Japan kills you or your children is going to be difficult to prove unless the circumstantial evidence builds beyond a reasonal doubt. It was rarely proven if at all from Chernobyl radiation. It’s not a traditional analysis of corpus delicti (body of evidence to prove a murder) because radiation deaths have the magic bullet (invisibility from the human eye).
But let’s say mysterious excess deaths in other nations rises to a factor that even a simpleton on a jury could understand as being beyond strange. Add in some autopsy detection of radioactive isotopes above historical levels and then voila! You have a causal connection to a criminal act of a company in Japan.
Of course there’s nobody worth suing over this disaster because the nuclear nations couldn’t possibly pay for all the human casualties.
They can’t even begin to pay for the proper waste disposal of the nuclear toxins which need to be contained for millions of years. Bad news indeed.
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thank you for your post.
“good news” was probably not the word I should choose.. There is nothing good in this accident and for the people exposed to its consequences.
I was just pointing out that the titles are mostly very alarming (and this is not a critic, the bad news shouldn’t be hidden.. I want to be informed of them at first). But after an alarming event, I expect to read how the situation evolves and if the worst case hypothesis is confirmed or not… rather than just remembering the worst suppositions.
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Maax typed these pixels of light:
I was just pointing out that the titles are mostly very alarming
SP: Stick around… they will get worse. >;-)
As for your original post about the lack of “objectivity”…it is what it is. This is a web forum of unpaid volunteers who research and produce professional postings at times worthy of the New York Times and then at times rants comparable to the worst flames in the post-Usenet web community. I strive for objectivity most of the time, but anger can be a harsh mistress. *;-)
Thanks for your input…your comments will bring out a few new rants, raves, and also objective commentary. Readers will decide to believe posts or discard them. A true democracy of sorts.
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well said sick
all of it but especially this
a true democracy of sorts!!
top marks for that!!
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Maax, I “had” the same thoughts about the issue and even got bent when a regular contributor posted something humorous that unintentionally filled me with angst. The sentiments of B & B are unfortunately the reality at this time and most people with common-sense & intuition have seemed to resign themselves to expect the worst as hoping for the best isn’t enough since “the best” possible outcome still holds dire consequence for all of us as new revelations of complicity in the mammoth cover-up speak volumes by themselves without even having to see the data being hidden from the public sector.It’s kind of disgusting that the “good news” we seek is only coming from sources proven to be fully controlled by those who seek to continue their “poisoning for profit” agenda-but I still look for it too when I need to latch on to something that might give me a sense of hope until the next slap in the face from reality sends me back in the darkness thinking about playing another round of Russian roulette. Then I realized that TEPCO & all the other’s like them & those who are “supposed to regulate their foul industry have been playing that game from their inception,only they’ve been adding another bullet to the cylinder with every incompetent & corrupt move or “misstep” they make!-I’m gonna hang in there & with the help of ENE,Fairwinds & the handful of sometimes brutally realistic,honest,& insightful folks who tell it like it is so that we can try to unload a few rounds from the weapon pointed right between our eyes!! Hang in there! Spread the word! You will be vindicated without having to utter “I told you so!”soon enough!!~PEACE~
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“The system, because it can be taken of the gas in the containment, the No. 2 has been established already has been used to detect radioactive short half-life indicates the fission reaction and confirm the concentration of hydrogen, TEPCO 1 , placed at No. 3 in a hurry.”
This is from the google translation of the Asahi article Fukushima Diary got its information from. The Asahi Shimbun is widely regarded for its journalism as the most respected daily newspaper in Japan.
So does this mean in a weeks time we will get chemical analysis of Reactor #3? I can hardly wait.
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It looked like a bit of steam or smoke was showing in the beam of the spotlight on No.3 a little while ago when I last looked at 2:51am Tepco cam time? Also thought I’d seen white points for a second there.Would that also confirm something continually going on that might not be seen in the daylight?-Am I imagining things or is it possible that big eruptions of steam,weird lights,etc. that are seen in the middle of the night when workers aren’t around as much might imply that they are possibly encouraging fission or spontaneous criticality to occur during those hours so that the events the “expect” to happen are “controlled” to cause them to happen when less people are onsite when it’s initiated rather than while they’re working in close proximity to the worst area’s of the reactor buildings? If so,I hope their “playing with fire”doesn’t lead to the “big one” feared if it decided to go up all at once! Then I fear the impatient wait for the analysis will have been for naught..Just my thoughts on the matter-probably baseless & not worth a response…(I hope!)…PEACE
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I think it is all about the facts and logic, not about the balance, and that is why I look for news here. We`ve got enough “stable reactors”, “cold sutdowns”, “no immediate threat”,”natural fission”, floating “safe levels”, banana/air flight arguments. If ENENEWS has to repeat all this, there will be no space for data and thinking. And thinking is needed, because majority of the data comes from sources, which have proven to be unreliable.
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Exactly!
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pure water
“We`ve got enough “stable reactors”, “cold sutdowns”, “no immediate threat”,”natural fission”, floating “safe levels”, banana/air flight arguments. If ENENEWS has to repeat all this, there will be no space for data and thinking. ”
Sickputer
“Should we applaud and report that no more roofs have blown skyward?”
> well.. I think it would be interesting to also mention the progress done, and any informations when the situation is getting better. As I said, I prefer to read improvements and “reassuring” news here than on the mainstream media, because I can trust that they are really real here. I think ENENEWS is indeed able to bring such kind of infos with a good criticism.. whereas I can’t expect an objective view from ordinary medias. As Misitu said, the nuclear industry put a lot of efforts to sway opinion in the direction to reassure people.. and the mainstream medias are only relaying the official declarations, without critical mind. So I think ENENEWS is precisely a good place to talk any kind of news and not only the most alarming ones.
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I’m aware that there is no good news in this issue. And I’m sorry I couldn’t make myself clear. Also, please forgive my poor English, I’m French.
I read ENENEWS almost everyday since the accident happened.. I worry a lot because the person I love lives in Tokyo area (chiba prefecture). But don’t misunderstand, I don’t want to be reassured… I just want to know the truth as it is.
I know that the purpose is to make the people aware of the problem and not to reassure them, but I regret a steady sight in time when regarding at a specific issue.
I think you can understand what I mean if you look at the front page and read the titles one by one. You’ll see a succession alarming news that are not really related to each other. But if you look at one of them, you have no means to know how the situation evolved in the coming days.
Lets take the Krypton example: A few days ago, an increase of 14,000% was mentioned. The title still scares me.. but I don’t know if it’s still increasing or decreasing now. Moreover, several hypothesis have been drawn from this observation.. but I would like to know if these hypothesis are confirmed or denied. Generally a false hypothesis will rarely be denied in a next note. As a result, a person who reads these news will have the feeling that things are always become worse, keeping in mind the worst suppositions..
I think it would be interesting to be careful to inform objectively how the situation evolves and not only notify the worst peaks.
But it may be just my feeling.. I would be interested to have yours.
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unfortunately no further information has come out about the krypton, though please post if you find any.
the fact remains that the krypton levels were 147 times higher in a day, and krypton is used as an indicator of plutonium fission. that is what was reported.
i think it was a Japan holiday late last week so that may have slowed the info stream.
hopefully the comments section can add to the reader’s understanding, as reports posted on this site are mainly focused on providing the latest news rather than a wikipedia-type format.
thanks for taking the time to explain your first comment and for visiting often.
admin
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you kicked of a cool discussion max thanks….its been interesting!!
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I think most days we have a balanced presentation here.. we generally provide the GOOD news ..Tepco offers…..then we laugh.
I… for one am not interested in convincing anyone about Fukushima..here or elsewhere else.
I know what I see…I tell it….
Truth is told.
I remain free.
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I think this site evolved into what it is because we have all been lied to for so long with the nuke power is clean, safe and cheap BS. I was taken in by it as well and I know I’m not alone here. This criminal industry has relied on lies and misinformation, shills, tax subsidies and mainstream media to get us to where we are – surrounded by all these expensive, polluting, and dangerous plants. I have no sympathy for anymore lies and lack of transparency from any of them. The headlines here should scare you – they are closer to the truth than anything TEPCO has said or will admit. We freely debate all things in the comments section and make our own guesses, often a difficult task.
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“I just want to know the truth as it is.”
That is why the Admin created this site. That is why the topics and comments are made here each day. That is why we scour the internet daily, looking for that piece of information to add to the mix. That is why we analyse and connect the dots, trying to figure out who, what, when, where, why.
If we all knew the truth to this matter, then all of this would be moot.
Cheers and happiness to you and your loved one Maax, you both are half a world apart, but sadly, the countries you each live in share the same untold threat to your very existance on this planet.
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Thank you all for your answers. To tell the truth, I didn’t expect so many
I hope you don’t feel my comments as a negative critic. I only meant to suggest an improvement. And I’m so thankful that this website exists. I know I can rely on it to be informed quickly if something serious happens.. and this is very important for me.
I just feel sometimes anxious when I read the titles here.. I feel like everything is always getting worse, cause I always read about the worst values, the peaks, the worse hypothesis.. but I never know if the situation is generalized or punctual, I never know when things are getting better. I always hope to read about improvements made or solutions found.. but I never see them
But once again I want to thank the staff for their work and all the members who contribute here. I keep talking about ENENEWS around me.
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Thanks for your posts, maax. That you have someone you love in the danger zone makes your desire for good news understandable. I too have someone I care about in the danger zone, but am unable to influence any decision making.
These are difficult times.
Best wishes
Misitu
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P. S.
There is no historical database on this site. It would be useful, as you said, to follow up individual site reports and stuff like that. However, these are trying times and events move too fast to have something like that organised. I can only recommend, keep reading.
As I mentioned before, the good news will be when the Japanese government (and others) start behaving truthfully and responsibly towards their citizens. When that happens we will all be able to relax a little bit because then, at last, we will know the scope of the threat facing us all.
Thanks for inspiring this answer.
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well put… the only ‘good’ news is facts and the truth.
i’m working on the archive here: http://enenews.com/archive
it’s only been up for a few days (link at top right of page).
is this a historical database Misitu?
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thats a bally long list admin…. cool idea…i like lists, all the quicker to scan for me!! nice and simple too..
might i recommend bold black for the headline?? but it works .. thanks!!
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It is clear that things won’t be “better” until we can extract this vampire squid called the nuclear industry from continuously injecting us with radiation. Until we can shutdown all the nuclear plants.
My specialties are Thermal Fluids and Materials Science, with a Masters Degree from University of Michigan, and I have spent over 25 years working on mechanical and electrical systems, especially power generation systems. Also, since I have family in Japan, I have spent several hundred hours refreshing and increasing knowledge on nuclear and radiation. I have a grasp of the situation.
At first when nuclear was starting to be promoted as “green” I thought that was cool, because nuclear is “cool”, it is the farthest reaches of our science, it is playing god, turning matter directly into energy. It is a Harley with a Turbocharger, that cool.
And only in old Russia would a problem get real severe, right?
Then I discovered just how poorly these plants were being run and how poorly they were designed from the get-go. And then I discovered how one of the basic premises of risk control, separation of risks, was completely ignored. That being that the used fuel rods were the most dangerous part of the plant, but for “convenience” the most dangerous things were stored right next too or even RIGHT ON TOP OF the reactors themselves.
This is done to conserve cost, if they were to ship off the rods to somewhere else, it would cost them money, however, they can just store them at their “approved nuclear facility” and thus just kick the can down the road — increasing current profits while increasing the potential disaster 100′s of times over.
THEN on top of that complete irresponsible behavior, the nuke operators also decided to not just stack the rods together with the original design spacing, but they decided to increase storage capacity by packing in the rods even tighter. What happens is that the closer they are, the…
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THEN on top of that complete irresponsible behavior, the nuke operators also decided to not just stack the rods together with the original design spacing, but they decided to increase storage capacity by packing in the rods even tighter. What happens is that the closer they are, the more the neutrons from one rod affect and “excite” the neutrons from adjacent rods, and that is the whole process of nuclear fission is that neutron excitement, the whole process of control of nuclear processes is control of the neutrons and the material spacing.
Well, so our nuclear scientists decided to stack the used rods even closer, and they ran some calculations that showed that if the spacing was smaller, and they used chemical laced water as a cooling fluid, along with a heat removal heat exchanger and an electrically operated pump to ensure continuous movement of the cooling water THEN all would be fine…they could run like that for decades until the used fuel “aged” became easier to deal with. IF all that occurred, and if it didn’t the used fuel pool would overheat, the water would boil off, and an uncontrolled nuclear reaction would occur, spewing forth even more deadly radiation than from the original nuclear fission process used to BOIL WATER.
When I found that out, I knew immediately that this whole industry has become corrupt and intellectually dishonest to the core so to speak. At Fukushima, they put the fuel tanks for the back up generators right on the ocean, probably for ease of refueling from a boat, but who cares the real reason, the bottom line is that very stupid decisions were made, and no one was effectively over seeing it.
Nuclear is too strong for humans, humans cannot be trusted with this toy. Over time, greed, economic downturns, periods of bad government, periods of industry regulator ‘capture’, natural disasters, aging facilities, and ignorance and denial, all lead to an OBVIOUS CONCLUSION. Nuclear will wipe out and mutate our species
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Thanks for your answer Misitu.
Surely it must be difficult to organize the contents.. especially since the news are coming so fast. But I think it must be possible to post reports that follow the issues up. Once again, I might be wrong, but I feel that we often catch a subject in its worst state.. and then loose the track of it when it turns out to be less dramatic than expected. I’m a bit simplistic here, but I hope you see what I mean.
Comments are very great to follow up an topic and discuss its reliability. But the discussions have a limited life because we quickly skip to the next news. A forum with several sections would also be a great way to follow the issues in times. But these are just suggestions.. and I know it’s a lot of work..
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@maax
The only thing wanted on this site is the truth and the facts of the matter. In my estimation, there is no such thing as “good” news related to nuclear power unless it be that plants are being decommissioned.
If we want twisted facts, lies and distortions (along with cute stories of puppies and frolicking children who can “high five” a TV anchor in a tornado disaster zone) we can go to the main stream media. The news will always sound happy there. So the kid has no place to live and is only five years old, he can still “high five”, therefore, it’s o.k. to forget him.
People who visit this site have coped for years with urgent news being ignored by the main stream media in favor of trivialization of “nice” news. God forbid we should come to that here.
I note that you and your loved one are from the two most nuclear power countries in the world. Your plants not only constitute a threat to your welfare but to us as well. We’ve had quite enough of nuclear power here and don’t want the problems caused by yours, thank you very much.
When this site starts telling me the “good” news and skips over the bad I will leave it forever.
By the way, has anyone noticed that all comments posted to this article but one were directed to maax and not to the topic?
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Maax,
if you scroll down an article, you have a section called “Related posts”. It’s a good way to follow events, as you see a list of older news talking about the same topic. If you read them starting from the oldest one, you can follow the story.
Unfortunately, I don’t think there are many subjects where the sequence is positive.
In June, I was attending a kind of ‘Occupy Wallstreet’ protest in Brussels, and at the end of the Public Assembly meeting, I took the microphone and told the 1500 folks there that protesting against the current economic system is good, but that it will be useless unless they fix, or at least cover the site to really control the radioactive releases in Fukushima.
About the good news, how about the ones about countries abandoning their plans of building reactors?
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“About the good news, how about the ones about countries abandoning their plans of building reactors?”
like them type of posts too!!
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Good news? We can all create ‘good news’. People are good. Animals are loving. Nature is beautiful. Love is a great thing.
I cannot in good conscience give you any ‘good’ news about nuclear power, nuclear weapons, nuclear plants, or nuclear operators/regulatory agencies, anywhere in the world.
What I have found by researching the worst accidents in depth, is that they universally deny, spin, cover up and minimize whatever happens.
If you had to deal with a person who chronically lied, and this company was building your house or educating children, or doing whatever else, would you ever do business with them again?
So here we have an entire industry that lies consistently about the most BASIC facts. Nuclear energy is NOT green. Nuclear energy is NOT safe.
What happens if an asteroid hits the Earth that causes HUGE tsumanis 300 feet tall? What happens if a HUGE solar storm hits the Earth and wipes out all electrical grids and burns out all electronics, as happened back in 1900? These things happen, regularly, every couple of hundred to thousands of years.
Now combine this with 400 nuclear power plants and what do you see happening? Good news? Happy people? Not…
We need to start thinking seven future generations into the future, and prepare for worst case scenarios, which DO Happen. A huge solar storm could hit earth next year and cause 400 nuclear power plants to melt down just like Fukushima..What happens after that? I do not want to be around for it.
If we switch to clean, green ZERO CARBON energy such as hydrogen power, solar power, wind energy, wave power, etc., we can get through major disasters without causing a radioactive global HOLOCAUST on top of the worst that Nature throws at us.
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@NoPrevarication
> The only thing wanted on this site is the truth and the facts of the matter. In my estimation, there is no such thing as “good” news related to nuclear power unless it be that plants are being decommissioned.
as I said, “good news” was probably not the right expression. What I meant is that it would be interesting to also mention the progress done, and any informations when the situation is getting better. As I said, I prefer to read improvements and “reassuring” news here than on the mainstream media, because I can trust that they are really real here. I think ENENEWS is indeed able to bring such kind of infos with a good criticism.. whereas I can’t expect an objective view from ordinary medias. As Misitu said, the nuclear industry put a lot of efforts to sway opinion in the direction to reassure people.. and the mainstream medias are only relaying the official declarations, without critical mind. So I think ENENEWS is precisely a good place to talk any kind of news and not only the most alarming ones.
> If we want twisted facts, lies and distortions (along with cute stories of puppies and frolicking children who can “high five” a TV anchor in a tornado disaster zone) we can go to the main stream media. The news will always sound happy there. So the kid has no place to live and is only five years old, he can still “high five”, therefore, it’s o.k. to forget him.
> People are good. Animals are loving. Nature is beautiful. Love is a great thing.
Don’t be so caricatured… I’m not saying I want to see cute stories with beautiful nature and lovely things.. Probably I explained myself not well. My English is limited and the term “good news” was not carefully chosen.
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> I note that you and your loved one are from the two most nuclear power countries in the world. Your plants not only constitute a threat to your welfare but to us as well. We’ve had quite enough of nuclear power here and don’t want the problems caused by yours, thank you very much.
this comment surprises me a lot… and I’m not sure to understand what you implied. Are French and Japaneses all responsible of their countries policy?
> By the way, has anyone noticed that all comments posted to this article but one were directed to maax and not to the topic?
yes.. I apologize for that. I mentioned at very first that I’m a bit off-topic. I didn’t expect so many answers. I would have posted my comment in an other place, but I couldn’t find a forum or an appropriate section. Sorry for monopolizing this subject
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hi maax
“this comment surprises me a lot… and I’m not sure to understand what you implied. Are French and Japaneses all responsible of their countries policy?”
although if you go up the food chain you get to the IAEA and associates but all tax payers are responsible in that it is their money that largely funds this trade! and indeed pays its nuclear/financial/legal/media shareholders too!! how “we ” get a voice over our tax dollars is hopefully getting underway as we speak..
just my opinion though
peace
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In France, the decision to turn toward nuclear energy was taken 40 years ago. Now the 2 main parties want to continue the same policy. I’m not saying we can do nothing to change that.. but please don’t take all the french and japaneses responsible for their countries’ policies..
And I was very ashamed when our president came in Japan after the nuclear accident to promote nuclear safety and at the same time the french EPR. We feel very sorry to put the whole world in danger with our nuclear plants. But is it useful to blame the japanese population for what they are suffering now?
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“But is it useful to blame the japanese population for what they are suffering now? ”
motivating activism isnt about the blame game… awareness of how our taves have been spent would kill nuclear dead… when all nuclear countries peoples become aware of just how badly theve been mislead then they will revolutionise (peacefully so far)… no blame just reality…
oh and obviously dont take indivdual posts or statements to heart to much here comments like yours evens the discusssion out nicely…been a really interesting thread this!! thanks maax
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Thank you arclight. And I agree with you.. awareness comes from the people.. and it’s up to us to change things up.
I didn’t expect the discussion to go that far when I wrote the fist post.. sorry
)
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Dear maax, I feel the same as you do. The people (yesterday the Russians, today the Japanese and tomorrow probably another nation) need our support, help and solidarity. It disturbs me a lot when some folks here behave as if it was the ordinary people’s “fault” that this happened.
That’s arrogant and doesn’t help noone.
The anti-nuke groups need more exchange of info and ideas on an international level, I think.
I’m glad you posted!
A+
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“The people (yesterday the Russians, today the Japanese and tomorrow probably another nation) need our support, help and solidarity. ”
yes.. such a spirit is much more constructive in my opinion. And I still wonder why the japanese (and worse, and single company!) is facing this problem almost alone.. whereas all the countries should bring their contributions and gather their efforts to fix this problem at Fukushima. It’s not their business only.. we are all concerned!
Thank you for your post.
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and lets not forget the forgotten victims of polygon in khazakstan on these lists…60 years on….
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maax, in which area of France do you live? I live “in the shade of Cattenom”….beast.
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I come from Grenoble.. in the alps. But now I live in Germany. I’m in a safe place.. 25 years ago, they ensured us that the french borders have the property to stop radioactivity.. so, no worry
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Ha! I’m glad you figured out the truth! wow. Reality redux with FukuDai.
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I still think we need a pull-tab (at the top, drop-down radio menu) for organizations that will help us to evacuate children to relatively, for the moment, less contaminated places than Japan. My Asian American studies professor brought up the point that maybe the Japanese are not asking for this (I’m a returning student). However, I think that I’ve seen some media that they are, in fact, asking for this. I just have no idea how to proceed or am not feeling ANY momentum around this logical concept of removing those most susceptible to the fallout immediately! I think I could help people connect here with people that would put up children from Japan; but I am not a big organizational specialist. Any ideas you or anyone else. Not trying to put anyone on the spot at all. I’m just throwing this idea out every once in a while to see what comes up. Still–an ENE’er, came up with a couple pretty good ideas. I just don’t trust the larger organizations though; but I might have to get over that.
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Dear Pallas, we saw a new poster here today – anntokyo (see Bianca Jagger thread). She’s Japanese and living in Japan. Maybe she could come up with ideas or share her thoughts on the subject.
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Dear Bread: Thank you very much.
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if your not careful letsbeco jebus is gonna come and pee on your post lol!
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lol Admin knows he has to take out the trash before Sam finds it….
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@Arclight I agree. Americans have much more access to the internet than other countries and could monitor the activities of the nuclear facilities in our states on a daily basis but we rarely do until something goes wrong. There is a measure of trust that people in the nuclear industry understand the importance of their actions.
Many Californians have forgotten the Lawrence Livermore lab even though we just had a couple of earthquakes right near Livermore just this past week.
For non-Americans this was an article Time magazine did back in 2008 about the security issues there.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0%2C8599%2C1739535%2C00.html
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Oh, the “security” issues around nuclear power, not sure if this is where you were going thelili (forgive me if not), are an utterly jingoistic and absolutely meaningless concern, since, of course, threats from little people are not real–except in the accidental sense. The most terrorist entities and individuals in all history are always those organized under the wealthiest states or in those states serving the most wealthy individuals and states with the largest militaries/covert/corporate apparatuses and this was the case when the church was the state, as well. The U.S. and Israel are currently the very most terrorist global threats and are behind, along with the UK and EU by proxy with strong MI5 involvement, most “terrorist” labeled incidents over the past 30 years, in particular. We better hope we gain purchase over and penetrate the tests of the fascist central leaderships very soon in terms of citizen dominance over covert org, military, government and corporate leaderships, so we can prevent these insane states (for billionaires short-term paranoiac security and profiteering goals)from pursuing some storyline involving planned nuclear incidents.
I do not personally believe that FukuDai or any domestic nuclear accident in the U.S. since were planned. However, It is certainly NOT off the table that the central powers would choose to pursue something along those lines considering the willingness to keep poisoning us through FukuDai emissions alone. Also, we can see the power elite have utterly lost their minds judging by the past 10 years of pursued and not resisted disaster capitalism and military/covert international expenditure on draconian adventures abroad by the U.S., coupled with increased aggression by fascist apartheid rogue state, Israel.
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@Pallas trust me when I say this. There are employees at Lawrence Livermore that
a) Have profound psychological problems
b) Have profound grudges against Lawrence Livermore Lab
My aunts have treated them at Summit. It is mandatory when their “stress levels” get too high.
There is a threat and it does not even come from outside.
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thelili not at all. I disagree wholeheartedly. The difference in “threat” is that the state daily is in the process of already doing the things that the little people dream of or would only be able to pull off on a small scale. It must be acknowledged that states, with there trillions of dollars of resources and their far more insane political structures, daily engaged in terrorism, are the bigger threat by an incalculable factor, logically.
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I’m not saying that little people can’t do ANY damage, please don’t misinterpret me. I’m saying the state is already doing, on a quotidien basis (has Fukushima not convinced you?), what little people cannot ever do logistically.
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@Pallas that is sort of an interesting thing you bring up. At any company that we are employees of we know that light and dark of the job and the employee issues but for some reason people seem to think that nuclear employees are somehow without stress or illness.
When cops or firemen stress out and go rogue and either harm bad guys without due process or firemen go mental and start fires to get attention we send them for treatment and forgive them(or not).
But for some reason people seem to think it is impossible for a nuclear worker to stress out and do something ill-advised.
Is that a part of the trust we have in nuclear workers? that they somehow are above stress and ruin? What do you think your neighbors would think of you now if you’d worked at Tepco? Ted Kaczynski worked at UC Berkeley as a professor for two years.
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Sorry for butting in – you can trust noone, not even at a Tepco meeting
http://mlfnk.tumblr.com/post/4258258358/too-soon
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Dear Bread: So true. I love the Burns reference!
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@Pallas, all Tepco is-is a bunch of little people joined together. They are those people that passively cooperated or actively cooperated. All it would take to get the truth is for “one” prominent Tepco worker to tell the absolute truth about what he did and saw as he worked there.
I understand what you are saying but my opinion is that it only takes one of anything to blow the lid off of something.
Differing opinions are a part of life
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@B&B this is a weird conversation. Everyone wants disclosure but is basically saying that we’ll never get it.
So should Enenews shut down because no one is reliable? Or is the thought that we’ll uncover some pertinent information somewhere?
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@thelili
“So should Enenews shut down because no one is reliable?”
Should Main Stream Media shut down because no one is reliable?
“Or is the thought that we’ll uncover some pertinent information somewhere?”
Thats why most of us are here….
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@Jebus I am asking WHY are you posting? To what end? You want to inform people that they have been lied to and will suffer for it.
They will find out
Then what?
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Hi thelilli, wow, you go off the rails REALLY easily
I think we stay here as long as Admin lets us and try to uncover some truths together….we’ve been quite good so far methinks…
The amount of info and news to be found here is incredible.
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“you go off the rails REALLY easily ” and lemmings explode!! lol
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..but only if they become really angry – and only in Norway, I heard!
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I have to throw that right back at ya..
Why are you questioning ENENEWS’s existance?
Why are you questioning these truth seekers intentions?
I am here because I want a future for my children, grandchildren.
I want to bring out the truth, so that the masses will be informed and can make the ultimate decision on nuclear power.
I refuse to roll over without a fight.
No one here wants the result to be grave. No one here wants to be irridated till the end.
No one here was given the choice for/against nuclear power.
No one here is happy with the outcome of Fukushima.
Everyone here wants to be informed about mitigating the effects of exposure.
In short, We are here because we care about life and the quality of life.
Why do you post here?
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B&B I do go off the rails easily because it is not a joke to me. Yakking endlessly is fine for some while there are people literally going to die in agony.
Do people forget that or is this whistling in the graveyard stuff? Arclight I am already dying of cancer so I already know what my explosion is about.
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thelili, it’s not a joke to any of us.
Some release their tension by flipping, some by ranting, some by joking.
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@Jebus I post here to remind people that this is not a media sensation joke that will pass.
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Is that what you get out of ENENEWS?
That it is a media sensation joke?
This is no joke lili, this is as real as it gets.
Shame on you for not realizing the human condition and the myriad ways that people deal with an extremly dangerous situation.
Not everyone deals with it the way that you do. Some have to crack a joke to cope.
If we all just dropped into the fetal position and cried, would that help?
If we all just ignored the truth and let the nuke industry, MSM, our governments take us to the edge, would that help?
Why do you think that OWS is global now?
People are fed up and are not going to take it anymore.
Even the lowly rat, fights for his life when cornered…
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Seeking truth is one thing actually DOING something is another.
Information is lovely the internet is filled with it.
So at the end of the day you have “imformed”
What one persons life has been extended or saved by what you have done today?
If the answer is zero then you are blowing hot air. That is my point. People that are actually bringing people here are my heros.
That is all.
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B&B right now I don’t believe that. I don’t believe that some of you are here to help. So I’ll be back when I do believe that people are here to help evacuate people rather than argue over the veracity of articles.
Later.
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Well, I think if Admin decides to open a new thread which headlines an article, it’s absolutely justified to discuss this very article…..
I might be totally wrong, though. Maybe I misunderstood the concept.
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Don’t go thelilli. Stay around. I appreciate your posts. Everyone brings something to the table and you never know when someone, who is new to the site, has a light bulb turn on and the penny drops oconcerning what is going on and then they learn what they can do to help in their matrix. I call it Informational Medicine and works in many ways, seen and unseen. This MLM of truth grows one person at a time. Stick around.
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agreed au
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Do not go away, friend. Believe me, I have been in this fog after Chernobyl and information from a friend helped me to do the right things in a right moment. Other people ignored his words and laughed. Many people here are speaking to people they know and considered crazy. They chose to become a laughing stock instead of using their energy for preparations for themselves. We are not so many of us here even with those who just read. Everyone matters!
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