“We’ve opened a door to hell” at Fukushima plant, and may never be able to close it — Radio Host: You mean that even with robots they don’t know where the 3 reactor cores are? (AUDIO)

Published: October 30th, 2013 at 8:41 pm ET
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Title: Discussing Fukushima
Source: Art Bell’s Dark Matter
Date: Oct. 29, 2013

Paul Gunter, nuclear power industry watchdog at Beyond Nuclear: We’ve got 3 reactors, the cores have left the vessel. They’ve burned through the bottom of the vessel. We don’t really know where they are, because the radioactive environment even fries robots that Tepco’s been trying to send in there. They have been sending very innovative robotic machinery and sensors in there to get a picture, to get a reading, and these things don’t return. We have opened a door to hell that cannot be easily closed — if ever. We’ve got those 3 cores that are melting, they could be somewhere in the concrete base mat burning their way through, they could have already burned through and entered into the ground. They hopefully have formed a huge solid ‘elephant’s foot’ of highly radioactive material.

Art Bell, host: You mean that even with robotic help, they don’t know where the cores are?

Gunter: Correct. We’ve got 3 molten cores that we don’t have a status report on.

Full broadcast for subscribers here (Now available on YouTube here)

Published: October 30th, 2013 at 8:41 pm ET
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51 comments

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51 comments to “We’ve opened a door to hell” at Fukushima plant, and may never be able to close it — Radio Host: You mean that even with robots they don’t know where the 3 reactor cores are? (AUDIO)

  • behappy1

    Gunter: Correct. We’ve got 3 molten cores that we don’t have a status report on.

    Thats kinda different then not knowing.

    They Know

    ? is , Why won't they talk?


    Report comment

    • soern

      "Gunter: Correct. We’ve got 3 molten cores that we don’t have a status report on."
      Actually we possibly have 4 meltdowns including sfp4s molten content.
      They lost one wall of sfp4 in March 2011 due to containing cooling water.
      Who should have rebuilt it in that circumstances?
      Nobody at all!
      Propanda mashine makes everybody to believe sfp4 was ok instead.
      Read hatric penry's documentations of documents if you like.
      Besides you cant cool down molten and fissioning fuel rods at all without seperating them to small pieces and dumping that pieces into water. This was impossible to do all the time and so all of sfp4 melted content went to be a big drop and fell down through all floors of RB4 and now ilikely is on the same way as that 3 other meltdowns.
      Concrete does not resist heat very much, as i experienced while drying a dungeon concrete floor with a tar burner some years ago.
      A tar burner is not that hot, but concrete sprincled and splattered away easily when its flame touched it.

      “We’ve opened a door to hell”
      That may occur or get visible when all 4 meltdowns will have met lava and afterwards will be thrown back to surface by magma/lava pressure some years ahead.
      And it is now visiblbe while watching pacific ocean beeing killed.
      Also you can see “We’ve opened a door to hell” while watching development of mankind since 120 years.
      Maybe “We’ve opened a door to hell” was done about 6000 years ago
      by telling mankind to be "Crown of Creation" – Obviously…


      Report comment

  • dosdos dosdos

    The cores have reached the environment. That is all that really matters. The cores are spread about, in the reactor vessel, under the reactor vessel, in pipes, throughout the building, under the building, scattered across the countryside. There are tendrils, globs, nuggets, tiny particles, dust, it's in all shapes and sizes and it's everywhere. Instead of asking where they are, people should be asking, where are the largest pieces of them?


    Report comment

    • Gasser Gasser

      The Doors: Light My Fire

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=e-qHDhb3qWQ

      ~~~~~~

      You know that it would be true
      
You know that I wouldn't be a liar

      
If I was to say to you
      
Our dosimeter's are reading higher

      Come on NRC, there's a Nuclear fire
      
Come on IAEA, it's a Plutonium fire
      
Going to set the World on fire.

      The time to culture hesitate is through 

      No time to wallow in the political mire 


      Try now, we better not lose 

      And our World become a funeral pyre

      Come on IAEA, there's a Nuclear fire 

      Come on NRC, it's a Plutonium fire 

      Trying to set the World on fire, yeah

      The time to money hesitate is through
      
No time to wallow in the secrecy mire 


      More than try, we can't afford to lose 

      And our World become a funeral pyre

      [Cont']


      Report comment

      • Gasser Gasser

        [Cont’]

        Come on World, it's a Plutonium fire 

        Come on World, it's an ELE fire 

        Going to set the Earth on fire, yeah

        You know that it would be untrue 

        You know that NRC would be a liar 


        If they was to say to you 

        Folks we can get radiation higher

        Come on sheepel's, buy that Atomic fire 

        Come on Tax payers, insure for a fire 


        Hoping not to set Cities on fire
        
Can't set the Earth on fire?

        You know that it's going to be true
        our World become a funeral pyre

        The Globe will glow Cobalt blue
        No one's alive to put out the fire

        What was recorded after was true
        That Man was a natural born lier

        Out of womb with vain's coursing blue
        No longer boiling water with a Carbon fire

        ~Gasser Classic~


        Report comment

        • Socrates

          Have you done Welcome to the Hotel Fukushima?


          Report comment

            • LOL!!! Here's a true story metaphor for things nuclear…

              I have a friend who is somewhat of an inventor, in addition to working with us occasionally as a clown/juggler. Years ago he created a product for jugglers he just knew was going to sell like hotcakes, gave us a set in a nice triangular box meticulously labeled "Great Balls Of Fire."

              Three wooden balls criss-crossed with lampwick. "You don't have to just fire juggle with torches anymore, you can do all the great ball tricks with flaming balls!" We looked at each other with wry smiles, and told him we wanted to see 'em in action.

              So he soaked the lampwick with lighter fluid and lit 'em up. He tried to be brave, juggling them faster and faster and faster until he finally had to let them drop, his hands nearly blistered. As I applied aloe to his burns, I suggested he might want to include a pair of asbestos gloves in the kit…

              They're still in their box, prominently displayed on a high shelf over the tap-wall of his very nice drinking establishment on the river. Right next to the no longer working Geiger low level detector. Conversation pieces for sure. §;o)


              Report comment

        • HoTaters HoTaters

          An oldy but goody.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhIt3fRC1og

          "So who needs Rudolph Steiner?" (the father of Waldorf education, biodynamic agriculture, and anthroposophical medicine.)

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolf_Steiner

          We must learn to create value and recreate our society and world, outside the current paradigm. There is no other way to survive what's coming.,


          Report comment

    • And the little pieces.

      Hot particles, and so on.


      Report comment

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    Fukushima: Health Propaganda Blitz
    Oct 30 2013

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/10/30/1251849/-Fukushima-Health-Propaganda-Blitz

    "Coming as it does in the midst of the last few months' worth of ever worsening conditions and increasing radioactive releases at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear facility, it isn't difficult to understand the purpose of this bit of reassuring fluff. It was written by David Ropeik, an instructor of risk perception and risk communication at the Harvard Extension School. Ropeik also created and directs a training program for journalists – Improving Media Coverage of Risk. Thus we begin with the understanding that Ropeik's subject of expertise is not radiation or the health effects of radiation exposures. It is the "management" of public risk perception."


    Report comment

  • dka

    sending electronic robots is silly.
    they have to send mechanical ones. A mechanical robot can be positioned behind a first one. If the first one fails, the one behind can mechanically make the first one move, pushing it forward and articulate it.
    They can create a chain of mechanical robots capable of few but sufficient moves, with each robot being capable to take over the robot in front of him (this way, even the last robot of the chain can control the first one in the line, using the intermediate robots in the chain if he has to).


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    • We Not They Finally

      Doesn't everything HAVE to be "electronic" for control signals and for feedbacks? Non-scientist here. Haven't a clue what you are suggesting or how it could possibly work.


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      • harengus_acidophilus

        No, why should it?

        "Doesn't everything HAVE to be "electronic"
        for control signals and for feedbacks?"

        Do it with hydropneumatics or simple wires. But one


        Report comment

        • harengus_acidophilus

          … one question for me:
          They have engineers there too. If they don't build a "stupid force hand" nor placing a series of mirrors to "get a look" …

          Think about it, they aren't idiots and they are doing virtually nothing, because there is nothing, what humans can do.

          h.


          Report comment

          • TEPCO is planning on 'saving money' soon… Newest reports are that TEPCO will be boxed up into tiny pieces, and once the decommissioning piece is alone and apart, the plan is to slash the budget of that, in order to 'save money'.

            They are projecting to make 1 BILLION this year in profits, despite this mega nuclear disaster.

            No wonder they are 4000 workers short, and using baling wire and duct tape.


            Report comment

  • rakingmuck

    I suppose everyone here is aware that the US and Japan are working new nuclear power contracts together which is how Japan secured Turkey. Well actually it was part of bigger agreement that allows Japan to be staging area for US drones in Asia. They are cooking up some interesting plans those two.


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  • rakingmuck

    I just have to add Abe is not even thinking of Fukushima. He is 100% focused on working with US and reactor co's to bring in over a couple trillion in the next year. Not even slightly on his mind.


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  • Wyakin Wyakin

    HOR- good link. Risk perception is the cornerstone of effective propaganda. Those who employ it disregard the bounds of the truth to the extent that what they report is merely science fiction.

    Ropeik’s “condescending flourish” is such science fiction.

    Gasser +100

    Yes RM, need to monitor that ongoing development.


    Report comment

  • TheBigPicture TheBigPicture

    N O T . W E

    Some nuts from the 40's started all this. And they talked naive politicians, such as President Eisenhower, into building nuclear plants.

    The rest of us didn't want nuclear crap, it's forced on us!


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  • MichaelV MichaelV

    We don’t really know where they are, because the radioactive environment even fries robots that Tepco’s been trying to send in there.

    They have been sending very innovative robotic machinery and sensors in there to get a picture, to get a reading, and these things don’t return. We have opened a door to hell that cannot be easily closed

    I agree, those cores are spread everywhere and are unrecognizable, but if there can be no observations nor any measurements then, there can be no events.

    We are in new territory….
    @gasser +1000000…!


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    • Tarangela Tarangela

      They are on their "Journey to the Center of the Earth" sans James Mason. Like most of you here I presume, I've been looking askance at this disaster from the beginning..and virtually no one around me, and this is a busy Govt Hospital with retirees, Dr.s of various sorts, just a large variety of people, has a clue. Surreal.


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  • Sickputer

    I have to hand it to Paul for the wordsmith quote of the year: "We've opened a door to hell".

    But I'd give him the award of the decade if he had used the word "They've" instead of "We've".

    Most of us had nothing to do with their devil work. We are victims…They are genocidal naked apes. And I know I wasn't descended from that branch of insane monkeys. They are made of a different type of protoplasm.


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  • J.

    A fine recent interview from Fairewinds reveals the astounding corruption and criminality in the US nuclear power industry. It's first-rate.

    http://fairewinds.org/podcast/let-games-begin

    When similar accidents occur in the USA, we'll know why.


    Report comment

  • Sol Man

    The cores of hell are loose and as such are seeking homeostasis with their new environment; they are diffusing. Nobody wants to say this. I don't blame them.


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  • many moons

    We didn't open the door to hell, we created hell, planted accesses all over the world and now hell is a part of our lives.


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  • PhilipUpNorth PhilipUpNorth

    "[Three molten cores] could have already burned through and entered into the ground."
    The nuclear lava was burning at 5000C as it exited the Containment Vessel.
    What is the chance that any of the three 100 tons blobs didn't also melt their way through the base mat and into the Earth?
    The total release from Fukushima Reactors1-3 is 690 quadrillion becquerels of cesium 137, which is a total 100% release. Not to mention a 100% release of all the other isotopes contained therein.
    http://enenews.com/nuclear-engineer-276-quadrillion-becquerels-of-cesium-137-estimated-to-have-seeped-into-water-that-fills-fukushimas-reactor-building-basements-triple-chernobyls-total-release-some-has-alr

    The public pressure to come clean about the present location of the molten nuclear fuel is about to reach the tipping point.
    The Fukushima Disaster will never be cleaned up.
    Nuclear power is finished forever.

    Where is the damn corium, eh, TEPCO? ;)


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    • Tarangela Tarangela

      Oh I think it's a certainty that those cores went through the base mat and have been making their way through the earth's crust since 2011. The water they are pumping to cool the cores, well, no one can tell for sure that the water is reaching the cores and cooling them at all. I'm a still-athletic 55, and have had a far better life as a female than most poor women in blighted countries. I'm not afraid of death (unless it was to be burned at the stake or something) But I have a little granddaughter. And a good, sensitive 22 year old son. So this debacle sickens me. I'm really afraid for them.


      Report comment

  • Heart of the Rose Heart of the Rose

    I see the shipping industry is getting a little nervous..and so they should.

    Shipping Unaffected by Fukushima Waste Leaking Into Sea: Bimco
    Oct 31 2013

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-31/shipping-unaffected-by-fukushima-waste-leaking-into-sea-bimco.html
    “Right now, if we can trust the reports we see, hear and get, shipping is not at risk. However, as the Fukushima accident has still to come to a stop, it still develops unfortunately.”

    “Bimco members were very alert and protected themselves when the accident happened back in 2011. We received a lot of requests back then. This time around, owners have dealt with it as a part of daily operations.”

    I wonder what precautions they took..were they advised and by whom.
    "


    Report comment

  • ftlt

    The Beast of 7 heads with 7 crowns and 10 horns…

    And IAEA is the number of the BEAST


    Report comment

  • bsgcic bsgcic

    I just thought of something regarding the issue of circuit boards, etc. within robots frying under too much radiation:
    Doesn't NASA, etc. have stuff that can withstand this? They are launching equipment into space, to mars, deep space probes, etc. Isn't there a lot of radiation in space that they have had to address?
    Of course, the amount of radiation within the reactor cores must be much much higher than that faced by the equipment in space (otherwise all the astranauts would have perished. But, they obviously must have had to look into operating equipment under higher degrees of radiation. (Of course the nuclear industry should have been looking into this too.)
    I guess it must be the orders of magnitude difference in the radiation.
    NASA just popped into my mind on this article.


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  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    No lead allowed..it's very toxic! :)


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  • obewanspeaks obewanspeaks

    But sucking down massive amounts of Radiation Contamination ..is very good for you!?!?! :(


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  • OldFool

    Bsgcic,

    You are absolutely correct. NASA does have radiation resistant electronics. For example, GaAs circuits would be much more radiation resistant. There some electronics that can take 1000 Sieverts and even 1000X higher than that. However, the robot's failure point would be the weakest commercial component. But US robots exploring Mars would still be more resilient than any robots made of commercial components. Japan has perhaps rejected some of these offers because it would make their own robot technology look bad – lose face again.


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  • Johnny Blade Johnny Blade

    I'm reminded of the vain attempts to use robots to enter torus rooms where the radioactivity was so high that the robots failed and TEPCO had to send in human liquidators to retrieve them??!! I wonder what has since happened to the poor souls who entered lethal areas to retrieve the failed,junk robots and where they are now & what they have to say about MANY things going on there??!! Are they even still alive? I have a feeling that many if not all of the public still sleepwalking through life think that there's some sort of robots able to perform the tasks that should've been undertaken 2+ years ago to defuse & stabilize Fukushima and/or all of the Fukushima's that are inevitable now since TPTB haven't learned a damned thing from 311 via their untamed,crap nuke technology since they unleashed it on the world alleging that long before their now-crumbling,30,40,50 year old NPP's would ever present a "problem" for the Earth's survival as a planet capable of continuing to sustain any kind of noteworthy forms of life(?)!! They never did & from the looks of where just ONE of their crap facilities in their vast,fatally-flawed infrastructure is taking ALL of us-THEY NEVER WILL! :( …..


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