Published: September 10th, 2012 at 2:20 pm ET
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Title: 20120831 UPLAN アーニー・ガンダーセン氏講演会
Published by: 77209088
Date: Aug 31, 2012
At ~1:04:00 in
Arnie Gundersen, Fairewinds Energy Education: The big concern then is what if there’s another large earthquake.
If there’s another large earthquake it is likely that the pool will crack and it is likely that the pool will drain and if that happens there is nothing that can be done to prevent fuel from burning.
Earthquake energy is measured in something called a gal.
The worst earthquake that can happen at Daiichi is about 600 gal.
But yet the building is only designed to withstand about 400 gal.
So the concern is that if a richter 7 were to hit the site, that would have enough energy to crack the pool in which case the fuel would catch fire and in which case we would be reliving March 11 all over again.
Published: September 10th, 2012 at 2:20 pm ET
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The Tokyo horndogs sure hate it when Arnie is right.
Maybe the concrete trucks are going to start really rolling…time for a new 30-foot concrete underliner at Unit 4.
They just have to pay the diesel bill first.
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Even stacked haybales underneath would be more effective than what TEPSCHMO is doing, still spinning more wheels building new "independent" PR teams and doing damage information control than actually scientificallY finding a solution to thEir problem as they topple Japan's once shining economy.
But I thought thAt if SPF4 goes, so does the world because of the plutonium inventory, so how is this a revisit of March 11? This is a Crime Against All Humanity and everything in the superpowers' superpowers needs to be bRought together to end this Cellular Slaughter called Ionizing Radiation!
Yet the US is so strangely silent and nonchalant…wtf
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Amen.
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Thanks again, Arnie… Cement Mixer…putzie putzie!
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worse the buildings at Fukushima are heavily damaged and thus structurally compromised,
I figure somewhere between 30-60% of the structural capacity is gone.
now a big strcuture like that is designed for 2.5X design load, and figure Design Load was rigged for Richter 6 quake,
so where as before they were designed for 400 Gals with Margin for up to 1000 Gals, now they are
at somewhere are 4-500 Gals.
That's the Total failure line, I would expect even 300 Gals to do a lot of damage and start chunks falling off or leaks in the pools and Unit 3 is heavily damaged it may not withstand any serious shaking.
So yeah, if we have a direct hit quake, it's toast there.
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agree with your assessment patb2009. Rather than expend available resources on shoring-up a seriously compromised structure, they need to get as much spent fuel out of those pools as they can. If it's not possible to access and/or handle the fuel bundles inside the SP4 pool, perhaps they'd need to determine if they can flood the substructure with cement. Of course, doing so will basically cut-off any chance of future access to the pressure vessel and (melted?) core.
I'm think'n it's time to put a couple of those tasty Kobe cows outside Unit #4, in hopes of drawing-in some benevolent alien help…
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SFP4 must be emptied entirely NOW! Aftershock and patb2009: You are so right about this. Time is awasting, and so is the structural integrity of Building4. No more weekends off, TEPCO. Bring in the Army, Japan. Work on this needs to be wrapped up before time and EQs overtake us!
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I agree that the SPF, all of them, should be emptied and placed into dry casks but I don't think it is feasible with all the debris which poses a great obstacle. New technologies need to be discovered to deal with this catastrophe. Everyone talks about SPF 4 but what about 3 and all the others. What a horrific mess.
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The new technology will have to neutralize radionuclides to stable forms…supposedly this already exists but the guy can't get the billions in funding he needs, blocked, as usual, by the corporate nuclear reptilians.
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7 quakes have been showing up in northern Japan recently!
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patb2009 I'd have to disagree a bit with:
"So yeah, if we have a direct hit quake, it's toast there."
I'd replace "there" with "here, there, and everywhere in the N. Hemisphere." Antipodeans can thank the Coriolis effect at least for now.
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We are still living 3-11.
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TEPCO got everyone focused on SFP4 because they knew that Building4 was cool enough to allow workers, while Buildings1,2,&3 remain too hot for workers. So now, they want to take out one or two new fuel bundles, and take a month to study them? TEPCO is taking weekends off? No effort has been made to empty SFP5&6? No effort has been made to empty the common SFP? The new crane structure project for SFP4 is being put off? The cofferdam and well project is being put off? The Common SFP seems to be steaming and smoking badly? TEPCO employees are over here telling the US Governement that Coriums1,2,&3 are still in the Buildings?
TEPCO, methinks you are experiencing worse problems at FUKU, and that you are not leveling with the public. TEPCO, what is really happening at Fukushima 1 right now???
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+311 PuN
Dang.. You summed it up well. Very depressing for everyone, but horrible for the poor Japanese people. Hardworking people destroyed by the nucleocrats.
Sayonara Japan…
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If the spent fuel pool in #4 fails it will be nothing like 3-11. In units 1-3 you have almost the same number of fuel bundles altogether as spent fuel pool #4 has. Units 1-3 have containment's that failed a certain amount, but most of the nuclear materials are still contained. For all the terrible releases into the air and water I would bet that over 95% of the fuel in these reactors is still somewhere within the plant.
If spent fuel #4 fails you have a pile of fuel with no containment at all. It will probably catch fire sending incredible amounts of radioactivity into the air. No humans,shielded bulldozers, or helicopters will be able to get within a half a mile of the fuel. Releases will make evacuation necessary for possibly hundreds of miles. including Tokyo. The fallout will be much worse than Chernobyl. And it might continue for a very long time.
The more I read about the first few days of the accident, the more certain I am that they uncovered the fuel in SFP #4 for days. If that is the case removing fuel will take years if it is possible at all.There is some reason why they are not moving fuel. I vote for Aftershock's idea to flood the substructure with concrete to strengthen the structure.
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couple things chrisk9: I'm impressed by your focus that it'll be far worse than 311 if SFP#4 goes into a burn-out condition. Given the quantity and condition of that repository, I'm curious as to why anyone would equate its contamination potential to 311. Perhaps the statement purposely guarded.
Regarding the flooding of the substructure with cement. I'd only advise such avenue if removal of the fuel rods is not possible. Should we someday have the means to do something about the coreums, I'd hate to think that access to them would be impeded knee-jerk solutions of this era. Much must be done to weigh the trade-offs between any of these so-called 'solutions'…
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Also wondered about the 3-11 equation, there mist be a purpose to be so guarded.
Certainly the first choice is to move the fuel, but don't think it's possible.
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Chrisk9,
Fuku is already scaled as a level 8 disaster.
And the spent fuel pool can withstand a 6 on the Richter scale, as is said.
I hope no EQ higher than 6 will ever hit Fukushima, but i know my hope is not realistic.
Keeping the JP EQ page open on another screen:
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/nied4maps-test
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i agree, it would be Fukushima on steroids, in Arnies language.
and it gives me PreTraumaticStressSydrome(PTSS) just thinking about it.
311 didnt make the entire site inaccessible, and possibly other nearby NPP's as well. must be hard to make a living understating the case and still scaring the bejesus out of anyone that cares to listen.
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Wasn't there an argument about the sarcophagus early on? I remember going verbally postal about this issue.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/19/us-japan-quake-chernobyl-sarcophagus-idUSTRE72I2UZ20110319
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Quake occurs every 5 minutes in Japan, on average.
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http://gen4.fr/2012/09/fukushima-tepco-nouvelles-fissures.html/2012-09-06_18h22_24/
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