AUDIO: US gov’t experts think melted fuel rods landed in water under Reactor No. 2, causing STEAM explosion — Pressure dropped dramatically at same time — Clear indications primary containment lost

Published: March 2nd, 2012 at 2:25 am ET
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Title: NRC’s Operation Center Fukushima Transcript
Source: NRC
Date: March 14, 2011
Emphasis Added

TONY ULSES: Yeah, there was some confusing information about that, but I think the bottom line is they’re not comfortable that they have containment for Unit 2.

JIM TRAPP: So they didn’t tell us it their X vessel, but what they did tell us kind of would lead you to that conclusion.

JACK GROB: Okay, so if I understand correctly, that’s your judgment based on what you heard.

JIM TRAPP: That, that’s correct.

[...]

JACK GROB: Hey,. guys, when you said “a loud sound”, what did you interpret that as?

TONY ULSES: It was my, I think both of us believe that one of the sources, that it wouldn’t — it wasn’t like the other two loud sounds with Unit 1 and 3 when the reactor building blew. You know, my guess is, and it’s just, it’s just pure conjecture, would be it was probably when the core went X-up.

[UNIDENTIFIED MAN:] And landing in the water under the vessel, it would have caused a little steam explosion.

JACK GROB: That, that’s what I heard you say. But what you think is that that was a steam explosion from the fuel going X-vessel, and we heard that containment at that point in time went from three atmospheres to one atmosphere.

JIM TRAPP: That makes sense.

TONY ULSES: Yep. It would.

[...]

JACK GROB: [...] Unit 2 is not in very good condition at all. It appears that core cooling has not existed for quite some time. It appears that the, the pumps that were injecting into the core have been deadheaded for some time. Several hours ago, there was a loud sound that appeared to come from inside the dry well, and at that time, the pressure inside primary containment went from three atmospheres to one atmosphere (essentially, atmospheric pressure). There is clear indication that primary containment is not intact, and there may also be indication that fuel, that there has been substantial core melt, and possibly even the loud sound in the breach of containment was caused by an X vessel fuel situation. That last bit of information cannot be confirmed at this time.

[...]

MARTY VIRGILIO: It’s really — this is Marty Virgilio — it’s really rapidly evolving now given the fact that, for Unit 2, it appears that we have the core X vessel and we don’t have a containment any longer. We’ve lost the primary containment. So what I’m going to suggest at this point is, if we can wrap this up because we have to get back to work [...]

Published: March 2nd, 2012 at 2:25 am ET
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33 comments to AUDIO: US gov’t experts think melted fuel rods landed in water under Reactor No. 2, causing STEAM explosion — Pressure dropped dramatically at same time — Clear indications primary containment lost

  • yogda yogda

    I have know this to be true all along. As well as many others here.
    We need those that withheld this information to be held accountable.


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  • PhilipUpNorth philipupnorth

    There was no sort of public announcement made, to allow people in the Tokyo area to shelter in place or go on vacation. Instead, a big spike of radiation happened while the kiddies are out on the play grounds. Shame, shame. Don't they have air raid sirens? The smoking gun will be transcripts from the Tepco – Government meetings on March 14, when the unit 2 situation was discussed, and it was decided not to put out a warning even though radiation was at lethal levels outside that unit. Oh, wait, those transcripts are missing, aren't they?


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    • StillJill StillJill

      Yes philipupnorth,….the dog ate them.


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      • HoTaters HoTaters

        Everything was written on 1" X 2" Post-It notes. And you know, there just wasn't much to report.

        We so regretfully report the ones that the dog didn't eat had faulty glue on the back of them. When the Recording Secretary stood up to leave the meeting, a mysterious draft came into the room and mysteriously blew them away into some mysterious place. Oh, but they didn't end up in the circular file, we know that much.


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    • Laterlukemayb Laterlukemayb

      Let's not forget folks that Japan suffered a catastrophic earthquake and tsunami. The days following Japan was near Harikari as the government was concerned. They were completely horrified and failed on the ability to control the situation in the most critical hours after the earthquake and tsunami. I'm sure that for them when the NPP's started popping off like fire crackers they were convinced the end of the world had arrived. It may well have, but we must try and understand the situation from their perspective. They are probably doing the best they can in light of the situation.

      Catastrophe's on this magnitude can have a great psychological impact on a population and it takes a little time to shake it off and pull it together. It's even harder when the population is dealing with a near defunct government that should have had a well planned strategy for an event such as this.

      Remember Katrina and those that were saved by taking shelter in the Saints stadium. What was a relatively short time for some seeing the situation at distance considering how bad it was, was forever for those in the middle if the disaster. Help couldn't come fast enough. You didn't hear the grateful cry's of people that had survived a devastating event but the angry shouts of people that just wanted to get to anywhere but there.
      What we are saying now on the site and forum is it has been a year since it happened. Where is the transparency and accurate data not just for the Japanese people but for the rest of the people in the world this event effects. Why the silence and misleading information. These are living breathing people we are talking about here and if they die as a result of lies they cannot be brought back!


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  • enoughalready45 enoughalready45

    ADMIN

    Hope all is going well with your ability to sleep and finish updates to this site.

    I'm eager to post my comments in the discussion section about attending the NRC's meeting in Michigan regarding the Palisades nuclear plant that occured on Wednesday.

    Good Luck


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  • NoNukes NoNukes

    Remember all the people who would argue that was fog last Spring?


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  • rebelgroove

    These pathetic fucks think 'protecting people and the environment' equals 'don't tell them anything.' Fucking monsters.

    And notice, friends, how they are absolutely unable to speak frankly; instead they use secret-nuke-speak that makes them feel like real men:

    'they're not comfortable that they have containment for Unit 2'; or, worse, this: 'it was probably when the core went X-up' meaning, in plain English, 'when the core blew up.'

    And these assholes are supposed to be protecting us.


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    • Whoopie Whoopie

      X10000000000000000 Grrrrrrrr


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    • HoTaters HoTaters

      rebelgroove, you should read the minutes from NRC meetings (if you haven't done so). It would make your head spin. Transcripts from the meetings are available online.

      It's like some of the people at the NRC speak a language where nothing is certain and everyone is afraid to make a clear statement or an assertion.

      Laughable. If it wasn't so deathly serious, it would make a great comedy show for television, or the stuff of a movie script. Maybe it's time for someone to write a sendup of the NRC.


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  • Whoopie Whoopie

    Fukushima 3.11: after 1 year | Photo Exhibit
    This event is open to the public with photo ID.
    https://www.nyu.edu/ipk/events/225
    Mar 8, 2012 3:00 PM – 5:00 PM
    20 Cooper Square, 5th Floor, Gallery Space


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  • entropy

    They seem to be releasing what has been happening in small spoonfuls. I am curious of how much radiation is being released in that steam. Why is that not mentioned?


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  • gottagetoffthegrid

    quote
    it's really rapidly evolving now given the fact that, for Unit 2, it appears that we have the core X vessel and we don't have a containment any longer. We've lost the primary containment.
    unquote

    this is a very important conclusion, and one that has been kicked around here for the last year or so.

    a quick translation:
    1) the core melted and burnt thru the RPV ("core is X-vessel")
    2) the core has burnt thru the concrete and steel floor of the CV ("lost the primary containment") and is in the ground.

    the bang could have also been the RPV popping like a balloon, or more appropriately, like a can of spray paint tossed in a campfire.


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    • HoTaters HoTaters

      Hi gottagetoffthegrid,

      The NRC had reported if any of the cores went ex-vessel "that would be the worst case scenario." Enenews had an article quoting that statement here, several months ago.


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  • HoTaters HoTaters

    The statement might have appeared in the private NRC e-mails. I think that was posted here. If not, it might have been at Enformable.

    They (the NRC & co.) were all involved in a giant international CYA campaign at the time.

    If you haven't read the scanned images from those e-mails, it's another good read.


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  • HoTaters HoTaters

    [UNIDENTIFIED MAN:] And landing in the water under the vessel, it would have caused a little steam explosion.

    JACK GROB: That, that's what I heard you say. But what you think is that that was a steam explosion from the fuel going X-vessel, and we heard that containment at that point in time went from three atmospheres to one atmosphere.

    Atmospheic pressure dropping from three atmospheres to one atmosphere …. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't that cause more than a "little" steam explosion in a reactor weighing many tons? We're talking about HUGE machines, and they make it sound like a little steam fart.

    I'm not a physicist. Maybe someone who has studied physics can comment on this.

    http://www.wfu.edu/physics/demolabs/demos/avimov/bychptr/chptr4_matter.htm

    I like this illustration (see the website):

    "The air pockets in jet-puffed marshmallows will expand in a vacuum. This makes the marshmallow man get bigger as the pressure inside the bell jar gets lower."


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  • BreadAndButter BreadAndButter

    Lol, at first glance I misread that guy's name as "Tony Useless". Maybe not too far off the mark.


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  • dave14139

    Called that a long time ago. Was Clearly a pressure release event.


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  • sschu

    Hope I have this correct:

    Unit 1 – explosion is deflagration, sub sonic
    Unit 3 – explosion is detonation, super sonic
    Unit 2 – melt thru, loud boom, steam explosion

    Why the differences in the nature of the failure? Is it:

    Unit 1 – hydrogen explosion due to fuel cladding melt?
    Unit 3 – Mox goes critical? Hydrogen explosion then Mox criticality?
    Unit 2 – the primary containment contained, but corium meted thru the bottom?

    Why didn't all the reactors fail in a "similar" way?

    sschu


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    • Because they all failed at their own speed and in their own ways. You'll have this. Unit 1 failed basically along the foreseen parameters per the simulations done from a mockup meltdown staged at Oak Ridge some years ago. Complicated by the containment pressure lifting the head so the seal was broken and gas vented straight to secondary containment instead of out the stack. Unit 2 suffered a break in the containment-to-torus piping early on, possibly due to the earthquake. When corium got into the containment it took "the easy way out" and caused mostly steam (some hydrogen) explosion when it hit the water in the torus. At/below ground level. Unit 3 most likely suffered core explosion. Not supercriticality, but the explosion originated in the core and shot it out the top big time. So there's not much corium underneath it at this point, if any.

      Meltdowns/blow-ups can happen along a number of scenarios. They have in common the fact that if you've got no systems, you can't tell it what to do and you can't stop it from doing its own thing.


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  • a female faust a female faust

    according to Gundersen, @ was in fact a <em>detonation</em> — not vented in time — and so since it was unvented the pressure blew it <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ekvqLjdThk&t=1m25s"><em>worse</em></a&gt; — and the engineering studies for the type of reactor indicate its propensity to blow <em>downward*</em> — it was considered a flaw — probably because of the design, which effectively <a href="http://enenews.com/gundersens-latest-fairewinds-60-holes-bottom-fukushima-type-reactors-make-core-melt-easier-fuel-only-thin-pipe-video">amounted</a&gt; to 60 or so pre-made easy-access breach points where the metal rods cladding fuel are inserted …

    *still searching 4 this pdf, sorry


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  • a female faust a female faust

    lets have those links again:

    "according to Gundersen, @ was in fact a DETONATION — not vented in time — and so since it was unvented the pressure blew it (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ekvqLjdThk&t=1m25s) WORSE — and the engineering studies for the type of reactor indicate its propensity to blow downward* — (it was considered a flaw )– probably because of the design, which effectively amounted to 60 or so pre-made easy-access breach points where the metal rods cladding fuel are inserted ..(http://enenews.com/gundersens-latest-fairewinds-60-holes-bottom-fukushima-type-reactors-make-core-melt-easier-fuel-only-thin-pipe-video)

    *still searching 4 this pdf, sorry"

    oh and, about #2, thats the one where the fuel was SEEN outside the building httl://tinyurl.com//itgotout


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  • Ganxet Ganxet

    i agree whoopie. why don't we work all together to take out nukes from our lives?
    In Catalunya, where i life, NP is about 20%. How can we reduce it?
    Each of us must think about reducing power consumption by 20%?
    can we use only green power companies?


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